Israel - Hamas conflict

[FootballDad]

I was surprised to not see a thread on this already (besides the NPC meme in that thread) since this has been going on for a few days. Like probably everyone here, I am deeply distrustful of all of the information coming in through the normal sources. This gentleman on X did a quick summary that is probably not too far off of the mark:

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1711578357253456181

Here is the post without the comments below. He did note that the "masks off" comment was in regards to the players showing their true colors, not in reference to COVID masks which he rightly says was a scam.
https://twitter.com/sovereignbrah
https://twitter.com/sovereignbrah
https://twitter.com/sovereignbrah
https://twitter.com/sovereignbrah

https://twitter.com/sovereignbrah
SOVEREIGN BRAH

@sovereignbrah

K. I’ve kept an eye on this Israel situation for the past few days. Here’s what I’ve learned, & here are my blunt & honest thoughts: 1. Israel chose to ignore intelligence from Egyptian officials about a major attack coming from Hamas. 2. Multiple former IDF soldiers & Israeli intelligence personnel have come forward online and said there’s a zero percent chance Israel was unaware of this attack beforehand or couldn’t have prevented it. 3. We just watched unsophisticated terrorists on hang gliders soar into one of the most heavily-defended & surveilled countries on the planet. 4. Within 48 hours of the attack, we’re now suddenly seeing enormous support for an American war with Iran and the genocide of the Palestinian people. I’m witnessing American pastors and formerly level-headed influencers in our world completely lose their minds and call for genocide. It’s unsurprising, but insane to watch. If the events of the past three years have taught me anything, it’s that when people get whipped into an emotional frenzy, critical thinking completely goes out the window. People become highly suggestible and will rush to extremely dangerous conclusions without thinking about the consequences. I think this is what we’re all witnessing with this situation in Israel. I’m reminded of Pearl Harbor and 9/11. In both scenarios, the American government received intelligence in advance of the attacks, but chose not to prevent the attacks. Why? The American government was willing to sacrifice the lives of American citizens in order to advance its geopolitical goals. Pearl Harbor gave the justification to enter WWII. 9/11 gave justification to invade the Middle East & drastically expand the American military industrial complex & our surveillance apparatus. They were brutal & extremely traumatic events for the American public to witness. The emotional trauma caused people to get whipped into an emotional frenzy. America wanted ONE THING in response to these attacks: The blood of our enemies. I see the same psyop playing out now. People are whipped into a frenzied bloodlust. In their frenzied bloodlust, people are overlooking some SERIOUSLY important facts here, notably: 1. The fact that none of this adds up, 2. innocent civilians are being threatened with genocide, and 3. Escalated violence in the Middle East and a war with Iran both risk ***the rest of the planet getting dragged into WWIII.*** What happened in Israel this weekend was obviously gut-wrenching and awful to witness, but I do not trust Israel’s so-called “intelligence failure”, nor do I trust the snakes in Washington calling for war with Iran, & I sure as hell no longer trust any of the emotionally-frenzied influencers calling for explicit genocide of innocent civilians. This was a defining moment in history, similar to Pearl Harbor, 9/11, COVID, the beginning of the Ukraine war, etc, and a lot of people just got played. Hard. People responded by going full mask-off, exposing themselves as reckless & incapable of exercising sound judgment in moments of chaos and heightened emotion. And we’re now at the brink of WWIII because of it. This is all worth noting. There’s a high likelihood there will be more chaos throughout the rest of this decade. There will be more psychological operations. There will be more moments in time in which cooler heads ought to prevail, but people will get whipped into an emotional frenzy instead. Keep your wits about you, & be cautious in whom you allow yourself to be influenced by. Recognize that governments & intelligence agencies spend enormous resources waging psychological operations on social media nonstop when stuff like this goes down. Remember that when chaos is at its peak, history shows there is ALMOST ALWAYS a hidden agenda being played out, & that hidden agenda is ALWAYS designed to prey on our base emotions to facilitate a desired end-result. Pray for world peace tonight. Thanks.


10:04 PM · Oct 9, 2023
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4M
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[Freethinker]

I think Sovereign Brah sums it up extremely well. Not much to add at the moment other than it seems that the appetite for these wars wanes faster than in decades past. If the US is going to start diverting resources to Israel, which is likely, than the Ukraine support is all but gone. The silver lining would be the end to that conflict with Ukraine making concessions to Russia.

 

[Don Wassall]

An excellent summary for sure.

 

[icsept]

I could not care less about Israel. I don’t believe or trust any media reports about the alleged conflict. I abhor war and anyone who promotes it, especially demented neocons like Nikki Haley and Lindsey Graham. Same goes for psychopathic Jews like Alan Dershowitz.

 

[Jimmy Chitwood]

no lies detected anywhere in this thread thus far.

spare me the “outrage” over a few jews dying from diversities when the “outraged” don’t give a damn about the literal thousands of White Americans dying from the same cause every year.

 

[Leonardfan]

Agree with every post so far in this thread.

 

[white lightning]

I've seen quite a few videos of middle eastern, hispanic & black illegal imigrants online. They are openly bragging about how they are
put up in hotels, apartments, houses, etc. etc. for free. They get free money on a rechargeable card every month & free cell phones! They also get free cable, free internet, food, etc. Here is the kicker. The U.N. is funding it and many of them say they are soldiers. They are told to hang tight until they get the go sign. Then sheer chaos. I think there is a high probability that this is true. If you thought 2020 was ugly with the riots, fires, muggings and shootings that was nothing. They want these refugees to take over the white countries.

Don't just laugh this off guys. Be prepared to defend yourselves and your families or friends. It's gonna get ugly and it's all be design. Thank
you to the communists taking over the world. I only post this for those here who don't know. Be ready with food, water, and of course
your other much needed supplies for safety.

 

[Bucky]

Without looking much into it. I thought it was fishy. Figured Israel attacked themselves as an excuse to execute more Palestinians. Which is the way it’s going. Just another distraction and I already see normies changing their profile pics to Israeli Flags. So predictable and gay.

 

[white lightning]

Please watch this guys.

https://media.gab.com/system/media_attachments/files/150/074/862/playable/0cf229cf57e8c41d.mp4

 

[Don Wassall]

Please watch this guys.

https://media.gab.com/system/media_attachments/files/150/074/862/playable/0cf229cf57e8c41d.mp4

Let's keep this thread on topic. The fear porn videos by obscure people, the kind of stuff I've been reading and hearing about from alarmists for the past 40 years, need to go on their own thread.

 

[SneakyQuick]

Without looking much into it. I thought it was fishy. Figured Israel attacked themselves as an excuse to execute more Palestinians. Which is the way it’s going. Just another distraction and I already see normies changing their profile pics to Israeli Flags. So predictable and gay.

Would the government of Israel sacrifice a couple hundred people in order to have an excuse to kill the two million “ insurgents tm” living in Gaza?

Why not ? By war standards that’s a pretty fair trade right?

I’m not saying that’s exactly what happened, but it certainly seems plausible.

 

[white lightning]

Without looking much into it. I thought it was fishy. Figured Israel attacked themselves as an excuse to execute more Palestinians. Which is the way it’s going. Just another distraction and I already see normies changing their profile pics to Israeli Flags. So predictable and gay.

They are calling the attack on Israel their 9/11. The crazy thing is that all of their advanced techonology failed just like ours back in 2001.
Even many people in Israel are questioning the narrative. My honest opinion is it was allowed to happen like many here think and nothing
is what it seems. We will be headed for World War III before you know it as that is the ultimate diversion from the collape of the entire
Fiat Monetary System into the Big Brother Total Control Enslavement of the cashless digital currencies with social credit scores and carbon footprint monitoring of every one of us slaves! All I can say is RESIST and do not comply but sadly with most nomies thinking it is the savior they will probably succeed.

 

[Warhawk_46]

They are calling the attack on Israel their 9/11. The crazy thing is that all of their advanced techonology failed just like ours back in 2001.
Even many people in Israel are questioning the narrative. My honest opinion is it was allowed to happen like many here think and nothing
is what it seems. We will be headed for World War III before you know it as that is the ultimate diversion from the collape of the entire
Fiat Monetary System into the Big Brother Total Control Enslavement of the cashless digital currencies with social credit scores and carbon footprint monitoring of every one of us slaves! All I can say is RESIST and do not comply but sadly with most nomies thinking it is the savior they will probably succeed.

I think both of these scenarios can be true:
1) Israel (like the US in Pearl Harbor and 9/11) chose to ignore intelligence warning of imminent attack.
2) many people drastically overestimate the abilities of the intelligence agencies. They are not foolproof and, ironically, are often lead by fools.

People also drastically overestimate the abilities of Israel and the U.S. Right now those two nations exert their power and influence through appearance of might.

But if Afghanistan (and North Vietnam before) have taught us anything it is that an invading force is very difficult to sustain.

Of course, our weapons are depleted from the money-laundering op in the Ukraine. And reports Hamas is using U.S. weapons left behind in Afghanistan is the icing on the cake. Globalist want world conflict because they believe when the dust settles they will have their New World Order. If they must sacrifice Israeli and Palestinian civilians (or American or Ukrainian) so be it. Too many mouths to feed anyways in their post-WW3 world.

 

[Leonardfan]

On social media I certainly see more and more questioning the "alliance" with Israel. Why are so many Americans actually invested in it? Our country is worse off now than it was prior to the founding of Israel and becoming a blind ally to it. The US has dumped billions (if not trillions) since Israel's inception (much like the "War on Poverty", "War On Drugs", Civil Rights Act of 1964 and uncontrolled immigration have drained our country of taxpayer money). Politicians have all been compromised by Israel through the AIPAC, Mossad or just sheer blind stupidity (not to mention that some politicians have dual citizenship with Israel). The country of Israel manipulates the US for it's military force and technology to continue it's landgrab in the Middle East. It's all a grift.

 

[FootballDad]

I agree with LF above on the question of undying allegiance to the manipulative Israeli regime and State. It's something that we will have to live with regardless of how we feel as the entrenched interests are far to vast and deep to unroot at this point. The current conflict doesn't smell right for a plethora of issues. This fine gentlecat has an interesting take that doubtless has some merit. I think that this take does let Israel and the IDF off a bit too easily, but their are many aspects that make perfect sense considering the instability created (on purpose) in the region by US policy combined with the current administration's green war on energy. It's a long article but I'll post it here as well for those who would rather not click random substack links:

hamas me no questions, i'll tell you no lies​

why supporting hamas is not supporting palestine and may, in fact, be the opposite​

EL GATO MALO
OCT 12, 2023

geopolitics is a nasty business and in the end, the realpolitik of what one can do and what one will do resolves into the terrible calculus of machiavellian iron law. there is always someone ready to act horribly to get what they want or take what you have.
israel and palestine have been at odds since the former’s inception and ideas of integration have generally fallen flat. ideas of a 2 state solution come and go but never seem to come to fruition as (like many issues) not everyone wants to see them resolved. some benefit from the chafe and from the chaos. and anyone who thinks there are not actors on the world stage who would wantonly sacrifice the well being and even existence of other groups upon the altar of self-interest if it got them a nickel and a stick of chewing gum might wanna brush up on their history. because that’s just not how it is.


dr strangecat
i’m not going to try to grapple with the historical “who done what to whom” of israel and palestine. it’s just too thorny and impossible to untangle. but i do want to address this idea in current currency that somehow hamas is standing up for palestine and playing the noble freedom fighter that seems bizarrely prevalent in certain circles just now.
some of it is clearly just the predictably ignorant identity politics of “if my enemy dislikes you, you must be my friend” that emerges as the dreary twaddle of those more committed to dogma than facts or sense.
it starts to get frankly ridiculous as the more idiotic of the useful idiots adopt poses increasingly devoid of sense.



but it’s also not terribly new or poignant.
this sort of sophomoric silliness has been around for ages and it’ll never go away.


“jeez, why didn’t we think of that?”
but there is a more serious and purportedly thoughtful line of pro-hamas pundit seeming to emerge around this recent round of appalling surprise attacks on civilians that added rape and parading prisoners and bodies in public to the tab of murder. the logic seems to go something like “well, this is how you have to fight an oppressor. hamas is standing up for palestine!”


but they aren’t.
that’s simply not what happened.
hamas just threw palestine under the bus in brutal fashion by committing atrocities sure to generate the most severe of reprisals. and it was not done to protect or promote palestinians. it was done to cause them instant, deadly harm because that is in the best interests of iran, the paymaster who has been calling the tune. and those interests diverge greatly from those of the palestinian people.
and we need our “intelligencia” to stop being such dupes.
as is so often the case, the truly useful question is “cui bono?”
let’s look.
many have asked incredulous questions about “why would palestine do this?” as the attacks were so obviously intended to inflame. they were spectacular (in the literal sense of creating a spectacle) using rockets and paragliders and attacking a music festival and parading rape and murder in the streets. it was obviously going to instantly evoke the most draconian responses imaginable as the IDF bombs gaza to gravel. and surely palestine must have known that. so, like WTF?


decisions have consequences
there is another line of reasoning that this just shows that “the palestinians are stupid/evil people who cannot be trusted. look at what they just did!” and it seems to hold water if one accepts the premise that “they” are somehow monolithic and “did this” but i find that explanation to be unsatisfying. from the perspective of most of the palestinian people and perhaps even most of their leaders, they did not do this.
it was done to them.
hamas is not palestine and palestine is not hamas any more than BLM is america and american is BLM and we should all be culpable for their burning of cities. sometimes factions with agendas of their own get loose and do things that very few people actually wanted, often to some ulterior aim. and i suspect that’s what we’re seeing here.
hamas has tried in vain to win the palestinian presidency for decades. they have not come close. they have managed some parliamentary wins and control it now, but as any american can attest, a 56% legislative majority in a split government (president is fatah) is hardly a mandate to speak for all.


hamas are funded and often armed and trained by iran. their leadership is dependent on this and therefore dances to the tune called by the ayatollahs. and this is where this whole imbroglio gets sinister: because if there is one thing that iran does not want, it’s israeli-saudi détente/alliance and a path to a two state system where the palestinians get a actual sovereign homeland instead of being the evergreen regional flashpoint. iran does not want this issue settled. they want it to be an issue.
so pause to consider for a moment:
what if this attack was not to help the palestinians but rather to throw them to the wolves to break up any potential deals and shore up power for iran?
because that sure seems like the odds on bet to me.


you’d have to be a special kind of stupid to engage in this sort of extreme provocation and expect “no punchbacks.” the israelis are famous for instant and severe retaliation. it’s arguably the only reason there is still an israel and the provocation here was not just extreme, but calculated to be extreme.
that is not the act of a group looking to serve the people upon whom the reprisals will fall.
but it’s exactly what one would do if the goal were to play the wrecker to regional rapprochement. bahrain and the UAE had moved to normalize relations with israel. the saudis were in talks to follow suit. this is obviously going to place all of that in jeopardy as extreme times make for extreme tribalism and it’s awfully hard for prince MBS to keep favoring israel when the TV is full of images of them blowing up palestinian buildings.
it’s bad for israel, bad for saudi, and difficult for the US. but it’s great for iran who benefits from this sort of regional instability both politically and economically.
it creates a calamitous flashpoint for the palestinians who got ganked out front as the sacrificial pawn though…
they are going to get creamed and this is why i think it’s important to see the distinction here between the people of the west bank and gaza and hamas and why this knee jerk of “supporting hamas is supporting palestine” is not only just plain wrong but outright dangerous. it loses the real villain and the real villainy and heaps the blame on the doorstep of many who did not deserve or want this.
so how about we stop this “hamas are noble freedom fighters” crap? this was an act of savagery calculated to induce more savagery and to harm the very people the jingoists are mistaking for the prime mover here. people are getting “robin-hoodwinked” by this phony “outlaw of the people.”
the fact is that this was an attack on the every day palestinians as well as the israelis.
in this case, hamas are not palestine’s protectors, they are their assailants.
worth keeping that in one’s calculus.
many US politicos have incentive to feed this facile trend around the false flag of “palestine did this” because they have some nasty culpability in funding/appeasing iran who in turn funded and trained hamas as well as the huge afghan weapons giveaway that filtered through to these attackers as well.


iran smells the weakness brought on by the US suppressing global oil over ukraine and running down the strategic petroleum reserve to worryingly low levels. they know the current regime cannot really push or sanction them right now for fear of exploding the already high pump prices that lose elections. europe is pinned as winter approaches and perhaps they will not be as lucky as last year with the weather. it’s why tehran feels impunity to move and to press. hell, we just paid them $6bn to release 5 prisoners. this is not a sign our position is strong.


the department of “MOAR WAR” seems anxious to turn this fact pattern into “so let’s bomb iran/kill their leaders/fund a coup/etc” but this seems dangerously short sighted and stupid to me. the price is always high, it never fricking works, and in the end, we wind up arming some group we’re going to fight 15 years from now. this is not “america, world cop” it’s “america world clown” setting up the next pratfall. we’ll just wind up unifying a fractious iranian populace and garnering them more regional allies and bigger profits from more expensive oil.
if you want to take power away from the ayatollahs, it’s best to do it at home. wanna solve this and defang them? drill baby, drill. an awful lot of the current global instability were seeing is around energy prices and availability as the green grift collides with geopolitics and winds up empowering folks like russia, iran, and iraq. you wanna hurt them? frack till the price of oil drops to $40/bbl. then let’s see how much cash they have to buy friends and influence people.
it’s a massively positive sum scenario, but so long as we treat drilling for oil and gas like some sort of pariah practice, pariah states will profit. the naïve green geopolitics of physics denial is a profound source of geopolitical instability. it impoverishes and hamstrings those who adopt it and cedes power to the states they profess to abhor.
this is not a basis for policy, foreign or domestic.
it’s self-harm rooted in dogmatism and ignorance.
and it’s time it stopped.

 

[Leonardfan]

I have to now think that the mass brown invasion of the United States and Europe has both Zionist and leftist Jewish origins. Now with the many middle eastern muslim countries rejecting the Gaza refugees their are calls for the US to open them up. I would assume that it is the same in the rest of the puppet governments of the West. Have to wonder if it's all a big ruse to clear out the middle East so the state of Israel can continue with it's landgrab.

 

[William_Wallace]

I have to now think that the mass brown invasion of the United States and Europe has both Zionist and leftist Jewish origins. Now with the many middle eastern muslim countries rejecting the Gaza refugees their are calls for the US to open them up. I would assume that it is the same in the rest of the puppet governments of the West. Have to wonder if it's all a big ruse to clear out the middle East so the state of Israel can continue with it's landgrab.

https://nationaljusticeparty.com/2021/05/20/in-depth-how-israel-created-the-european-refugee-crisis/

 

[Leonardfan]

https://nationaljusticeparty.com/2021/05/20/in-depth-how-israel-created-the-european-refugee-crisis/

Thanks for sharing and it's from 2 years ago yet applies completely to what is going on presently. Things have only gotten worse since then. It certainly is a well thought, logical and evidence based argument too. I tried sharing on Twitter and of course it was flagged.

 

[William_Wallace]

Thanks for sharing and it's from 2 years ago yet applies completely to what is going on presently. Things have only gotten worse since then. It certainly is a well thought, logical and evidence based argument too. I tried sharing on Twitter and of course it was flagged.

No problem. And yeah I think the domain is auto banned on Twitter so you have to put a space between the . and com if you want to share it there

 

[Bucky]

Est.

 

[Leonardfan]

Oh man even Alex Jones is acknowledging the root cause. It does seem that alot of people are finally waking up to the disproportionate amount of Jewish influence in Western countries and positions of power.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1713767031437230110

 

[Quiet Speed]

Oh man even Alex Jones is acknowledging the root cause. It does seem that alot of people are finally waking up to the disproportionate amount of Jewish influence in Western countries and positions of power.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1713767031437230110

I'm taken aback. That's incredible.

 

[Freethinker]

I have to now think that the mass brown invasion of the United States and Europe has both Zionist and leftist Jewish origins. Now with the many middle eastern muslim countries rejecting the Gaza refugees their are calls for the US to open them up. I would assume that it is the same in the rest of the puppet governments of the West. Have to wonder if it's all a big ruse to clear out the middle East so the state of Israel can continue with it's landgrab.

Bingo!

 

[Freethinker]

Oh man even Alex Jones is acknowledging the root cause. It does seem that alot of people are finally waking up to the disproportionate amount of Jewish influence in Western countries and positions of power.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1713767031437230110

Alex is “BREAKING HIS JEWISH CONDITIONING” [meant to be read in angry Jones’ voice].

Great to see.

 

[Leonardfan]

Keith Woods has some great stuff out on this.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1713979808957296682