Young Players

[BlowingBubbles]

Hey guys, I'm new to the site, and I'm not sure yet if I agree with the
whole belief in a caste system in sports, but I for me the best argument
that it exists, is soccer. Here's a sport that requires speed and athleticism
first and foremost, yet it is far from being dominated by blacks even
though they're said to exibit these qualities more than whites. While
arguably the 2 best players in the world now are black (Ronaldihno and
Thierry Henry), if you look at the best young players around the world,
they are almost all white.

You can go from Wayne Rooney (age 21) from England to Lio Messi (19,
Argentina), Christiano Ronaldo (21, Portugal), Frank Ribery (23, France),
Cesc Fabregas (19, Spain), Fernando Torres (22, Spain), Lukas Podolski
(21, Germany), this is great news for not just soccer fans but sports fans
around the world.

 

[C Darwin]

To mention the best football players in the world, and not mention
Miroslav Klose is suspicious.

 

[sunshine]

Cannavaro was regarded as the best player of 2006. . He is now playing for Real Madrid. His form has been a touch off but understandable after the World Cup. Will be back in form for sure.

 

[devans]

BlowingBubbles - There's a Soccer Team in London (West Ham United) whose fans always sing "I'm forever blowing bubbles" as a kind of club anthem.


Coincidence?

 

[BlowingBubbles]

BlowingBubbles - There's a Soccer Team in London (West Ham United) whose fans always sing "I'm forever blowing bubbles" as a kind of club anthem.


Coincidence?


 

Not at all sir! I was born about 10 miles east of London and moved to St Paul when I was 8 but I've been a West Ham supporter all my life.

 

[devans]

Did you know that Sylvester Stallone was at the Everton game on Sunday and seemed to be enjoying it. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/6261167.stmBoth Goalkeepers in the Match were American.


I would rate Christiano Ronaldo, ahead of Ranaldinho at the moment, but I agree Thierry Henry is an exceptional telent.

 

[nhl411]

yeah, i've seen ronaldinho play ALOT and hes never really impressed me, yeah he can make an absolutely ridiculous play everynow and then but it seems like he disappears constantly..i agree henry is very good though i still wouldnt necessarily say hes the best in the world..certainly though whites dominate this sport all over the world, surely a sign that were not slow and lumbering like everyone seems to think

 

[OC football]

Are the best young English players white? I had heard that most are black. Or maybe its just that the most "promising" are black.

 

[BlowingBubbles]

Are the best young English players white? I had heard
that most are black. Or maybe its just that the most "promising" are black. [/
QUOTE]
I'd say its pretty split. There are some good black guys coming up like
Aaron Lennon and Theo Walcott (who both look mixed if its any
consolation), but Rooney's much better than both of them. Other than
Rooney, I really like this guy Dean Ashton who plays for West Ham. He's
young (23), and unlike any of these other guys he's got size (6'2''), but still
has great ball control for someone that big. He's been injured this entire
season, but he should play lots for England once he gets back, and I think
he, not Walcott, will be the guy who starts at striker alongside Rooney for
England in the next world cup and beyond.

 

[Tired old White]

I am not a soccer fan but after watching several of the world cup games it appears to me that there is very little time in soccer game where the players are not running versus sprinting and then resting as happens in American football. It would seem to me that endurance not sprint speed would be a factor in soccer. Thus blacks wi=ould be under represented becasue while they may have an advantage in running short sprints they usuually lack the endurance that white atheletes possess? Some one please correct my reasoning if I am wrong. Also kicking a ball into a goal around a defender is a patial relationship activity another area white possess and advantage.

 

[devans]

The midfield palyers generally do the most work. They are the engine room of a team and midfield plaers need endurance. All ten outfiled players need speed at the top level. Otherwise an opponent will just kick the ball past you and run around you. Soccer players need agility rather than top sprinters speed. You have to stop - start - change direction, twist, spin, jump etc. It is unusual to have to sprint for more than 20 yards. But after you've done that about twenty times it gets hard. So I think it come down to what they call speed (or sprint) endurance.

 

[Roundabout]

Regarding Theo Walcott, I thought his inclusion in the England World Cup squad reeked of ablatant "social engineering" ploy by the FA. 17 years old and very unproven,hisselectionat the expense of more qualified strikers was illogical and stupid. I know technically, Sven "selected" him, but I bet there were some behind the scenes forces at work. Iguess the powers that be in England need to make the national team as dark as possible, a la France, and while England has a couple of black starters Cole, Campbell Ferdiand, etc, it's not enough. Also Itake into account that while the game is usually won or lost in midfield, the men up front who score the goals do get ahuge share of the glory. To me it seemed like the FA or whoever was pulling the stringsmade a very calculated move in selecting Walcott, I know that before the World Cup he was being touted as a future star, and I dont doubt that he has talent, but in terms of hype and publicity his world cup selection surely opened the floodgates. I just think that the PC FA is not content with black defenders and midfielders, they really want a black up front bagging goals and making the highlight reel come tournament time. Since I dont live in England I could be off on this, but that's how it looked from where I was.

 

[Solomon Kane]

The midfield palyers generally do the most work. They are the engine room of a team and midfield plaers need endurance. All ten outfiled players need speed at the top level. Otherwise an opponent will just kick the ball past you and run around you. Soccer players need agility rather than top sprinters speed. You have to stop - start - change direction, twist, spin, jump etc. It is unusual to have to sprint for more than 20 yards. But after you've done that about twenty times it gets hard. So I think it come down to what they call speed (or sprint) endurance.

Although I once did attend a Professional European Soccer game (Anderlecht v. Racing White), like many Americans, I usually follow only the world cup, and maybe the MLS playoffs, or the Champions league final. But when I do watch, I'll admit, its engrossing. It's a fascinating game not only athletically, but also as sheer color and spectacle (which definitely includes the fans, and the WAGS).

From your description, Devans, I can see why many soccer players are dead tired by the 90th minute, and why it gets even worse during the overtime periods. This is one reason, I guess, why so many games are settled, regrettably, via penalty kicks.

So what's the solution, veteran Euro-soccer fans--a longer rest period after the first 90? A freer and more generous substitution system?

 

[BlowingBubbles]

Regarding Theo Walcott, I thought his inclusion
in the England World Cup squad reeked of a blatant "social engineering"
ploy by the FA. 17 years old and very unproven, his selection at the
expense of more qualified strikers was illogical and stupid. I know
technically, Sven "selected" him, but I bet there were some behind the
scenes forces at work. I guess  the powers that  be in England need to
make the national team as dark as possible, a la France, and while
England has a couple of black starters Cole, Campbell Ferdiand, etc, it's
not enough. Also I take into account that while the game is usually won or
lost in midfield, the men up front who score the goals do get a huge
share of the glory. To me it seemed like the FA or whoever was pulling
the strings made a very calculated move in selecting Walcott, I know that
before the World Cup he was being touted as a future star, and I dont
doubt that he has talent, but in terms of hype and publicity his world cup
selection surely opened the floodgates. I just think that the PC FA is not
content with black defenders and midfielders, they really want a black up
front bagging goals and making the highlight reel come tournament
time.  Since I dont live in England I could be off on this, but that's how it
looked from where I was.

I do agree that Walcott was an awful pick for the world cup, but I
don't think that it had anything to do with his color. It was more just
Sven acting like the absolute incompetant that he is. He picked a group
of strikers that included Rooney who was ruled out of the entire group
stage, and questionable for the whole tourney, Michael Owen just coming
off a huge injury, Peter Crouch who is great to bring in late, but certainly
not a world class striker, and then to include Walcott who hadn't even
PLAYED A GAME IN THE PREMIER LEAGUE!!!
You can tell that I feel strongly about the issue, but there was really
no point in bringing Walcott just for his race. If the FA really wanted a
black striker, they could've just picked Jermaine Defoe or Darren Bent,
who along with Andy Johnson, were the logical choices for a fourth
striker. By doing this, they'd bypass any speculation of them picking
black guys because they actually made sense. There's also the fact that
after Owen was out, and before Rooney came back, Sven was afraid to
play Walcott even though they desperately needed a striker.

 

[devans]

Agreed BB. Most people at the time thought that Defoe (who is black) should have gone rather than Walcott - so I don't think it was Political Correctness.


As for Penalty shoot outs to settle cup matches - I like them!Edited by: devans

 

[Roundabout]

That is a good point about Defoe and Bent being passed over.I guess the "conspiracy theorist" in me really thought that the FA was undertaking a long term project with young Walcott, and that Germany 2006 would be his his big introduction. Again though, BB you rightly mention that Walcott didn't even play, so maybe my imagination got away from me. However, I am convinced that the media in England would love to see more non whites on the national team. I'm sure it pains some of them that there are no Asians out there yet.

 

[Angelcynn]

Are the best young English players white? I had heard
that most are black. Or maybe its just that the most "promising" are black. [/
QUOTE]
I'd say its pretty split. There are some good black guys coming up like
Aaron Lennon and Theo Walcott (who both look mixed if its any
consolation), but Rooney's much better than both of them. Other than
Rooney, I really like this guy Dean Ashton who plays for West Ham. He's
young (23), and unlike any of these other guys he's got size (6'2''), but still
has great ball control for someone that big. He's been injured this entire
season, but he should play lots for England once he gets back, and I think
he, not Walcott, will be the guy who starts at striker alongside Rooney for
England in the next world cup and beyond.

I also really like Dean Ashton and it's just so unfortunate that he got an injury just before his England debut and ment he has missed 6 months of the season. This has had a huge effect on West Hams season as they used him as the building block for all of there attacks as he is such a athletically gifted and intellegent player. He is the new Alan Shearer. about the question 'are most of Englands best young players black the answer is no but it's pretty even. Alot are mixed race. The reason is that the vast majority of soccer players in England have traditionaly come from lower class areas in big inner cities such as London, Birmingham and Manchester in which whites are now generally the minority these days. White athletes from the middle and upper classes who live outside the inner city generally play Rugby and Cricket.

 

[nhl411]

i play soccer in college and i can say that at my school right now and at my old highschool the soccer players are/were just as fast if not faster than the football players.

 

[Roundabout]

This guy isnt as young as the above mentioned players, I think he is 24, but I wanted to know if he was white. Kaka of Brazil. He looks white to me,but I don't know if he identifies as white or is considered white by Brazilian society. Out of the Brazil World Cup squad, he is the only I recall appearing to be white. Anyone knowfor sure?Just curious. Edited by: Roundabout

 

[Solomon Kane]

The guy looks white to me. Is Kaka a Portuguese name?

 

[Angelcynn]

Kaka is 100% Portugese Brazilian and is as white as you'll get and funnily enough was Brazils best player at the worldcup 2006. Other white players in there squad of 22 are goalkeepers Julio Cesar and Rogerio Ceni, defenders Lucio, Cicinho and Cris, midfielders Edmilson, Juninho and Ricardinho. The only 100% black players were Juan and Ze Roberto the rest are mixed race.

 

[Jimmy Chitwood]

what the Englishman said about Kaka is completely spot on! sadly, he doesn't get near enough hype... conversely, national teammate Ronaldhino gets way too much.

 

[OC football]

Kaka is 100% white? He looks it. If we are correct about this then he is an
extreme rareity in Brazil. Only about 10% of Brazilians are completely white
with no admixture. Most Brazilians who check off the "white" box on census
forms are actually mixed and know it. Kind of like how half of all "Hispanics"
check off the white box on US census forms even though they know they are
actually of mixed indigenous and European decent; they just refuse to check
the "mixed race" box.

 

[Roundabout]

Kaka is 100% white? He looks it. If we are correct about this then he is an
extreme rareity in Brazil. Only about 10% of Brazilians are completely white
with no admixture. Most Brazilians who check off the "white" box on census
forms are actually mixed and know it. Kind of like how half of all "Hispanics"
check off the white box on US census forms even though they know they are
actually of mixed indigenous and European decent; they just refuse to check
the "mixed race" box.

According to wikipedia, Brazil is 53% white. But I have also read before, like OC stated, that many who claim to be white have varying degrees of Indian blood. I think there is a similar situation in Chile. I look at Kaka's photo and my initialimpression is yes he is white, buthisbeing Brazilian makes me unsure.

 

[BlowingBubbles]

I don't get to watch Lyon much because they're in the French league, but Cris and Juninho are on them, and they are absolute monsters even though the team got ejected from the Champions League. I would now argue completely objectively that those two along with Kaka are the best Brazilian players at the moment since Ronaldihno's had such a bad year.