G
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They could win every home game by flooding the place, turning it into a mud pit and playing Woody Hayes football. Then the caste lackeys of the drunk white media could spin this as revolutionary.
Vince Young
- Thread starter a-train
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whiteathlete33
Hall of Famer
Jimmy I have to disagree with you on this one. Young had a good season. It wasn't great by any means or anything spectacular but pretty solid. With that being said I could name you twenty qb's in the NFL that are better than Young. Here are at least 22 : Tom Brady, Drew Brees, Marc Bulger, David Carr, Jay Cutler, Jake Delhomme, Brett Favre, Matt Hasselback, Matt Leinert. Peyton and Eli Manning, Matt Moore, Kyle Orton, Carson Palmer, Brady Quinn, Philip Rivers, Aaron Rodgers, Big Ben, Tony Romo, Matt Ryan, Matt Schaub, and Kurt Warner. The list can go on and on.
Jimmy Chitwood
Hall of Famer
wa33, you prove my point for me!
how can someone be "good" and be in the bottom 3rd of a list?as i said, Young had a good season "for him." he had a moderate to poor season for any White quarterback, and as i alluded to, there have been White quarterbacks who put up similar numbers, won the Super Bowl, and lost their jobs at the end of the year. so how is it a "good" season?
only if the standards used to measure black performance are different than those used to measure White performance could he be called "good," in my opinion.
how can someone be "good" and be in the bottom 3rd of a list?as i said, Young had a good season "for him." he had a moderate to poor season for any White quarterback, and as i alluded to, there have been White quarterbacks who put up similar numbers, won the Super Bowl, and lost their jobs at the end of the year. so how is it a "good" season?
only if the standards used to measure black performance are different than those used to measure White performance could he be called "good," in my opinion.
whiteathlete33
Hall of Famer
I never said Young was good. I said he had a good season which is a big difference. Everyone gets a lucky break sometimes.
Jimmy Chitwood
Hall of Famer
wa33, i'm not trying to argue with you. i'm just pointing out that if a White quarterback put up similar numbers to Young, even if he won the Super Bowl, he'd get fired ... as happened to Trent Dilfer in Baltimore in 2000-01.
both quarterbacks were "game managers" whose teams won (at least Baltimore did) with a dominant running game and a powerful defense. Baltimore went on to win the Super Bowl and only lost one game that Dilfer started. Tennessee missed the playoffs and lost 3 games that Young started. Dilfer was fired forhaving a"terrible" season, while many people insist Young had a "good" season.
let's compare their stats for the respective seasons...
Young: 12 games (10 starts); 58.7% completion; 1,879 yards; 10 touchdowns and 7 interceptions; 8 fumbles (2 lost)
Dilfer: 11 games (8 starts); 59.3% completion; 1,502 yards; 12 touchdowns and 11 interceptions; 8 fumbles (2 lost)
so, i'm confused as to what makes Young's season "good." the scenarios seem to indicate that Young should be fired ...Edited by: Jimmy Chitwood
both quarterbacks were "game managers" whose teams won (at least Baltimore did) with a dominant running game and a powerful defense. Baltimore went on to win the Super Bowl and only lost one game that Dilfer started. Tennessee missed the playoffs and lost 3 games that Young started. Dilfer was fired forhaving a"terrible" season, while many people insist Young had a "good" season.
let's compare their stats for the respective seasons...
Young: 12 games (10 starts); 58.7% completion; 1,879 yards; 10 touchdowns and 7 interceptions; 8 fumbles (2 lost)
Dilfer: 11 games (8 starts); 59.3% completion; 1,502 yards; 12 touchdowns and 11 interceptions; 8 fumbles (2 lost)
so, i'm confused as to what makes Young's season "good." the scenarios seem to indicate that Young should be fired ...Edited by: Jimmy Chitwood
whiteathlete33
Hall of Famer
I expect him to struggle next season.
ToughJ.Riggins
Hall of Famer
JC, I'm going to have to disagree with you partially on this one. Dilfer won the Superbowl as a game manager with virtually identical efficiency to Young WITHOUT ANYWHERE NEAR YOUNG'S SCRAMBLING ELEMENT. Dilfer should not have been fired btw.
I will check later when I have time, but I think I recall that Eli Manning not only didn't eclipse 60% completion rate in the year prior to winning the Superbowl, BUT ALSO at least once since then and he has better receivers than Young. He is now the highest paid QB in the NFL even though he shouldn't be. Yeah, I'd take Manning over Young because he's more consistent, has a longer YPA because of more accuracy on long throws and doesn't start to spin into depression like Vince Young has when the game goes sour.
My point is if Vince Young plays like he did this season all year next year he's at least an average starting QB because of his scrambling ability. I'm a big fan of Tim Tebow and I'd predict a very similar completion percentage from him in the NFL if he played for the Titans with their below average receivers. And Tebow has similar running ability...but two differences...
1. Tebow is a bit more accurate on long throws
2. Tebow has a MUCH better emotional maturity and a supreme study/work ethic.
Result, if I were a GM I'd take Tebow over Young!
WA33, there are some guys on your list that I'd take Young over if he were to play like he did this year all year next year. I'll have to make my own list, but I'm damn sure I can find at least 10 starting white QBs and probably a few more in the league that I'd take as a QB over Young. The difference is that Young will get far more endorsements than most of the melanin challenged guys, I just want this damn league to be fair!!
I will check later when I have time, but I think I recall that Eli Manning not only didn't eclipse 60% completion rate in the year prior to winning the Superbowl, BUT ALSO at least once since then and he has better receivers than Young. He is now the highest paid QB in the NFL even though he shouldn't be. Yeah, I'd take Manning over Young because he's more consistent, has a longer YPA because of more accuracy on long throws and doesn't start to spin into depression like Vince Young has when the game goes sour.
My point is if Vince Young plays like he did this season all year next year he's at least an average starting QB because of his scrambling ability. I'm a big fan of Tim Tebow and I'd predict a very similar completion percentage from him in the NFL if he played for the Titans with their below average receivers. And Tebow has similar running ability...but two differences...
1. Tebow is a bit more accurate on long throws
2. Tebow has a MUCH better emotional maturity and a supreme study/work ethic.
Result, if I were a GM I'd take Tebow over Young!
WA33, there are some guys on your list that I'd take Young over if he were to play like he did this year all year next year. I'll have to make my own list, but I'm damn sure I can find at least 10 starting white QBs and probably a few more in the league that I'd take as a QB over Young. The difference is that Young will get far more endorsements than most of the melanin challenged guys, I just want this damn league to be fair!!
Young's stats projected out for a full season starting are 16 TD passes and around 3,000 yards. That's well below average, and then throw in the 7 picks and 8 fumbles projected over a full season, and it's wretched for any White QB. And that was his best season! His previous highs were 2,546 yards and all of 12 TDs. For his career he has 32 TD passes and 39 interceptions. 32 TD passes is an average season for the best White quarterbacks, not a career total. And to make a comparison, Brett Favre, constantly maligned for his interceptions, has 317 picks to 497 TD passes.
Young can run, but that will continue to diminish each season, just as it has for McNabb, Culpepper and other black QBs. Much as it would like to, the NFL has yet to figure out a way for its "affletic" quarterbacks to dominate. The occasional nice run will continue to make highlight reels and be oohed and aahed over by the White clowns at ESPN and the NFL Network, but the end result of not having accuracy and the ability to read defenses is mediocrity at best, even against the NFL's lousy defenses. Let's remember again that Young had everything going for him this season, including the league's best runner, a top offensive line, and strong effort out of the same players who quit on Kerry Collins. The real story with the Titans this year is how they completely quit in the first half of the season after being so good last year.
Young can run, but that will continue to diminish each season, just as it has for McNabb, Culpepper and other black QBs. Much as it would like to, the NFL has yet to figure out a way for its "affletic" quarterbacks to dominate. The occasional nice run will continue to make highlight reels and be oohed and aahed over by the White clowns at ESPN and the NFL Network, but the end result of not having accuracy and the ability to read defenses is mediocrity at best, even against the NFL's lousy defenses. Let's remember again that Young had everything going for him this season, including the league's best runner, a top offensive line, and strong effort out of the same players who quit on Kerry Collins. The real story with the Titans this year is how they completely quit in the first half of the season after being so good last year.
whiteathlete33
Hall of Famer
Yes but ToughJ claims he would take Young over some of the 20 quarterbacks that I listed above. Young is no where near the level of any of those guys and never will be.
ToughJ.Riggins
Hall of Famer
"Tom Brady, Drew Brees, Marc Bulger, David Carr, Jay Cutler, Jake Delhomme, Brett Favre, Matt Hasselback, Matt Leinert. Peyton and Eli Manning, Matt Moore, Kyle Orton, Carson Palmer, Brady Quinn, Philip Rivers, Aaron Rodgers, Big Ben, Tony Romo, Matt Ryan, Matt Schaub, and Kurt Warner"
Out of this list, I'd say Bulger has been struggling mightily and is a has been..David Carr might be a slightly better passer, but Young would give his team a slightly better chance to win with his running ability if he plays at the level of this season next year, Matt Leinart hasn't shown me enough in the NFL to say he's better than Young, Kyle Orton= a very close call so I'll wait until half way through next season to decide. Hasselback is struggling and is getting older now, but part of his struggles is the receiver problem in Seattle that could be solved by Hass so I'll give you a non vote on that until half way through next season. Delhomme declined and doesn't start anymore, so I'd take Young over him now. All your other guys- even Brady Quinn and Matt Moore with the way they played at the years' end showing "upside"- I'd take over Young.
WA33, I bet I could find a couple other guys for you other than your list that I'd take over Young...actually I'd probably take Chad Henne over young because he showed lots of upside in some games this year, but it's a close call. WA33, name em and I'll play GM and pick my starter! I guess my analysis indicates that Young is a very average starting QB so I probably talked him up a bit too much.
Out of this list, I'd say Bulger has been struggling mightily and is a has been..David Carr might be a slightly better passer, but Young would give his team a slightly better chance to win with his running ability if he plays at the level of this season next year, Matt Leinart hasn't shown me enough in the NFL to say he's better than Young, Kyle Orton= a very close call so I'll wait until half way through next season to decide. Hasselback is struggling and is getting older now, but part of his struggles is the receiver problem in Seattle that could be solved by Hass so I'll give you a non vote on that until half way through next season. Delhomme declined and doesn't start anymore, so I'd take Young over him now. All your other guys- even Brady Quinn and Matt Moore with the way they played at the years' end showing "upside"- I'd take over Young.
WA33, I bet I could find a couple other guys for you other than your list that I'd take over Young...actually I'd probably take Chad Henne over young because he showed lots of upside in some games this year, but it's a close call. WA33, name em and I'll play GM and pick my starter! I guess my analysis indicates that Young is a very average starting QB so I probably talked him up a bit too much.
Bear Backer
Mentor
There are only 3 white starting caliber QB's that I would not rather have than Radio at this point. I would take him over Bulger because Bulger has always been borderline as a true franchise QB, and now seems to be on a terminal decline. Hasselbeck, who is also looking like he is declining and Jake Delhomme who likewise looks like his days as a starter are over. In each case, all 3 were at one time exponentially better QB's than Radio will probably ever hope to be, but age and injuries have started to take their toll.
Jimmy Chitwood
Hall of Famer
Tough, i just don't know where you're coming from, man. other than being a decent scrambler, Young has nothing in his past to indicate he will ever be even adequate as a starting NFL quarterback.
you "disagree" with the facts i presented, yet didn't show any facts that refute those i used to form my position. if you will kindly show me some facts that refute those i've shown, i'll be happy to examine them.
until then, your supporting of Young is just an obvious attempt to "be moderate" and support a black afflete who doesn't deserve it.
you "disagree" with the facts i presented, yet didn't show any facts that refute those i used to form my position. if you will kindly show me some facts that refute those i've shown, i'll be happy to examine them.
until then, your supporting of Young is just an obvious attempt to "be moderate" and support a black afflete who doesn't deserve it.
ToughJ.Riggins
Hall of Famer
I have been very busy lately so I don't have time to do a full statistical analysis. But I have looked at lots of QB stats each year and there are some QBs that are currently respected that have had recent seasons or even this season below 60% completion rate. Add to that the fact that Young has had a great record as a starter this year and finally has a solid TD to INT ratio and can make big plays with his legs. I'll call him an average starter who can win some playoff games in Tennessee. I never said he's a franchise QB or even a permanent solution for Tennessee to attempt to win a Superbowl, just that he's played solid and his team has been very competitive with him...geez what's the big deal.
JC, if you want to refute my position with "facts" if you have the time which I don't- why don't you list Young's rank amongst guys who have started 8 games or more this year in QB rating, completion percentage, passing yards per game, rush yards per game, probably should include Yards per carry, total TDs, passing TD to INT ratio, YPA, winning percentage as a starter. This is something I would do if I wrote sports for a living. I bet you Young's composite average rank in all categories would average somewhere in the middle of the pack, plus the Titans are winning. Yeah I agree the Titans would probably do better to draft McCoy or Tebow who are even better "dual" threats than Young.
They won't do this and with the current options Tennessee has Young would probably be playing even without a caste system over Collins right now since he was a high draft pick for them after coming off a BCS championship. Collins is getting old and is a journeyman and the team did better with Young this year although there could be some truth to the some brothas playing with more passion for him.
JC, if you want to refute my position with "facts" if you have the time which I don't- why don't you list Young's rank amongst guys who have started 8 games or more this year in QB rating, completion percentage, passing yards per game, rush yards per game, probably should include Yards per carry, total TDs, passing TD to INT ratio, YPA, winning percentage as a starter. This is something I would do if I wrote sports for a living. I bet you Young's composite average rank in all categories would average somewhere in the middle of the pack, plus the Titans are winning. Yeah I agree the Titans would probably do better to draft McCoy or Tebow who are even better "dual" threats than Young.
They won't do this and with the current options Tennessee has Young would probably be playing even without a caste system over Collins right now since he was a high draft pick for them after coming off a BCS championship. Collins is getting old and is a journeyman and the team did better with Young this year although there could be some truth to the some brothas playing with more passion for him.
WHITE NOISE
Mentor
Well if you put AHDIW's performance up against Duh Mucous and Short Wave Radio in Washington, then yes, he had a "good season"Throw in some Pat(wish he was) White numbers in the mix and AHDIW is one of the elite black quarterbacks in the league.
Edited by: WHITE NOISE
Edited by: WHITE NOISE
ToughJ.Riggins
Hall of Famer
JC, the above way to rank Young wouldn't be perfect because some areas are more important than others so you'd have to divide by an importance quotient per stat that adds to 1 total before averaging the rank if I recall my calculus class. It would give us a rough idea though of how he measures up I think.
ToughJ.Riggins
Hall of Famer
I should have said multiplied by an importance factor per stat that averages to 1.0. and then average the rank out. It is easier to use multiplication so you don't have to take the reciprocal. Edited by: ToughJ.Riggins
ToughJ.Riggins
Hall of Famer
And when it comes to intangibles which are hard to measure it doesn't appear Young has a good work ethic or EQ.
Rocky, too Report: Titans' Young prime suspect in assault case
Fox SportsPRINT EMAIL RSS ADD THIS 3 comments »Updated Jun 13, 2010 3:44 PM ET
Tennessee Titans quarterback Vince Young could be in some trouble in Dallas.
Young is considered the prime suspect in an assault at a Dallas strip club Saturday night. The assault left one person injured, according to CBS station KTVT.
The Dallas Police Department said no warrant has been issued, but Young is the main suspect in the case.
A fight allegedly broke out after an exchange of words at the Club Onyx strip club in Dallas.
The Houston native and former University of Texas standout will start his fifth season with the Titans in the fall.
Let's see if he gets the Roethlisberger treatment.
Fox SportsPRINT EMAIL RSS ADD THIS 3 comments »Updated Jun 13, 2010 3:44 PM ET
Tennessee Titans quarterback Vince Young could be in some trouble in Dallas.
Young is considered the prime suspect in an assault at a Dallas strip club Saturday night. The assault left one person injured, according to CBS station KTVT.
The Dallas Police Department said no warrant has been issued, but Young is the main suspect in the case.
A fight allegedly broke out after an exchange of words at the Club Onyx strip club in Dallas.
The Houston native and former University of Texas standout will start his fifth season with the Titans in the fall.
Let's see if he gets the Roethlisberger treatment.
whiteathlete33
Hall of Famer
No warrant issued as of yet huh? I'm guessing the idiot was "making it rain" at the strip club.
Paleocon
Guru
Looks like Young will be charged with assault.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5282771
I assume with video evidence Goodell will suspend him. With Vince Young "winning" so many games for the Titans I have no idea how they will manage without his 13 completions per game.
After four seasons in the NFL Vince Young has fewer touchdowns (44, this is passing and rushing combined) than games played (45). However, he does have more turnovers (47, interceptions and fumbles lost) than games played.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5282771
I assume with video evidence Goodell will suspend him. With Vince Young "winning" so many games for the Titans I have no idea how they will manage without his 13 completions per game.
After four seasons in the NFL Vince Young has fewer touchdowns (44, this is passing and rushing combined) than games played (45). However, he does have more turnovers (47, interceptions and fumbles lost) than games played.
whiteathlete33
Hall of Famer
AHDIW will never be a good quarterback in the league. Despite what I said that he had a good season last year he only had 10 touchdowns to 7 interceptions. That's nothing special.
Van_Slyke_CF
Mentor
Whether Vince Young gets into trouble and suspended in this assault case doesn't make much difference to me. The most important thing is for him to get back on the field and flop in a bunch of games next season so the team will have to finally admit that their super-afflete can't play QB in the NFL, like most of Young's brothers.
Deadlift
Hall of Famer
He apologized, so it's "all better" now...
Thrashen
Hall of Famer
Young apparently assaulted this guy simply because he was mocking Texas University by making the "hook em' horns"Â sign with his fingers and pointing them downward ("down with Texas"Â). This rather serious offense (second only to rape and murder) obviously warranted the lame beating which was administered by Young. The advanced cognitive ability of African millionaires continues to dumbfound psychological experts.
As Van Slyke mentioned, I also hope he receives no official punishment from the NFL"¦after all, black quarterbacks cannot humiliate themselves unless they are on the field come Sunday.
http://www.hotcappers.com/vince-young-hook-em-horns/
As Van Slyke mentioned, I also hope he receives no official punishment from the NFL"¦after all, black quarterbacks cannot humiliate themselves unless they are on the field come Sunday.
http://www.hotcappers.com/vince-young-hook-em-horns/
whiteathlete33
Hall of Famer
Anyone know the race of the victim?