NFL Network Top 100 Players

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GreatLakeState

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Militians though they may be, it seems like guys such as Jim Brown and Bill Russell always give their white contemporaries a lot more credit than those writing the history. A few years back Russell had Bob Pettit on his all-time starting five.
 
W

whiteCB

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NCromwell said:
Unfortunately this list will be made up of typical "Revisionist history" sentiment.  Somewhat off topic... It was interesting watching the Jets Hard Knocks this season.A linebacker or lineman commented that Danny Woodhead would have been a "Hall of Famer" had he played in the 50's or 60's.  As we all know he probably could be a very good "Pro Bowl" scat back now given the opportunity or potential "HOF".  
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Well I took that quote in the context that the black guys know nowadays that a little white scat back won't get any respect/use in contemporary times as opposed to the 50s where Woodhead could be a featured RB & would not be discriminated against. The black Jets on Hard Knocks know the reality of the situation a guy like Woodhead must go through and realize his diminutive position.
 
S

sport historian

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51. Bart Starr
52. Eric Dickerson
53. Willie Lanier (special mention as first great black MLB)
54. Forrest Gregg
55. Earl Campbell
56. Gene Upshaw
57. Mike Singletary
58. Steve Van Buren
59. Mike Ditka
60. Jack Ham
 
white is right

white is right

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Van Buren is classified as White(I have my doubts on his Whiteness,similar to Tirico being 100 percent Italian). Van Buren played at LSU when it was segregated. He is from Honduras which could mean he has Spanish ancestry besides the obvious Dutch. But he is very swarthy and had rather "kinky" hair, you combine that and you probably have a guy with some Black ancestry being that he is from Honduras. But under the segregated times of the he played under you would think his Whiteness would have been questioned.
 
Jack Lambert

Jack Lambert

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Um, last I checked, Spain was a white nation. Wouldn't you mean Mestizo?Edited by: Jack Lambert
 
white is right

white is right

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No Van Buren looked part Black not Amerindian. Believe it or not the old warhorse is still alive and is 90. From what I have seen of him he is on his last legs as it looks like he lives with his children or in a retirement facility. Younger posters might not realize this but unlike today White people could have their Whiteness questioned/challenged pre-65' and sometimes had to go to court to prove they were White if they were classified as Black. In some cases they lost if they found out they a distant Black relative. There is no way that LSU would allow even a Mulatto to play tailback/fullback for them in the late 30's to early 40's. One famous case of player being banned from playing in the south was a player named Sadat-Singh who had an Indian(Asian) step father and said he was Indian. A Black reporter interviewed him and he admitted he was Black and he wasn't allowed to play in the south.
 
S

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41. Rod Woodson
42. John Mackey
43. Alan Page
44. Mel Blount
45. Tony Gonzalez
46. Roger Staubach
47. Ray Nitschke
48. Red Grange.
49. Mike Haynes
50. Terry Bradshaw
 
S

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white is right said:
No Van Buren looked part Black not Amerindian. Believe it or not the old warhorse is still alive and is 90. From what I have seen of him he is on his last legs as it looks like he lives with his children or in a retirement facility. Younger posters might not realize this but unlike today White people could have their Whiteness questioned/challenged pre-65' and sometimes had to go to court to prove they were White if they were classified as Black. In some cases they lost if they found out they a distant Black relative. There is no way that LSU would allow even a Mulatto to play tailback/fullback for them in the late 30's to early 40's. One famous case of player being banned from playing in the south was a player named Sadat-Singh who had an Indian(Asian) step father and said he was Indian. A Black reporter interviewed him and he admitted he was Black and he wasn't allowed to play in the south.
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The subject of Van Buren's ancestry has been one of those things not discussed in public. I first came across it some 35 years ago. He's had a pretty tough time since leaving football. It's amazing Van Buren's lasted 60 years since he played. There's an NFL Films segment on the 1949 Eagles 20 years ago that indicated Van Buren was close to suicide after a stroke, I believe. He was able to attend a ceremony when some thought he could not and was introduced as the "Greatest Eagle of them all."

Van Buren could NOT have played at LSU (or anywhere in the SEC) in the 1940's without being considered white.
 
J

jacknyc

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Maybe he was just considered 'not black' like the 'Indian' player mentioned above.
 
white is right

white is right

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sport historian said:
white is right said:
No Van Buren looked part Black not Amerindian. Believe it or not the old warhorse is still alive and is 90. From what I have seen of him he is on his last legs as it looks like he lives with his children or in a retirement facility. Younger posters might not realize this but unlike today White people could have their Whiteness questioned/challenged pre-65' and sometimes had to go to court to prove they were White if they were classified as Black. In some cases they lost if they found out they a distant Black relative. There is no way that LSU would allow even a Mulatto to play tailback/fullback for them in the late 30's to early 40's. One famous case of player being banned from playing in the south was a player named Sadat-Singh who had an Indian(Asian) step father and said he was Indian. A Black reporter interviewed him and he admitted he was Black and he wasn't allowed to play in the south.
Click to expand...

The subject of Van Buren's ancestry has been one of those things not discussed in public. I first came across it some 35 years ago. He's had a pretty tough time since leaving football. It's amazing Van Buren's lasted 60 years since he played. There's an NFL Films segment on the 1949 Eagles 20 years ago that indicated Van Buren was close to suicide after a stroke, I believe. He was able to attend a ceremony when some thought he could not and was introduced as the "Greatest Eagle of them all."

Van Buren could NOT have played at LSU (or anywhere in the SEC) in the 1940's without being considered white.
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So you heard people speculated that he was Mulatto? I know his children that were in the photo with him are White. I do know one of his kids looks fairly swarthy but not as swarthy as her father. He must be a bull moose because when the 49 team had a ceremony before an Eagles game around the 50th anniversary of their win he was in a wheel chair and looked like he wouldn't be around for another ten years.
 
Don Wassall

Don Wassall

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Van Buren looks White to me:

Van_Buren_Induction_180-220.jpg


stevevanburen1.jpg


711828_f260.jpg


in-svb-100226.jpg
 
Colonel_Reb

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I think the contrast and lighting in some of the old black and white photos makes Van Buren look somewhat non-white, but he's as White as anyone to me.
 
white is right

white is right

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Van Buren might have also had a "farmer's tan" while he played and could explain his swarthy complexion. I saw a feature on ALS on HBO and they did a profile on Steve Smith(light skinned Black) the old Raiders fullback and because he was bedridden and virtually never went outside he looked like a Southern European(Greek/Italian). Anyway Van Buren was considered in the debate of the greatest power runners in the history of the old NFL. Historians have debated whether he Nagurski or Marion Motley was the best power back. I hope he makes it to his 90th birthday in December. Edited by: white is right
 
Colonel_Reb

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Good point, white is right. Farmer's tans were really common around the country back then and are still common in some places.
Edited by: Colonel_Reb
 
icsept

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The NFL network piece on Van Buren stated he was born in Honduras because his American dad had a job there. It's possible his dad knocked up a native Honduran. Wikipedia says he was orphaned and went to live with relatives in New Orleans.
 
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foreverfree

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Don, Colonel, wir and jacknyc, Van Buren looks like a classic case of having to agree to disagree.

Noticing as I did in jacknyc's link Van Buren's kinky hair, I must ask of CasteFootballers in general: Have any CasteFootballer ever had a decidedly-looking white male acquaintance with kinky looking hair? As a college freshman 31 years ago, I had a fellow frosh in one class who looked very white but he had a big kinky afro.* How it got that way, I never thought of asking. I'd have to find time to comb my brain (like I do my already naturally straight hair) to find other examples over the years.

white is right, when the black reporter who interviewed LSU's Sadat-Singh did so, was he interviewed "at the time"Â￾ iykwim, or decades after the fact?

*He had an Irish last name fyi.

John
Edited by: foreverfree
 
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foreverfree

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sport historian said:
41. Rod Woodson
42. John Mackey
43. Alan Page
44. Mel Blount
45. Tony Gonzalez
46. Roger Staubach
47. Ray Nitschke
48. Red Grange.
49. Mike Haynes
50. Terry Bradshaw
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Back to the list. In the "sixth ten" (I'm counting up from the bottom) we've got Nitschke, Staubach, Grange, Bradshaw and Gonzalez (you consider Gonzalez white, jacknyc?). Who (dis)agrees with this segment?

JohnEdited by: foreverfree
 
S

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foreverfree said:
Don, Colonel, wir and jacknyc, Van Buren looks like a classic case of having to agree to disagree.

Noticing as I did in jacknyc's link Van Buren's kinky hair, I must ask of CasteFootballers in general: Have any CasteFootballer ever had a decidedly-looking white male acquaintance with kinky looking hair? As a college freshman 31 years ago, I had a fellow frosh in one class who looked very white but he had a big kinky afro.* How it got that way, I never thought of asking. I'd have to find time to comb my brain (like I do my already naturally straight hair) to find other examples over the years.

white is right, when the black reporter who interviewed LSU's Sadat-Singh did so, was he interviewed "at the time"Â￾ iykwim, or decades after the fact?

*He had an Irish last name fyi.

John
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Yes, I had an acquaintance decades ago in school who looked more "black" than Van Buren. He was a good basketball player. This was when schools were segregated. Furthermore, our small rural Southern community was all white.

As the individual who started this thread, how about staying on the subject of the NFL Top 100 players from now on? This detour has gone on long enough.
 
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