Cassiodorus
Guru
- Joined
- Jan 6, 2006
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- 197
Taco said:
I've had that argument before. Other than Cris Carter, who was an established star when Moss entered the league, what who played opposite Moss had Welker's production? Exactly none.
wes welker
- Thread starter cslewis1
- Start date
I've had that argument before. Other than Cris Carter, who was an established star when Moss entered the league, what who played opposite Moss had Welker's production? Exactly none.
From Peter King's Monday Morning QB column.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/peter_king/12/13/mmqb/index.html?xid=si_topstories
2. Bill Belichick has one of the biggest challenges of his coaching career on his hands, and how he handles it will go a long way in determining the 2009 fate of the Patriots. I detail Randy Moss' canine performance against Carolina Sunday in Goat of the Week, but suffice to say he's not playing hard and is totally useless in the lineup. So if you're Belichick, you know these things:
You have only one receiver, Wes Welker, who can get open against man coverage when Moss is a bum like this ... Your tight ends are useless as receivers ... Your screen game isn't effective because defenses know you have to use it so much that they're waiting for it constantly ... And Moss is a total head case.. So your options are to draw the hard line and bench him and play Sam Aiken opposite Welker and hope the career special-teamer strikes gold. Unlikely. Or you can baby Moss along, keep him as one of the captains, pretend he's just going through a tough stretch, and expend an incredible amount of energy making him feel like he's still your go-to guy. Clearly, Belichick's going to have to try the latter.
New England could lose at Buffalo, particularly if the Bills -- if Perry Fewell is smart -- double Welker on every snap underneath and over the top, and belt him around in the five-yard bump zone. I remember Bill Parcells preaching to the beat guys who covered the Giants (and I'm sure he beat his assistants over the heads with it in the '80s, including Belichick) that his job was to get the most out of each player, and that meant he wasn't going to treat everyone the same because everyone didn't react to coaching the same way. That's where Belichick is now with Moss.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/peter_king/12/13/mmqb/index.html?xid=si_topstories
2. Bill Belichick has one of the biggest challenges of his coaching career on his hands, and how he handles it will go a long way in determining the 2009 fate of the Patriots. I detail Randy Moss' canine performance against Carolina Sunday in Goat of the Week, but suffice to say he's not playing hard and is totally useless in the lineup. So if you're Belichick, you know these things:
You have only one receiver, Wes Welker, who can get open against man coverage when Moss is a bum like this ... Your tight ends are useless as receivers ... Your screen game isn't effective because defenses know you have to use it so much that they're waiting for it constantly ... And Moss is a total head case.. So your options are to draw the hard line and bench him and play Sam Aiken opposite Welker and hope the career special-teamer strikes gold. Unlikely. Or you can baby Moss along, keep him as one of the captains, pretend he's just going through a tough stretch, and expend an incredible amount of energy making him feel like he's still your go-to guy. Clearly, Belichick's going to have to try the latter.
New England could lose at Buffalo, particularly if the Bills -- if Perry Fewell is smart -- double Welker on every snap underneath and over the top, and belt him around in the five-yard bump zone. I remember Bill Parcells preaching to the beat guys who covered the Giants (and I'm sure he beat his assistants over the heads with it in the '80s, including Belichick) that his job was to get the most out of each player, and that meant he wasn't going to treat everyone the same because everyone didn't react to coaching the same way. That's where Belichick is now with Moss.
Jimmy Chitwood
Hall of Famer
or ... they could sign Matt Jones, or David Kircus, or Mike Hass, orany of a hundred White guysand not have to worry about any of these problems ... hmm ... what to do?
whiteathlete33
Hall of Famer
I think Jones would be a monster in New England. They should get rid of lazy ass Moss and start Jones and Welker.
DixieDestroyer
Hall of Famer
whiteathlete33 said:
Jones can just about match Moss' 40 y/d speed, has a 40" vertical leap and is 1-2 inches taller that "Candy" Moss. No doubt the NFL caste masters have blackballed Jones.
whiteathlete33
Hall of Famer
DixieDestroyer said:whiteathlete33 said:
Jones can just about match Moss' 40 y/d speed, has a 40" vertical leap and is 1-2 inches taller that "Candy" Moss. No doubt the NFL caste masters have blackballed Jones.However, he would tear it up in NE or Indy.
Jones ran a 4.37 at the combine but we have to remember he was 240 lbs then. His playing weight as of last season was around 218 lbs so he cut some weight. He is probably slightly faster now than what he ran at the combine.
G
Guest
Guest
You cannot argue with the dwfs, if you do they revert to their training instinctively and when they revert they reenforce themselves with caste thought, and your arguments go to naught and you become a "racist." You will get a one or two sentence window, make your declaritive statement(s) and then get out of there or change the subject. If you need more than a sentence with or without a clause attached then you have not done your homework.
Colonel_Reb
Hall of Famer
wile, sometimes when doing your homework you find that it takes quite a few sentences to lay out the truth to people. Sometimes a sentence will do, but what I often find is that the DWFs make a lot of false claims that require several sentences to refute with factual info. I find that continuing to argue with them exposes their lack of reasoning and usually causes them to tire of not being able to back up their claims. Yeah, it takes a little more time and effort, but polishing up your debating skills is always a good thing.
Plus, if its in a public forum, others can read through the arguments and see that we are the people who know what we're talking about. Its a plus all the way around.
G
Guest
Guest
Ain't gonna happen Col., people don't think they are trained. DWFs are trained, day after day they are trained. What you are doing with "talking points" is slipping in a cue card that comes up in their heads whenever a situation comes up that they need a thought or reaction to. You can think about it, so think, how many DWFs do you think are rational abstract thinkers? How many times have you been frustrated in those "debates" with DWFs? Here we do our homework, out in the world our arguments must be short and consice.
Colonel_Reb
Hall of Famer
I'm not talking about "talking points." I'm talking about presenting all the facts, numbers included. Is it more convincing to just make a claim or include some evidence for the claim? What would you say to someone who said whites aren't as agile or as fast as blacks?
Edited by: Colonel_Reb
Edited by: Colonel_Reb
FootballDad
Hall of Famer
So what if they call me a "racist", wile? If I can just wedge a bit of knowledge in their frontal lobes, it might eventually sink in when they least expect it. Besides that, it's always fun to throw back at them the fact that the ad hominem attack is the last refuge of someone who has lost the argument.
Colonel_Reb
Hall of Famer
Great point, FootballDad. Why should them calling us names keep us from telling the truth? I don't care what people call me. I usually tell them the personal attacks prove they lost the debate. It makes them mad, but they can't defeat your argument.
G
Guest
Guest
Okay example time; You the CFer are invited to add commentary from the announcer's booth at the NFL combine (yes suspend disbelief) Brian makes his 40 and Dick Vermeil makes his comment that Brian is a natural fullback, you the CFer will add this, "Dick that is caste speak" gasps from the caste whores, they add, "blah blah blah" you the CFer state declaritively, "Brian's performance numbers add up with any back here, he is a tailback end of discussion." Then move on and do not allow them to go back into caste training even if you have to discuss the weather or the next overhyped black prospect. You've done your homework do not waste it on debating abstract theory with numbnuts who have no real ability to think.<p>
Now the Toby thing is gonna come up on every discussion board, and those lines I used for the CFer above will work to change the debate. The whores will write long heartfelt pieces on both sides and the DWFers who follow their authority will begin to feel they have been had and that the gods they worshipped have failed them. This is gonna get Tigergate ugly, mark my words.
Now the Toby thing is gonna come up on every discussion board, and those lines I used for the CFer above will work to change the debate. The whores will write long heartfelt pieces on both sides and the DWFers who follow their authority will begin to feel they have been had and that the gods they worshipped have failed them. This is gonna get Tigergate ugly, mark my words.
I agree that making the word "caste" or the phrase "caste system" when talking about football and football players, as well known as possible among fandom, even if it is notorious to many, isthe rightidea. If everyone knowswhat that frame of reference isit forces them to at least remember the concept that Whites don't get a fair shake in football every time they hear it, even if they disagree with it. It's similar to the way "racism" is so frequently used to stifle independent thought and open discussion, except in this case it's so patently true in most cases. Edited by: Don Wassall
G
Guest
Guest
"Racism" and "Racist" are words that allow someone to be anti-white. With that said our own Kap Poop is tearing em up on the Toby thread, a very good example of short consice done my homework waste no words type of practical politics. I wish I had an account there to help out with some one or two sentence rejoinders against the caste system.
FootballDad
Hall of Famer
Hey wile, all that you need is a facebook account, which takes a few seconds to set up, and you're good to go.
Wes is leading the league with 105 catches. It would be great if Brady continues to feed him the ball. I'm hoping Moss doesn't get every other pass thrown in his direction to keep him from pouting anymore. Next weeks game should be interesting.
At least the Patriots are fighting for the playoffs and playoff position. That should keep Brady and Belichick focused on what's important.
DixieDestroyer
Hall of Famer
wile said:
Exactly. They are also grossly overused, misapplied buzzwords leveraged by the cultural Marxists to force compliance to their agenda & induce (bogus) White guilt. I don't flinch & backpeddle if some racially neutered pantywafer calls me that, because that's the precise reaction they're expecting.
Deadlift
Hall of Famer
DixieDestroyer said:
After you're called racist, if you instantly respond with - "What is a racist?"... they will usually be stunned and speechless for a moment!
They are "trained" to shout RACIST, but they CAN'T DEFINE it! It's easy to make them feel stupid and they might lash-out in anger.
whiteathlete33
Hall of Famer
I believe someone had this on their signature of their profile. It said something like "Racism is a Marxist term used to silence white people and eventually lead to their own genocide." I'd say that's pretty darn close to what racism means.
I've been reading some talk of Wes Welker for MVP. I'd love to see him get it, but he needs more people to champion his cause.
The Patriots players and big wigs are speaking out on behalf of Moss. He doesn't quit, just gets frustrated. He is really a hard worker. This is expected, but I hope Wes doen't get shafted. If Brady and BB alter the game plan to feature Moss at the expense of Welker it would be sad.
Anyway, a little Q&A from a Boston writer.
Q: Hey Mike, why did the Patriots come out with so little energy against the Panthers? Fox sideline reporter Tony Siragusa said, "This is the flattest game I've ever done." I thought after two losses the Patriots would come out of the gates on fire. What's plaguing the team's mindset? -- Ahmed Al-Salem (Syracuse, N.Y.)
A: Ahmed, my view of it was that they had a banged-up quarterback who was mustering all the energy he possibly could just to be out on the field. Defensively, they didn't have a player step up to provide a big play, which can sometimes provide a spark, so it was a performance in which the Patriots looked like they didn't have a pulse at times. That's why you have to tip your cap to Wes Welker. He single-handedly brought life to the Patriots and that stadium in the third quarter. I'm running out of things to write about Welker -- I've already called him the Patriots' most valuable player and the best trade acquisition of Bill Belichick's 10-year tenure. Now, rookie receiver Julian Edelman calls him the Rocky Balboa of the Patriots -- he keeps taking big blows and gets back up. What else can be written? The guy is just remarkable.
The Patriots players and big wigs are speaking out on behalf of Moss. He doesn't quit, just gets frustrated. He is really a hard worker. This is expected, but I hope Wes doen't get shafted. If Brady and BB alter the game plan to feature Moss at the expense of Welker it would be sad.
Anyway, a little Q&A from a Boston writer.
Q: Hey Mike, why did the Patriots come out with so little energy against the Panthers? Fox sideline reporter Tony Siragusa said, "This is the flattest game I've ever done." I thought after two losses the Patriots would come out of the gates on fire. What's plaguing the team's mindset? -- Ahmed Al-Salem (Syracuse, N.Y.)
A: Ahmed, my view of it was that they had a banged-up quarterback who was mustering all the energy he possibly could just to be out on the field. Defensively, they didn't have a player step up to provide a big play, which can sometimes provide a spark, so it was a performance in which the Patriots looked like they didn't have a pulse at times. That's why you have to tip your cap to Wes Welker. He single-handedly brought life to the Patriots and that stadium in the third quarter. I'm running out of things to write about Welker -- I've already called him the Patriots' most valuable player and the best trade acquisition of Bill Belichick's 10-year tenure. Now, rookie receiver Julian Edelman calls him the Rocky Balboa of the Patriots -- he keeps taking big blows and gets back up. What else can be written? The guy is just remarkable.
Merril Hoge is a tool. ESPN of course had to have someone come on today and say Randy Moss didn't give up on any plays last week and was "opening things up for Welker" and he also blamed the offensive line and Brady. Hoge said he watched the game film and that Moss was very active in the game and had plenty people of covering him which benefited Welker, he also said he couldn't find one single play where he gave up. Even though Panther's defenders said otherwise and that they rolled out more coverage to stop Welker, but couldn't. Like he really knows more about the coverage schemes than the team that just played the Patriots!
I guess they don't want any dwfs realizing that Welker is talented all by himself regardless of who is playing at the other receiver spot. They don't want a White receiver being anything more than in a complimentary role to black guy. I am ready to see a White guy in a true number 1 role. Matt Jones could be that if teams would give him another chance.
Watching ESPN today I realize why so many fans are retarded. They don't remember what they saw on Saturdays and Sundays because they were too busy guzzling beer, and then ESPN shows nothing but positives and hyping up of black players throughout the week when they are actually sober. They have Arrelious Benn as one of the top receivers coming out in this draft at WR and nothing but excuses for his season with 38 catches 490 yards and 2 tds. They said he played on an ankle injury blah blah. Decker had an ankle injury since the CAL game and put up better numbers despite missing the last few games due to the ankle injury getting worse.
I guess they don't want any dwfs realizing that Welker is talented all by himself regardless of who is playing at the other receiver spot. They don't want a White receiver being anything more than in a complimentary role to black guy. I am ready to see a White guy in a true number 1 role. Matt Jones could be that if teams would give him another chance.
Watching ESPN today I realize why so many fans are retarded. They don't remember what they saw on Saturdays and Sundays because they were too busy guzzling beer, and then ESPN shows nothing but positives and hyping up of black players throughout the week when they are actually sober. They have Arrelious Benn as one of the top receivers coming out in this draft at WR and nothing but excuses for his season with 38 catches 490 yards and 2 tds. They said he played on an ankle injury blah blah. Decker had an ankle injury since the CAL game and put up better numbers despite missing the last few games due to the ankle injury getting worse.