Black countries/societies

[Guest]

Nigeria succesful

Why are they along with other Western African country's like Senegal,Ghana importing huge numbers of refugee's, asylam seekers into Europe,but not only Western Europe but even some of the poorer country's in Eastern Europe and the Arab world,all trying to get away from the chaos,crime and corruption that is Nigeria.

Don't you guys have ANY reading comprehension?

I did not say that nigeria was successful. Actually read the posts this time: that was SARCASM.

Your far more likely to get jacked or murdered in L.A than Moscow.The Black homicide rate per population in Britain and the U.S exceeds Russia and Syria despite the wealth of the nations in question.Wealth can never paper over genetic factors in the creation and maintenance of civil society.

Time for world crime stats.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murde rs-per-capita

An interesting pick up from this site. Check out the murder statistics in the countries, and you will see that Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia, Ukraine, Belarus and Moldova all have higher murder rates than...get ready for this...ZIMBABWE! Their rates are also higher than Zambia, Botswana, Namibia and Ghana.

Check this out to.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_ass_percap-crime-assau lts-per-capita

You are more likely to be assaulted in Finland, Australia and iceland than you are to be assaulted in Jamaica. you are more likely to be assaulted in Norway, the Netherlands, Ireland, Ireland, Spain, and the Czech republic than you are in Jamaica.
You are more likely to be assaulted in germany, Denmark, France, Slovenia, and Hungary than you are in Dominica.

All of these nations that I have mentioned have higher assault rates than Botswana, Namibia, and Ghana. You are safer from assault over in certain parts of Africa than you are in Denmark, it seems. Interesting.

Let us look at some stats for Burglary, shall we?

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_bur_percap-crime-burgl aries-per-capita

Australia, denmark, estonia, new Zealand, UK, Poland, Finland, iceland, Slovenia, ireland, france, The Netherlands and Bulgaria. You are more likely to get burglarized in these countries than you are in Zimbabwe, Ghana, Botswana, Zambia, or Jamaica.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_car_the_percap-crime-c ar-thefts-per-capita

Denmark has the second highest rate of car theft in the world. Australia is first.
Your car is safer in Jamaica than it is in Italy, Norway, France, Ireland, new Zealand, Finland, the Netherlands, Germany, and the Czech Republic, among others.
Cars in Zimbabwe and Zambia are also a lot safer as well, not to mention Ghana, Botswana, Namibia and even Costa Rica.

Now, let us look at Drug Offences.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_dru_off-crime-drug-off ences

Wow, lookie there. The Norwegians are the biggest druggies in the world, followed by the Swiss. Belgium, Sweden, Germany, Iceland. These are all in the top 10, and Finland is number 11.
Ireland, France, Austria and Italy follow it up, along with many other European nations.

Not a single African nation is even on that list. Ironic. granted, this list only goes up to 34, but this still says a lot. Aren't we "negroes" supposed to be drug obsessed felons?

Embezzlement stats.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_emb_percap-crime-embez zlements-per-capita

Zimbabwe is 2nd in the world in this one (not surprising, given the guy at the helm). But guess who's #1?

Czech Republic. Botswana is also known to have one of the lowest Embezzlement/Corruption rates in the world.


Fraud.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_fra_percap-crime-fraud s-per-capita

Germany is the leader, and by quite a wide margin. The UK is 2nd. New Zealand, Finland, hungary, Norway, the Czech republic and Slovenia round out the top 10.

You are less likely to encounter fraud over in the Seychelles than you are in any of those nations.

Manslaughter
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_man_percap-crime-mansl aughters-per-capita

Ok, I'll concede here, then. South Africa and Zimbabwe are in the top 5 here.
But Romania, Italy, Turkey, Estonia, Bulgaria, Russia, Lithuania, Latvia, Portugal, Poland, Denmark and Norway all have higher rates than Zambia. Botswana, Namibia and Ghana are not even on this list.

Kidnappings.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_kid_percap-crime-kidna ppings-per-capita

Whoa. Better not bring your kids to Columbia, fellas.
Nigeria is in the top 10 here as well.
Doesn't further my cause, but oh well, it's the truth.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_wit_fir_percap-cri me-murders-firearms-per-capita
I'll concede here to. Zimbabwe is number 4. But Zambia, Botswana and Ghana aren't even in the top 32 with their rates.

Oh, here is a big one: Rape!
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rap_percap-crime-rapes -per-capita

Look at that. Your women are safer in Jamaica and Zimbabwe than they are in Canada or Australia. Go all the way down to #49 to find Zambia, and count how many European nations you see as you go down before you reach Zambia. Note how Botswana and Namibia, as well as Ghana aren't even on this list.

Robberies.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rob_percap-crime-robbe ries-per-capita

Wow. Spain leads the whole world in robbery. Estonia is 5, Portugal is 7. Netherlands is 16.

Zimbabwe, Zambia, Botswana, Ghana and Namibia are ahead of all of them.

You are less likely to be robbed in Jamaica than you are in Russia.

Suicide rates.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_sui_rat_in_age_15_24-s uicide-rates-ages-15-24
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_sui_rat_in_age_25_34-s uicide-rates-ages-25-34
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_sui_rat_in_age_35_44-s uicide-rates-ages-35-44

People in New Zealand, Finland and Switzerland must be having a pretty hard time. Almost every country on this list is European. Why are they all so busy taking their own lives?

And, finally, Total crime rates.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_tot_cri_percap-crime-t otal-crimes-per-capita

Look who's right up near the top. Dominica is first, but Finland, New Zealand and Denmark come immediately after.

Want to try this little genetic crime argument of your again?

And the only reason why Jamaica is not another Haitti is due wholly to the fact that its a former British colony which is still part of the Commonwealth,therefore benifiting from favourable trading policy's with Britain aswell as substantial British investment.Do you know its British financing that builds Jamaica's prisons?

The reason jamaica is not another Haiti is because:

1. Theyactually know how to run their government
2. They never had a revolution. They gained their independence the old fashioned way.
3. They had a stable government. Men like Norman manley helped greatly in shaping Jamaica in it's early stages as and independent country.
4. They never had to deal with any guys named "Duvallier".

THOSE are the reason why Jamaica is not another Haiti. Stop ignoring them and give them the credit they deserve already.

As for Barbados,its benefits from a vibrant White tourist economy with many of the islands tourist infrastructure,hotels,resorts etc owned by American ,European investors which employ the local Blacks.

I'll just say this again:

The tourism industry in much of the carribean truly did not begin thriving until after these countries gained their independence. It was the leaders of these countries(the black ones) that began implementing strategies to increase tourist trade on the islands in order to increase profits.
Some islands, such as St Kitts, Dominica, etc, etc, have only recently become successful tourist destinations. Their tourism industries only began to receive grooming in the late 80's. Places like Jamaica have been doing this since the late 70's.

In other words, this idea is the work of blacks.

The industry and infrastructure are the results of the government's work(the black government, that is). The people being attracted(the resorts, the hotels, the cruise ship lines) are the foreign, european/american businesses.

 

[jaxvid]

I don't think that the stats you are using are accurate but more importantly they are just numbers and as with any stats there is a story behind them.

Here are some weaknesses in your use of an encyclopedia's statistics.

-each country varies in the ability to correctly gather stats. Since the collection of data is done by the government in charge there is a large incentive to "cook" the books to make things look better then they actually are. How can corrupt countries expect to present true numbers? hell it's doubtful the numbers that the US govt' gives out are any good. Do I trust the crime stats from Namimbia, hell no, I don't trust them from the US either.

-statistics for a country are averages taken over a large population. Parts of the US are the most dangerous places in the world but so many others are very nice. What places are bad and which are nice? I'll let you guess.

-European crime stats are skewered by the recent influx of African and Arabs. The native white population has a very small crime rate, thus it is not an accurate picture to just list stats for a country when debating issues of race. Almost all white countries are mixed.

-Saying Italy is more corrupt then a third world country is absolutely ridiculous. There is no way to measure the many ways of corruption in backward African countries while it is much easier to look at a place like Italy under a microscope.

-Saying Jamaica is a better place to live then Russia is purely a judgement call. People will tend to favor warm tourist destinations as a place to live, but really! comparing a superpower that has a nuclear arsenal that can destroy the world, that has sent rockets to the moon, with a small island that is nothing but a place for white people to play is totally ridiculous and anyone that makes that arguement just makes themselves look foolish.

-listing "rankings" which are just someone's opinion is not convincing, it's like the BCS or a football poll, some attempt at accuracy but still just someone's opinion.

-so much of your post can be taken apart if I wanted to take the time (I don't) I don't think that the stats you are using are accurate but more importantly they are just numbers and as with any stats there is a story behind them.

Here are some weaknesses in your use of an encyclopedia's statistics.

-each country varies in the ability to correctly gather stats. Since the collection of data is done by the government in charge there is a large incentive to "cook" the books to make things look better then they actually are. How can corrupt countries expect to present true numbers? hell it's doubtful the numbers that the US govt' gives out are any good. Do I trust the crime stats from Namimbia, hell no, I don't trust them from the US either.

-statistics for a country are averages taken over a large population. Parts of the US are the most dangerous places in the world but so many others are very nice. What places are bad and which are nice? I'll let you guess.

-European crime stats are skewered by the recent influx of African and Arabs. The native white population has a very small crime rate, thus it is not an accurate picture to just list stats for a country when debating issues of race. Almost all white countries are mixed.

-Saying Italy is more corrupt then a third world country is absolutely ridiculous. There is no way to measure the many ways of corruption in backward African countries while it is much easier to look at a place like Italy under a microscope.

Saying Jamaica is a better place to live then Russia is purely a judgement call. People will tend to favor warm tourist destinations as a place to live, but really! comparing a superpower that has a nuclear arsenal that can destroy the world, that has sent rockets to the moon, with a small island that is nothing but a place for white people to play is totally ridiculous and anyone that makes that arguement just makes themselves look foolish.

-so much of your post can be taken apart. suicide rates for instance, do you really think Uganda keeps good records on suicides? Sure. And suicide is often done by older people something some countires don't have much of due to short life spans.

Fraud, embezzelment c'mon how is that tracked? And if the Norweigians are the worlds biggest druggies it must be one mellow ass drug because I've been there and they are the nicest people. The druggies here in Detroit are not so nice. African countries with low drug use? probably because the standards for arrest and prosecution are different.

Rape, I'll give you a rape statistic, 15 white women a day are raped by black men in America, you say women are safer in Zimbabwe then in Canada, I say bullsh*t, I don't believe it.

Jamaica a lower rate of assault then Ireland, hell everone's on vacation in Jamaica, what is there to fight about?

OK so some black areas have succesfully built up tourist industries to cater to rich white people.

which black countries have designed a boat? a car? an airplace? which ones have launched rockets, developed a new technology? How many prestigious universities full of Nobel prize winners are in black countries? Which one has a modern Army, which one is rich enough to send aid to poor white countries like Albania that could benefit from the riches of Botswana? Is there a "black cross" that helps out other countries when there is a disaster? Who are the famous black architect's that design the skyscrapers in those large black cities built and run by blacks? What pioneering medical advances are going to come from Jamaica and Botswana?

-those are the real measures of a people, not the cold, easy to fudge numbers out of some government agency.

 

[PitBull]

FG30,

1) Ratings of so-called corruption indices are simply opinion. It is
impossible to truly find out how corrupt a country is and relate that to
others worldwide. Way too much commerce, way too big a world. That
ranking carries no wieght with me. You didn't refute any of my argument
that almost all the wealth generated by Africa is pulled out of the ground,
and that Africa is full of the most corrupt regimes on earth, and that it
lives on many billions of foreign charity. Stop avoiding the issue. It
makes you look like a fool.

2) The infrastructure of these countries is indeed built by whites and
asians, and I know about it because I have worked in the industry for 20
years. I don't for a minute believe you are 15, but playing along with the
charade, that is longer than you have been alive. I know what I am talking
about. You don't. The governments of those countries try to have the
whites and asians train the natives to do the work, and when it comes
contract time, they swing some easy work the natives way, but they can't
engineer a decent sack lunch, so the song remains the same and it is
indeed the whites and asians who have built Africa beyond the stone age,
and not africans themselves.

3) Confusing the generation of the tourism industry, not only in the
Caribbean, but also worldwide, with the independence of countries is
ridiculous. Tourism took off with the advent of air travel and
deregulation, and also the development of ocean cruise lines in the 70's.
It had a lot more to do with technological innovation of creating large
vessels that were economic to rent out. The whites indeed devloped the
tourism industry there, and they are still the ones doing the heavy lifting.
Cheerleaders in the offices of the el presidente do little to but promote
what has been already been accomplished, and certainly they have not
created it.

4) Your parents moved here because they think its a better country than
jamaica. So did my great great grandparents. Don't argue that jamaica is
such a great place, then move here. But that was the point. Saying that
life in Ghana is better than Russia is a joke. But you can believe all the
false statistics you want.I belive the statistics that blacks are
intellectually inferior to every other race. There's lots of reliable data on
that one. BTW, I don't see Russians moving to Ghana. But I do see
africans and Ghanians trying to move to Russia, America, and Europe.
Funny how that works. They know their country a lot better than you do.
I don't know why--they should just relocate to Jamaica!

5) Russia has a long way to go to catch Ghana and Botswana?
Hahahahahahaha! Maybe in few years the russians will come up with a
space program that can compete with the one in Botswana! Or a
university system, or an arts, sports, mining and oil and gas industry, or
agriculture--the list goes on and on! But why talk to a 15 year old kid
with no experience. At least I've been there, which is more than you can
ever say. Russians do indeed have better minds, because whites are
smarter than blacks. Period. Blacks are less corrupt than whites--give
me a break.

6) Black people are the recipeints of massive handouts. Or do you mean
you personally? How do you know your parents weren't hired as quota
babies? just because they bring home a paycheck doesn't mean that they
earned it, or that they were the best for the job. I've never seen blacks be
the best at any intellectual endeavor. The actual point was a general one
and you are tryiing to make it specific to you. It is generally true, whether
you personally receive handouts or not.

7) You see, blacks will just migrate here to mooch and never leave.
That's why they have to be cut off from their mooching and welfare
dependence. Whites don't want to live around blacks. Even if we left,
they would just follow us around and mooch. They can't make it on their
own. Just look how dependent Ghana, Jamaica, and Botswana are on
whites for foreign aid, technonlogical help, toursim dollars, etc, the list is
endless. That's why we need white separtatism. You don't have to leave,
FG, we just need to segregate you from us--I know, a fate worse than
death for the blacks! Funny how whites have no fear of segregation, but
blacks do. It won't be like it used to--I promise we will leave you
completely alone then. It will get to that point too. You'll see. What do
you do when nobody wants to exploit your labor, because they don't want
it in the first place? What do you do when nobody wants to harrass and
discriminate against you, beacause they don't want to be around you in
the first place? That's why segregation works. And its why the vast
majority of whites move away from blacks to neighborhoods and
churches full of their own. Once AA goes down, that segregation will get
a lot more pronounced too. Lots of the BS will end then. I personally am
eagerly looking forward to that day.

As far as talking and making little sense, of that you have achieved some
mastery at your fictional young age.You should learn how to directly
deal with ponts in a debate, rather than run around and away from them.
Africa is hellhole without whites. And so is just about any other place I
can think of where blacks are the vast majority of the inhabitiants. Russia
is not a backward country, and neither is eastern Europe, which have had
a far more storied history than dear old Botswana and Ghana. They fell
on hard times and suffered much under socialism, like the other countries
that have adpted socialism, but they are making a comeback and doing
fine, without the foreign aid, technological expertise, and moral guidance
of Botswana, Ghana, and Jamaica.

By the way, anyone who thinks that Sweden, Latvia, Germany, and
Denmark are more violent than Africa is a just a lunatic. Zimbabwe is in
utter collapse. Civil wars in the Sudan, Nigeria, etc. You can quote that
stupid website all you want, but nobody here believes it (except you).
Just more internet trash. You're still good for laugh, though.

 

[PitBull]

The tourism industry developed along with cheap air and ship travel, and
the increase in leisure time of the masses and of their disposable
incomes. it is the whites who are filling the coffers, building the airpots,
ships, planes, and resorts, so again a black country dependent on whites.
Also a ridiculous website full of ridiculous statistics that says that
Zimbabwe is safer than--well Gohan, you give the list of first world
European countries. Yes, Zimbabwe--a country in complete economic
collapse, where the people have no food, money, and are starting violent
uprisings and demonstrations against the government, is safer than most
of white Europe, according to Gohan. Sure buddy.

The infrastructure of Africa was, is and will continue to be built by whites
and asians. I have worked for these large international engineering and
construction conglomerates, and I know that that is true. Just get a list of
the top 50 international engineering and construction companies in
Europe and America, and see what projects they are building worldwide
for the natives. Blacks--a totally dependent race.

You are so full of it, kid! The crime stuff was what really gave it away.
Nobody is taking you seriously anymore, at least I hope not. I feel so
sorry for black people who clutch at fantasies to try to sweep away black
social failure, or who try to misrepresent themselves (can't even argue
with a 15 year old?--must be really dumb then, huh!). Sheesh, why waste
the time on this guy (I mean, kid!).

 

[Guest]

I don't think that the stats you are using are accurate but more importantly they are just numbers and as with any stats there is a story behind them.

Really? Because last I checked, WN loved to use criminal stats to implicate blacks as being more violent. And they like to use stats to show how much lower our IQs are.

Do those numbers seem irrelevant to you as well? Are those stats just as cold, and inconsequential as the stats for European crime that i am posting?

-each country varies in the ability to correctly gather stats. Since the collection of data is done by the government in charge there is a large incentive to "cook" the books to make things look better then they actually are. How can corrupt countries expect to present true numbers? hell it's doubtful the numbers that the US govt' gives out are any good. Do I trust the crime stats from Namimbia, hell no, I don't trust them from the US either.

You can trust the crime stats from Namibia a bit more than you can from Russia, though. Much lower corruption rate.

Hey, since you don't trust the crime stats in Amaerica, does this mean that you also do not trust any stats saying that blacks are more criminalistic?

-statistics for a country are averages taken over a large population. Parts of the US are the most dangerous places in the world but so many others are very nice. What places are bad and which are nice? I'll let you guess.

Ah...so first you say statistics are not trust worthy..but now, suddenly, they actually ARE trustworthy when determining which parts of the US are the most dangerous in the world.

So, let me ask you: if you can actually come to the conclusions that parts of the US are the most dangerous in the world, then why can I not say(as the stats themseleves show) that Barbados is safer than Russia?

-European crime stats are skewered by the recent influx of African and Arabs. The native white population has a very small crime rate, thus it is not an accurate picture to just list stats for a country when debating issues of race. Almost all white countries are mixed.

You can't even prove that. How would you know that anyway? According to you, not even the stas of the US government are trustworthy.

But in anycase, what you're basically saying here is basically that non whites are the roots of criminality in Eastern Europe.

Let me take that little theory of yours and run with it. Now, assuming that is true, and why would a nation FULL of black people, and nothing but them(like Ghana, Barbados, or Namibia) have a lower rate than a country which may have some minorities but is still statistically 98% white(Lithuania)?

Because, you see, going by your explaination("nonwhites are the root of crime"), it would also HAVE to be true that a nation full of these roots of criminality(the nonwhites) would have a much higher crime rate than a nation that may have a 1-2% non white populance but is full of white people who, according to you, are less criminalistic.

In other words, if nonwhites are the roots of crime, then they their natrions should easily outpace any white ones. Or are you trying to say that in a nation such as Estonia, which has a 2.2% non white population...

*source here:https://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/en.h tml

...the "roots of criminality"(the 2% non white populance) are somehow able to outpace, criminally, their home countries in which they, the "roots of criminality" make up almost the entire population?

As anyone can clearly see from my explaination, such logic("the non whites are cuasing the crime!!") does not hold up under scrutiny.
So, I ask again: is this higher crime rate a result of the supposed criminality boost of that 2% nonwhite populance, or is it just due to the fact that the populance there(mostly white) just has an issue with crime?

Logic would choose the latter.

-Saying Italy is more corrupt then a third world country is absolutely ridiculous. There is no way to measure the many ways of corruption in backward African countries while it is much easier to look at a place like Italy under a microscope.

Actually, it's not ridiculous at all, according to the actual economists, statisticians and researchers who study this stuff.
I'll be honest: I do trust them just a bit more than I trust your own judgement on this.

The fact is that Botswana, on the grand scheme of things, is not all that backward, especially when compared to other parts of Africa. The reson? It's corruption rate has been notably low.

They don't embezzle, they don't launch conspiracies, and they don't steal from the people. This is why they are ranked a few spots ahead of Italy. Facts are facts.

And BTW: You're going to need to stop with the "backwards african country arguement if you want to think of winning this debate, because the fact is that Botswana is quite the exception to the rule as far as "backwardness" goes. They are not corupt, and statistics there can actually be gathered reliably, making for reliable data gathering. The country is decently developed, and can keep accurate data on criminality. The world community recognizes them as a fairly well developed nation.

This is why simply brushing them off with the "backward african country" logic is not going to work. That is not only inaccurate based on the facts, but it's also worthless in a debate; your personal perceptions of Africa are influencing such a statement, not the facts.

This is why it can actually even think of competing with places like italy as far as corruption goes.

-Saying Jamaica is a better place to live then Russia is purely a judgement call. People will tend to favor warm tourist destinations as a place to live, but really! comparing a superpower that has a nuclear arsenal that can destroy the world, that has sent rockets to the moon, with a small island that is nothing but a place for white people to play is totally ridiculous and anyone that makes that arguement just makes themselves look foolish.

OMG, give me a break...no seriously, this has got to be a joke, right?

You're saying that a countries living standard is based simply on that places ability to launch nuclear weapons and field a powerful military, and launch rockets to the moon?

I mean seriously, do you have any idea what you're saying? You mean to apply that Iceland somehow has a lower living standard than China or Russia? Or that Switzerland has a lower living standard than Russia, China, or even the US?

Neither the Swiss nore the icelandic people have the ability to field a sizeable military(iceland barely even has one at all. The swiss have a pretty cool airforce, but not a very big one), and they have next to no Nuclear arms. Does this give them a lower living standard? According to your logic, it actually does!

Living standard is based on crime rating, infrastructure, healthcare, government corruption, and other measures of quality of life(such as the ability for one to find aid when needed, and the overall atmosphere of the country and it's civic servicews personnel, etc, etc).

These are the factors that determine quality of life. The size of your air force does not matter. You can have all the Su-30s that you want, and you can train your pilots on them as rigorously as you want(I'll admit, I really do love the Flanker) but the fact is that that is not going to determine your living standard.

The USSR was a perfect example of this: extremeley powerful military, low standard of living. Today,,russia still has lots of arms. It is in no way comparable to iceland in terms of living standard, and place like jamaica, Ghana, and Botswana do rank ahead of it in that regard.

-listing "rankings" which are just someone's opinion is not convincing, it's like the BCS or a football poll, some attempt at accuracy but still just someone's opinion.

Um...no. It's data taken from the UN, Interpol, and other major world organizations who actually send researchers out to go find this data.
Thus, it's really the most accurate reading on criminal data we have in the world, put forth by many sources world wide.

It's nothing like the BCS...at all.

-so much of your post can be taken apart if I wanted to take the time (I don't)

I'm sorry, but to be really honest here, you've completely failed so far in that capacity("Russia is better than Jamaica because they have TEH NUKES!!!)

Seriously, get your argument straight before you start talking about how easily you can defeat me.

Here are some weaknesses in your use of an encyclopedia's statistics.

-each country varies in the ability to correctly gather stats. Since the collection of data is done by the government in charge there is a large incentive to "cook" the books to make things look better then they actually are. How can corrupt countries expect to present true numbers? hell it's doubtful the numbers that the US govt' gives out are any good. Do I trust the crime stats from Namimbia, hell no, I don't trust them from the US either.

-statistics for a country are averages taken over a large population. Parts of the US are the most dangerous places in the world but so many others are very nice. What places are bad and which are nice? I'll let you guess.

-European crime stats are skewered by the recent influx of African and Arabs. The native white population has a very small crime rate, thus it is not an accurate picture to just list stats for a country when debating issues of race. Almost all white countries are mixed.

-Saying Italy is more corrupt then a third world country is absolutely ridiculous. There is no way to measure the many ways of corruption in backward African countries while it is much easier to look at a place like Italy under a microscope.

Saying Jamaica is a better place to live then Russia is purely a judgement call. People will tend to favor warm tourist destinations as a place to live, but really! comparing a superpower that has a nuclear arsenal that can destroy the world, that has sent rockets to the moon, with a small island that is nothing but a place for white people to play is totally ridiculous and anyone that makes that arguement just makes themselves look foolish.

You already said all of that.

-so much of your post can be taken apart. suicide rates for instance, do you really think Uganda keeps good records on suicides? Sure.

No, Uganda doesn't.

Places like Botswana, Namibia, Barbados, The bahamas, Jamiaca, Ghana, The Seychelles, Gabon, and Trinidad and Tobago do, however.

And suicide is often done by older people something some countires don't have much of due to short life spans.

I'm pretty confident that Jamaica has just as many 15-24 year olds relevant to it's populance as places like Norway do.

You did notice that those stats were catergorized by age, right?

Fraud, embezzelment c'mon how is that tracked?

By the UN and other world authorities who actually make it their duty to measure it.

That's how we know that Nigeria has a FAR higher fraud rate than does Switzerland. That's also how the world finds out about people like Mobutu, Amin, Duvallier and Ceausescu. We know they were some of the world's most corrupt embezzlers because of stats like these.

Yes, they are measured, and they are measured well.

And if the Norweigians are the worlds biggest druggies it must be one mellow ass drug because I've been there and they are the nicest people. The druggies here in Detroit are not so nice. African countries with low drug use? probably because the standards for arrest and prosecution are different.

Actually, in Ghana, Botswana and Namibia, along with Barbados and other countries, drug possesion is a felony, and is prosecuted the same way as it is in England. Why? Because the majority of those countries I mentioned up there were former british colonies, and they use English law systems.

If I were comparing Sudan to Norway...then MAYBE you'd have a point, since Sudan's system of law is far worse than that of Europe. But that;s not the case with the places I'm talking about.

Rape, I'll give you a rape statistic, 15 white women a day are raped by black men in America, you say women are safer in Zimbabwe then in Canada, I say bullsh*t, I don't believe it.

1. Can you even source that?

2. Even if it were true, the numbers for rape of black women in america are probably a whole lot higher, given the fact that 90% of offenses committed by blacks is against other blacks. The only reason that number looks disproportionate is because of the population differential.

3. I will give you as much as to say that most women probably are not safer in Zimbabwe than thewy are in Russia. But i will say that they are safer in Botswana or Namibia or Barbados.

Jamaica a lower rate of assault then Ireland, hell everone's on vacation in Jamaica, what is there to fight about?

Lol, you must be kidding...nice attempt at sidestepping this one, but the plain fact is that not everyone is on vacation in Jamaica. The reason the assault rate is low is beause the people simply don't bother assaulting people as often as they do in other parts of the world.

OK so some black areas have succesfully built up tourist industries to cater to rich white people.

Thanks for surrendering the point of the creation of the tourist industries. Yes, you're right, they have created these industries, and they do make lots of money.

which black countries have designed a boat? a car? an airplace?

Actually, Jamaicans did develope their own car and it's now used as a big part of their tourist industry.

http://www.islandcruiserjamaica.com/

And as for boats, Africans have been building them since the beggining of time.

which ones have launched rockets, developed a new technology?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/3141690.stm

How many prestigious universities full of Nobel prize winners are in black countries?

Black Nobel prize winners

http://www.aaregistry.com/african_american_history/297/Black _recipients_strong_in_Nobel_Prize___

Which one has a modern Army, which one is rich enough to send aid to poor white countries like Albania that could benefit from the riches of Botswana?

Barbados and jamaica don't have large armies because they aren't militant enough and they do not need them.

It's too bad, really. I kinda wish we did have some fighter jets or something so we'd lok cooler, but the fact is that jamaica doesn't need it, and neither does Botswana.

Is there a "black cross" that helps out other countries when there is a disaster?

There is an African union peacekeeping force.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_Union

They're in Darfur right now, and they were the ones who got that lunatic Charles Taylor out of liberia.

Who are the famous black architect's that design the skyscrapers in those large black cities built and run by blacks?

Guys like the people here

http://africanarchitecture.blogspot.com/

and here

http://people.africadatabase.org/en/person/18476.html

I mean seriously:m did you think that blacks played no part in the design of the buildings in their own cities? Do you think they just sat there languid, all the while simply watching instead of going to go research Africa and learn how to design?

I won't totally deny that some of the buildings in Africa may have been designed by white architects. But the fact is that a lot of them were not. Africans are not completely incapable of designing buildings, and they do build some of what you see there.

What pioneering medical advances are going to come from Jamaica and Botswana?

Researchers in Botswana and South Africa are working with European researchers on a vaccine for AIDS.

-those are the real measures of a people, not the cold, easy to fudge numbers out of some government agency.

Oh, great then, i guess this also means that the black crime statistics put forth by WN aren't important either, right?

 

[Guest]

FG30,

1) Ratings of so-called corruption indices are simply opinion. It is
impossible to truly find out how corrupt a country is and relate that to
others worldwide. Way too much commerce, way too big a world. That
ranking carries no wieght with me. You didn't refute any of my argument
that almost all the wealth generated by Africa is pulled out of the ground,
and that Africa is full of the most corrupt regimes on earth, and that it
lives on many billions of foreign charity. Stop avoiding the issue. It
makes you look like a fool.

I'm not avoiding the issue.

2) The infrastructure of these countries is indeed built by whites and
asians, and I know about it because I have worked in the industry for 20
years. I don't for a minute believe you are 15, but playing along with the
charade, that is longer than you have been alive. I know what I am talking
about. You don't. The governments of those countries try to have the
whites and asians train the natives to do the work, and when it comes
contract time, they swing some easy work the natives way, but they can't
engineer a decent sack lunch, so the song remains the same and it is
indeed the whites and asians who have built Africa beyond the stone age,
and not africans themselves.

Keep going...

3) Confusing the generation of the tourism industry, not only in the
Caribbean, but also worldwide, with the independence of countries is
ridiculous. Tourism took off with the advent of air travel and
deregulation, and also the development of ocean cruise lines in the 70's.
It had a lot more to do with technological innovation of creating large
vessels that were economic to rent out. The whites indeed devloped the
tourism industry there, and they are still the ones doing the heavy lifting.

Yeah, because the whites were the ones running the countries' governments that developed the industries.

You're now just repeating the same things over and over.

4) Your parents moved here because they think its a better country than
jamaica. So did my great great grandparents. Don't argue that jamaica is
such a great place, then move here. But that was the point.

Don't argue that Ireland and other parts of Europe are better, and then move here.

BTW, you do know that I never said Jamaica was better than America, right? All i said was that it has a higher quality of life rating than Russia.

Not only are you still lying, but you're just repeating the same thing again and again. I already told you that I was not saying jamaica was better than America in the last thread, but clearly you don't even pay attention.

Saying that
life in Ghana is better than Russia is a joke. But you can believe all the
false statistics you want.I belive the statistics that blacks are
intellectually inferior to every other race. There's lots of reliable data on
that one.

Yep, you've lost.

Now, all you have to say in response to me is "Your stats are fake!!"

I've got actual facts backing me up. All you have is your saying "Your stats are lies!" with no actual facts to even back that statement up.
And then you go on and talk about how blacks are so inferior, and how somehow those statistics are reliable, more so than my onw.
You don't even provide any facts to back that statement up, nor do you provide the stats themselves as I have.

You have lost.

BTW, I don't see Russians moving to Ghana. But I do see
africans and Ghanians trying to move to Russia, America, and Europe.

I see a lot of Russians moving to America and Western Europe to.

5) Russia has a long way to go to catch Ghana and Botswana?
Hahahahahahaha! Maybe in few years the russians will come up with a
space program that can compete with the one in Botswana! Or a
university system, or an arts, sports, mining and oil and gas industry, or
agriculture--the list goes on and on! But why talk to a 15 year old kid
with no experience.

I'm talking about this in relativity to quality of life rating. In that respect, Ruissia has some ways to go to cath up to Botswana andcertain other black nations.

At least I've been there, which is more than you can
ever say.

You have no right to say this to me after what you've been spitting out recently. You've been telling me how MY countries(Jamaica and the rest of the carribean) are run, when I have ben there and you have not.

Russians do indeed have better minds, because whites are
smarter than blacks. Period.

More racist propoganda with no facts to back it up.

Once again: you have lost.

Blacks are less corrupt than whites--give
me a break.

Sorry, but according to ALL reliable data that has been gathered, there are a number of black counries ahead of several white ones; pure and simple.

I have facts. You have none. I have factual analysis and stats; you have racist conjecture.

Once again: you lose.

6) Black people are the recipeints of massive handouts. Or do you mean
you personally? How do you know your parents weren't hired as quota
babies? just because they bring home a paycheck doesn't mean that they
earned it, or that they were the best for the job. I've never seen blacks be
the best at any intellectual endeavor. The actual point was a general one
and you are tryiing to make it specific to you. It is generally true, whether
you personally receive handouts or not.

We've worked hard to get where we are, and it's that simple. I am willing to say that we've had it as hard if not harder than many whites.

7) You see, blacks will just migrate here to mooch and never leave.
That's why they have to be cut off from their mooching and welfare
dependence. Whites don't want to live around blacks. Even if we left,
they would just follow us around and mooch. They can't make it on their
own. Just look how dependent Ghana, Jamaica, and Botswana are on
whites for foreign aid, technonlogical help, toursim dollars, etc, the list is
endless. That's why we need white separtatism. You don't have to leave,
FG, we just need to segregate you from us--I know, a fate worse than
death for the blacks! Funny how whites have no fear of segregation, but
blacks do. It won't be like it used to--I promise we will leave you
completely alone then. It will get to that point too. You'll see. What do
you do when nobody wants to exploit your labor, because they don't want
it in the first place? What do you do when nobody wants to harrass and
discriminate against you, beacause they don't want to be around you in
the first place? That's why segregation works. And its why the vast
majority of whites move away from blacks to neighborhoods and
churches full of their own. Once AA goes down, that segregation will get
a lot more pronounced too. Lots of the BS will end then. I personally am
eagerly looking forward to that day.

Too bad it probably isn't going to happen. I won't even bother refuting all of that, because it's pointless.
Black immigrants from Africa and the carribean do not come here to mooch. They come here for the same reasons your own ancestors did when they left Europe: to look for a better life and to get work done.

Keep on dreaming. Maybe you should just go move to an all white area to separate your own self. That still can be done, you know.

As far as talking and making little sense, of that you have achieved some
mastery at your fictional young age.

What would I even hav to do to prove my age, anyway?

Nobody ever believes me. Oh well, whatever.

Russia
is not a backward country, and neither is eastern Europe,

I will accept that. But botswana, namibia, barbados and Jamaica, among others, are not backwards either.

They fell
on hard times and suffered much under socialism, like the other countries
that have adpted socialism, but they are making a comeback and doing
fine, without the foreign aid, technological expertise, and moral guidance
of Botswana, Ghana, and Jamaica.

But with the aid and expertise of their buddies in western Europe and here in America.

BTW, you're right, they did suffer on hard times with socialism and autocracies...just like much of Africa.

By the way, anyone who thinks that Sweden, Latvia, Germany, and
Denmark are more violent than Africa is a just a lunatic. Zimbabwe is in
utter collapse. Civil wars in the Sudan, Nigeria, etc.

No, not sweden, germany or Denmark. Latvia may rank ahead of a few countires in Africa as far as things like corruption and otherfactors go.
It's definitely far behind places like the Barbados.

Just more internet trash. You're still good for laugh, though.

Haha...trust me: I am not the one putting forth the trash in this thread.

 

[Guest]

The tourism industry developed along with cheap air and ship travel, and
the increase in leisure time of the masses and of their disposable
incomes. it is the whites who are filling the coffers, building the airpots,
ships, planes, and resorts, so again a black country dependent on whites.

I'm not even gonna bother dealing with this same post again, it's getting old.

Listen: blacks run these countries. They plan their own individual toursit industries. The hotels, cruise lines and airlines are foreign; the indigenous industry is NOT. They dsign their tourist infrastructure. They market their country. They build the infrastructure.
In some cases, they'll even go as far as to build their own cars for the work
(see here: http://www.islandcruiserjamaica.com/)

This is basic fact. They deserve a ton of credit for this, and anyone with half a brain would give it to them. You're just being ignorant right now.

Also a ridiculous website full of ridiculous statistics that says that
Zimbabwe is safer than--well Gohan, you give the list of first world
European countries. Yes, Zimbabwe--a country in complete economic
collapse, where the people have no food, money, and are starting violent
uprisings and demonstrations against the government, is safer than most
of white Europe, according to Gohan. Sure buddy.

Not at all what I said. I simply showed that Zimbabwe's statistics of murder and other factors do factor ahead of certain white ones(albania, serbia, montenegro, Romania, etc, etc).
That is not most of white europe. That a few countries. Overall, Zimbabwe is definitely not a great place to be right now.
That is why they are emigrating in droves to Botswana.

You are so full of it, kid!

The crime stuff was what really gave it away.
Nobody is taking you seriously anymore, at least I hope not. I feel so
sorry for black people who clutch at fantasies to try to sweep away black
social failure, or who try to misrepresent themselves

I will say this one more time: I AM NOT MISREPRESENTING MYSELF. I AM NOT A LIAR! I REALLY, ACTUALLY AM 15! MY NAME IS DANTE XAVIER ELLISON V. MY BIRTHDAY IS JUNE 11TH, 1991.


I HAVE NO REASON TO LIE TO GAIN BENEFIT WHILE DEBATING WITH WHITE NATIONALISTS! I.AM.NOT.A.LIAR!!!

Go ahead, look on Stormfront. I've been there for a long time debating the same way I have here. Go and sign up, look at my profiel: it will say the same thing! I am not a liar!

http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?t=335402

The account name is DanteXavier, scroll down a little to see it.

I've got over a thousand posts there, and if you look at the profile it'll confirm everything I'm saying.

I've even been on this site before. Back in February.

http://www.castefootball.us/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2677&P N=14

I was 14 then.

One more time: I AM NOT A LIAR! I am here to debate on equal terms, farily and respectfully like every other mature human being. I don't need to lie about my age to do that!

I can show you more if you want, but I'll say it again: I am not a fraud, and I am not a liar with a fake identity!
Edited by: Futuregohan30

 

[jaxvid]

I guess I didn't convince you and you didn't convince me. SURPRISE! I will give you points for persistance, I'm sure you have had this type of internet debate before and had the most positive stats for your point of view on hand. I could spend the time and refute your points factually point by point by posting a lot of numbers from somewhere but it won't change your mind, or mine.

For instance blacks have only won Nobel prizes for "peace" and literature, political awards given out to further an agenda, you knew I meant prizes in the science fields. Also a link to one or two architects is not really proving that blacks actually designed much of anything, the African Union Peacekeeping Force is a joke and does not compare in concept to the foreign aid groups that go to ANOTHER people to offer help. Yes africans have built boats since the beginning of time, logs or rafts are not what I meant and you know it. Also african nations "helping" Europe develop an AIDS vaccine is not actually "discovering" a medical cure yourself.

But why I really want to end the discussion is because I admire your pride in your people that you would defend them. Also I would not want to disillusion you. I don't dislike blacks, I just dislike what they do to my people and culture. If what you say is really true, THAT'S GREAT! I'm all for it! I wish blacks would have greater success in the modern world. Because 1) I feel they are really f*cking it up right now so it would be fantastic if they stopped and 2) if they start to do so well on their own then maybe they will leave my people the hell alone!

It's not a competition. I don't care if black people do well, good for them I say, it is only that I think right now that they are doing piss poor and that is a problem for me and mine. It was not my intent to convince you that black people are doing poorly, I only offer the evidence to illustrate why white people are so pissed off. If you don't want to belive it....fine, but white people will still be pissed off because no matter how well you make the case, we see and live it everyday and no amount of stats or info changes what we see.

Good to know there are guys like you out there, but honestly I know and have known a lot of really good black people, that is not the issue, the issue is that there are just so many messed up ones. And that's the problem. A good Jamaica or Botswana is never going to help the thousands of a-holes that live in places like Detroit.

My solution is to promote and adopt white culture and bury that crappy black urban culture that is wrecking this country and threating the whole world, but you seem to understand that so there is no reason arguing with you, we already agree.

 

[PitBull]

Kid, you're assuming the statistics are true. They are not. It undermines
your whole argument. Comparing FBI, state and local crime statistics
which are accurate to some BS you found on a website is simply not
credible. Sorry.

You are avoiding the issue. You are the one repeating the same things
over and over. With no evidence at that. I never argued that Europe was
better than America. I argued that both were better than sh*tty Jamaica. I
didn't move here. I was born here. You moved here. You argued that
Jamaica was better than parts of Europe. Its not. You argued that what
success Jamaica had was mostly because of the blacks there. It is not.
Don't misrepresent the argument because you can't justify your
inaccurate statements.

Futuregohan laughers:

The intellectual inferiority of blacks is just racist propaganda.

Fact: the intellectual inferiority of blacks in comparison to other groups
has shown up on every single test of of intellectual aptitude that has ever
been devised. Stanford Binet IQ tests, SAT, ACT, Armed Services Entrance
tests, GRE, MCAT, LSAT, State and Federal aptitude tests, Iowa Basic
Tests, etc, etc, etc. It is one of the most well-backed up phenomena in all
of social science-- a persistent 1.1 standard deviation lower IQ than
whites--15-17 points.

I have facts to back my posts up:

You have some crap you found on an obscure website. Not one of these
so-called facts is has been independently verified, no metrics are given
for real comparitive evaluation, just subjective ratings, and no evidence
was given as to how the so-called statistics were compiled. That's not
science, kid. That's propaganda. Crime stats on blacks and their
intellectual inferiority have been compiled and verified by independent
sources time and time again--local, state, federal governments, private
left wing and right wing organizations, service agencies, etc. In fact, for
the crime statistics, they are probably understated, because a significant
amount of criminal activity is either never reported or the perpetrators
caught.

Yeah, whites emigrate to be with other whites. Not with blacks. Thanks
for verifying the truth of my observation.

I've dealt with blacks, seen how they work, and know quite a bit about
foreign building up of infrastructure. I've met a lot of different people
from different countries from all over the wowrld--black africans, indians,
chinese, latinos, europeans--all over. I remember talking to guys from
Nigeria who moved here. I asked them about Africa. You know what
these guys said? They shook their head and said thank God I got out of
that God forsaken continent. That's a quote. Africa is craphole. Buddy,
blacks can't compete intellectually with whites or any other group. All of
the engineering and modernization is brought to them by whites and
asians and maintained by whites and asians. That doesn't mean that
blacks don't do work--but it's not the intellectual work, the engineering,
the design, the finance, the planning that makes a country work. Blacks
perform the menial tasks. They might be the politicians, but they are not
the movers. And if the whites were to leave, you would find that out real
quick.


Yep, you're the Fred Sanford of goofy internet website black racist
garbage with no realation to reality. I know. I read it on a website. It
said Dante Xavier Ellison was full of crap. It must be true. It showed a
picture of a 45 year old black guy building a house of cards with a copy of
the Final Call on his computer table.

BTW, my ancestors didn't move here because it was a better place. In
fact, when they moved here, it was a worse place than Germany (late
1870's). They moved here and to take a chance that it would someday be
better. IF they worked hard. They BUILT America into a great country.
You and yours moved here because America was a better place than
Jamaica. You're not taking chances, with all the AA handouts and welfare,
all the plentiful jobs, easy credit, etc. You aren't here to make America a
better place. You're just here to put money in your pocket because
America is already a great place . You're here to mooch off of our better
schools, neighborhoods, hospitals, public services and culture, from our
AA handouts, college scholarships, easy and available credit, etc. all while
joining the black grievance industry that tries to tear down our culture
and institutions, steal money from our pockets, run after our women
while abandoning your own women and kids, leaving them in poverty and
peril, and generally giving the finger to the people that make it all
possible for you. As things get worse for us, they will get worse for you,
until we cut the millstone of black parasitism off. The day is coming, and
it will be here soon enough. You ahve no idea just how sick of black BS
the vast majority of whites are. You and your parents moved here
thinking that things would stay the same as far as the eye can see. But
that's changing. Running away from reality, valid arguments, and
referencing worthless, non-verifiable propaganda from bogus websites
doesn't change the truth.

 

[PitBull]

THE TRUTH ABOUT CRIME AND JAMAICA (AP):

Crime and Tourism - The Statistics:

It is often said by Jamaican government sources that Jamaica has one of
the lowest crime rates for tourists in the Caribbean. This is arguable, but
not entirely wrong. It is true that there are few reported crimes committed
against tourists in Jamaica. However, the reasons for this are often
obscured. The factors follow below.

Most visitors to Jamaica seldom leave the resorts, and when they do, it is
in buses supplied by the resorts, with guides supplied by the resorts, with
visits restricted to one of the few Jamaican "tourist attractions". These are
usually Dunn's River Falls, Martha Brae River Rafting, Fern Gully, Green
Grotto Caves, etc. Otherwise, few tourists take it upon themselves to hire
a car and explore on their own (this kind of activity is discouraged by the
resorts, with warnings of various possible dangers).

Many of the visitors to Jamaica who are included in the statistics are
arriving on cruise ships (an ever increasing percentage of recorded tourist
arrivals). They visit Jamaica for a few hours, and then return to the boat.
The only parts of Montego Bay, Runaway Bay, etc, that they visit are
tightly controlled by the police.

The few tourists who venture into the hills and valleys of the island are
very experienced, and know what to be on guard against.

The reality is that there are few crimes committed against tourists in
Jamaica, because most of them never venture beyond the tourist
compound, or Dunn's River Falls, or the craft-markets located close to
where the boat is docked. Those few, thick-skinned, brave souls who do
are very careful. There is an exception to this scenario - Negril.

Negril acquired a reputation several decades ago of being a very laid-
back, peaceful part of the island. This was before the coast road was put
in from Lucea, when it was relatively isolated. It has changed greatly since
then. Nevertheless, for those who are after cocaine, ganja, or rent-a-
dreads (for the white, overweight, middle-aged women who can't get laid
at home), this is the place to be. There are few actual "compounds" - the
beach is public and most of the hotels front directly on it. Meeting or
buying your entertainment of choice involves an easy walk of 50 metres
from the buffet to a patio chair. Lots of tourists like it, and if that's your
idea of a vacation, go for it. But don't expect it to be problem free -
Negril has one of the highest rates of crimes against tourists in Jamaica,
some of them violent [1], [2], [3]. Of course, there are many old-hands
who have been visiting Negril for years and managed to survive, so if you
keep your wits about you, it's entirely possible to have a good time.

At any rate, the crimes that most tourists are likely to be victims of are
not violent in nature (although this does happen), but thefts. Of course, if
you report this, it won't make it into the statistics anyway, so it won't alter
what is claimed by the Ja government about crime against tourists.

Crime and Tourism - The Reality:

The threats to tourists in Jamaica follow in ascending order of
importance:

Harassment: Outside of the resorts, regular harassment can be expected
to varying degrees. If you are white, and driving around, expect to hear
regular yells of "White man!", "White bwoy!", "Joe!", "Jakes!", etc, in most
districts, whether urban or rural (this does not apply to Kingston and the
corporate area, where the population is more mixed - it primarily applies
to the western half of the island). Ignore all of this and keep on driving -
you'll get used to hearing it eventually, and it will then be less irritating.
When walking or bicycling (and we do not recommend this), things can be
more intense. You will be approached by people who are very insistent
that you stop and talk with them. If you do not, you will be accused of
disrespecting them, and berated in an intimidating way. If you do stop,
tremendous pressure will be put on you to give them something (money).
You cannot win either way. Keep in mind that they are unlikely to chop
you, so don't fear for your life, but it is not particularly enjoyable having
to put up with that crap. Bottom-line: don't walk - drive.

Theft: In Jamaica, if it is not locked-up, or nailed-down, it is liable to be
stolen. This does not just apply to tourists and their touristy things, but
to farmers, shop-keepers, and environmental NGO's. It is a rare person,
whether tourist or resident, who has not had something stolen in Jamaica
(having your car broken into is a given, unless you, or an employee, keep
a close eye on it). You must always be on guard for this. Even if you are
very careful, the thieves will get to you eventually. When it does happen,
don't blame yourself for having slipped-up - consider it as inevitable.

Road-blockages: Obstructing roads with debris, burning tyres, etc, has
become a popular pastime in Jamaica over the last few years. This can
happen for almost any reason, from an increase in electricity rates to a
local case of food poisoning. It is unpredictable and liable to happen on
any main road at any time. This would only be a matter of inconvenience
if it were not for the riff-raff who take the opportunity to rob those whose
cars have been brought to a halt by it. Although the resort bus drivers are
careful to bypass the disturbances (they're keeping tabs on things with
cellphones), it makes travel on the highways dicey for tourists and
residents alike.

Stray bullets: Jamaica has many people running around with guns who
have no problem using them. The murder rate in Jamaica is currently
jockeying for top position with Colombia and South Africa, with Jamaica
pulling ahead. In past years, the gunfire primarily occurred in Kingston
and Spanish Town, but it is now spreading out. St James (Montego Bay
parish) has seen increasing levels of violent crime (murder), as well as all
other parishes. At this time, the chance that you will catch a stray bullet
(meant for someone else) while standing on a main street in many of the
tourist centres of Jamaica is not zero. Fortunately, there are fewer
gunmen in the bush than in urban areas, so the further you get from
town in Jamaica, the better.

Homophobia: If you are gay, don't even consider stepping foot on the
island. Not only is it illegal to be homosexual in Jamaica, some Jamaicans
believe that gays should be killed. The primary musical genre, Dancehall,
is replete with songs that encourage this [4], [5], [6]. This belief is often
acted upon, such as with the recent murder of Steve Harvey.

Rape: There are many single female visitors who come to Jamaica for sex,
using the hired services of the many rent-a-dreads who congregate
around the resort areas. Unfortunately, because of this, most single white
women who come to the island are now regarded as being there only for
that reason, and will be harassed accordingly. In Jamaica, "No means no"
is not recognized amongst some segments of the male population and
harassment can lead to worse things. If you are a single female, be very
careful about whom you let become your friend, no matter how good the
patter. [For those women who are hiring the male prostitutes, it must be
noted that the island has a very high incidence of HIV, and as you already
know, condoms are not popular in Jamaica.]

Murder: As noted above, Jamaica is one of the most murderous countries
on the planet. Tourists are not generally exposed to this risk (much of it
is tribal politics in Kingston), but it cannot be disregarded. To be clear on
this: Your chance of being intentionally murdered while being a tourist in
Jamaica is relatively low, but not as low as visiting Cuba, or Costa Rica, or
a hundred other countries. If personal safety is the main concern with
regard to your vacation, go somewhere else.

Crime and Tourism - What to do:

It is possible to visit Jamaica successfully, without being cooped-up in a
resort, if you are an experienced traveller, have your wits about you, are
cognizant of the risks, and can tolerate the harassment. On this last
factor, harassment, we must note that if you are white or oriental, it will
be a constant factor. If you cannot put up with blatant racism directed at
you because of your colour, do not visit the island.


All in all, a slice of paradise. Much better than Europe. Get your tickets
now, while supplies last! It must be true, its on the web!

 

[KG2422]

Even diamond rich Botswana has a life expectancy around 40. The living standards in these black countries suck. It's like how Saudi Arabia has an abundance of oil, but they still wipe their butts with their hand and are culturally inferior to the West. You can type until your fingers bleed, but somewhere in Botswana, right now, someone is wiping their face in cow urine or engaging in some other vile custom.

 

[Iron]

Nigeria succesful

Why are they along with other Western African country's like Senegal,Ghana importing huge numbers of refugee's, asylam seekers into Europe,but not only Western Europe but even some of the poorer country's in Eastern Europe and the Arab world,all trying to get away from the chaos,crime and corruption that is Nigeria.

Don't you guys have ANY reading comprehension?

I did not say that nigeria was successful. Actually read the posts this time: that was SARCASM.

Your far more likely to get jacked or murdered in L.A than Moscow.The Black homicide rate per population in Britain and the U.S exceeds Russia and Syria despite the wealth of the nations in question.Wealth can never paper over genetic factors in the creation and maintenance of civil society.

Time for world crime stats.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_percap-crime-murde rs-per-capita

An interesting pick up from this site. Check out the murder statistics in the countries, and you will see that Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia, Ukraine, Belarus and Moldova all have higher murder rates than...get ready for this...ZIMBABWE! Their rates are also higher than Zambia, Botswana, Namibia and Ghana.

Check this out to.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_ass_percap-crime-assau lts-per-capita

You are more likely to be assaulted in Finland, Australia and iceland than you are to be assaulted in Jamaica. you are more likely to be assaulted in Norway, the Netherlands, Ireland, Ireland, Spain, and the Czech republic than you are in Jamaica.
You are more likely to be assaulted in germany, Denmark, France, Slovenia, and Hungary than you are in Dominica.

All of these nations that I have mentioned have higher assault rates than Botswana, Namibia, and Ghana. You are safer from assault over in certain parts of Africa than you are in Denmark, it seems. Interesting.

Let us look at some stats for Burglary, shall we?

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_bur_percap-crime-burgl aries-per-capita

Australia, denmark, estonia, new Zealand, UK, Poland, Finland, iceland, Slovenia, ireland, france, The Netherlands and Bulgaria. You are more likely to get burglarized in these countries than you are in Zimbabwe, Ghana, Botswana, Zambia, or Jamaica.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_car_the_percap-crime-c ar-thefts-per-capita

Denmark has the second highest rate of car theft in the world. Australia is first.
Your car is safer in Jamaica than it is in Italy, Norway, France, Ireland, new Zealand, Finland, the Netherlands, Germany, and the Czech Republic, among others.
Cars in Zimbabwe and Zambia are also a lot safer as well, not to mention Ghana, Botswana, Namibia and even Costa Rica.

Now, let us look at Drug Offences.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_dru_off-crime-drug-off ences

Wow, lookie there. The Norwegians are the biggest druggies in the world, followed by the Swiss. Belgium, Sweden, Germany, Iceland. These are all in the top 10, and Finland is number 11.
Ireland, France, Austria and Italy follow it up, along with many other European nations.

Not a single African nation is even on that list. Ironic. granted, this list only goes up to 34, but this still says a lot. Aren't we "negroes" supposed to be drug obsessed felons?

Embezzlement stats.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_emb_percap-crime-embez zlements-per-capita

Zimbabwe is 2nd in the world in this one (not surprising, given the guy at the helm). But guess who's #1?

Czech Republic. Botswana is also known to have one of the lowest Embezzlement/Corruption rates in the world.


Fraud.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_fra_percap-crime-fraud s-per-capita

Germany is the leader, and by quite a wide margin. The UK is 2nd. New Zealand, Finland, hungary, Norway, the Czech republic and Slovenia round out the top 10.

You are less likely to encounter fraud over in the Seychelles than you are in any of those nations.

Manslaughter
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_man_percap-crime-mansl aughters-per-capita

Ok, I'll concede here, then. South Africa and Zimbabwe are in the top 5 here.
But Romania, Italy, Turkey, Estonia, Bulgaria, Russia, Lithuania, Latvia, Portugal, Poland, Denmark and Norway all have higher rates than Zambia. Botswana, Namibia and Ghana are not even on this list.

Kidnappings.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_kid_percap-crime-kidna ppings-per-capita

Whoa. Better not bring your kids to Columbia, fellas.
Nigeria is in the top 10 here as well.
Doesn't further my cause, but oh well, it's the truth.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_mur_wit_fir_percap-cri me-murders-firearms-per-capita
I'll concede here to. Zimbabwe is number 4. But Zambia, Botswana and Ghana aren't even in the top 32 with their rates.

Oh, here is a big one: Rape!
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rap_percap-crime-rapes -per-capita

Look at that. Your women are safer in Jamaica and Zimbabwe than they are in Canada or Australia. Go all the way down to #49 to find Zambia, and count how many European nations you see as you go down before you reach Zambia. Note how Botswana and Namibia, as well as Ghana aren't even on this list.

Robberies.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_rob_percap-crime-robbe ries-per-capita

Wow. Spain leads the whole world in robbery. Estonia is 5, Portugal is 7. Netherlands is 16.

Zimbabwe, Zambia, Botswana, Ghana and Namibia are ahead of all of them.

You are less likely to be robbed in Jamaica than you are in Russia.

Suicide rates.
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_sui_rat_in_age_15_24-s uicide-rates-ages-15-24
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_sui_rat_in_age_25_34-s uicide-rates-ages-25-34
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_sui_rat_in_age_35_44-s uicide-rates-ages-35-44

People in New Zealand, Finland and Switzerland must be having a pretty hard time. Almost every country on this list is European. Why are they all so busy taking their own lives?

And, finally, Total crime rates.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/cri_tot_cri_percap-crime-t otal-crimes-per-capita

Look who's right up near the top. Dominica is first, but Finland, New Zealand and Denmark come immediately after.

Want to try this little genetic crime argument of your again?

And the only reason why Jamaica is not another Haitti is due wholly to the fact that its a former British colony which is still part of the Commonwealth,therefore benifiting from favourable trading policy's with Britain aswell as substantial British investment.Do you know its British financing that builds Jamaica's prisons?

The reason jamaica is not another Haiti is because:

1. Theyactually know how to run their government
2. They never had a revolution. They gained their independence the old fashioned way.
3. They had a stable government. Men like Norman manley helped greatly in shaping Jamaica in it's early stages as and independent country.
4. They never had to deal with any guys named "Duvallier".

THOSE are the reason why Jamaica is not another Haiti. Stop ignoring them and give them the credit they deserve already.

As for Barbados,its benefits from a vibrant White tourist economy with many of the islands tourist infrastructure,hotels,resorts etc owned by American ,European investors which employ the local Blacks.

I'll just say this again:

The tourism industry in much of the carribean truly did not begin thriving until after these countries gained their independence. It was the leaders of these countries(the black ones) that began implementing strategies to increase tourist trade on the islands in order to increase profits.
Some islands, such as St Kitts, Dominica, etc, etc, have only recently become successful tourist destinations. Their tourism industries only began to receive grooming in the late 80's. Places like Jamaica have been doing this since the late 70's.

In other words, this idea is the work of blacks.

The industry and infrastructure are the results of the government's work(the black government, that is). The people being attracted(the resorts, the hotels, the cruise ship lines) are the foreign, european/american businesses.

This is probably gonna be the last time i will post anything on this.We'll just have to agree to disagree,i wont convince you and you certainly wont convince me.You mention the assault rates for European country's exceeding aq place like Jamaica.I doubt that as Jamaica,as already been posted is one of the world's most violent country's with its biggest and most damaging export along with other Black nations for that matter being its people.The Jamaican government at times has resorted to drafting in the military in some of the most run down parts of Kingston to curb inter gang gun violence.That dos'nt happen in Moscow.Living in England you can never convince me that Jamaica which is even dismissed by other Carribean country's as a toilet exceeds Russia,one of the world's most cultured and technologically developed nations.St Petersburg in Russia is a modern day metropolis with a growing economy.The Jamaican diaspora,and their second and third generation descendants are well known for the blight,violence and crime that they impact the host community's of Britain and i now believe Canada particularly Toronto with.Canada deports from what i,ve read hundreds of violent Jamaican felons every year,this mess coming from a country of only 5 million.Imagine 20 million of them.Jamaican men are known for grabbing their crutches ,lazyness,violence and persuing White women.That's about it.They've and their second and third generation descendants have utterly destroyed former,decent white working class community's in parts of East London like Hackney aswell as other area's of South London like Lewisham and Southark.Hackney which has a Jamaican population of around 60%,although i believe theirs been a recent influx of Africans aswell,its majority Black nontheless, leads all of Europe as the most socially and economically deprived borough.Worse than economically poorer nations in Eastern Europe,this despite Britains status as the second biggest economy in Europe.

You mention the assault rates of European nations,i don't know a valid they are but may have some credence.Country's like Australia,Germany,England,Holland,Poland with mainly White Anglo Saxon populations have a big beer drinking culture that goes back hundreds of years.Men handle their drinks differently,some get aggresive and most of them convictions i have no doubt are due to drunken brawls in which the guys in question are promptley arrested and charged with assault.Many of the convictions also stem from Soccer violence with rival firms.Not that i condon this behaviour,but two drink fuelled guys brawling in the street is alot different than the person to person violence that Blacks are disproportionately responsible.In London,Black males between the ages of thirteen to thirty are oughly 9% of the population but account for 80% of convicted muggers.Black gangs in the same age demographic are responsible for 70% of gang rapes in London which is a growing epidemic with 60% of their designated victims White.

The driving force behind modern economy's is innovation and ideas.Someone like Bill Gates has probably contributed trillions of dollars to not only the US economy but all the economy's around the world his products are sold,just from an idea that popped up in his head.Black nations don't create much from the products they create,which always the result of human resources,engineers,scientists etc to sell to the rest of the world.If their lucky their blessed with natural resources or a great tourist economy.For this reason they lag behind,which is detrimental to White people as millions now want to invade Europe to take advantage of superiour products and infrastructure Whites create.Nothing you post after this can ever convince me.For me this is the equivalent to arguing with some dude on whether the Astin Martin's a great motar car or not.You know the truth,but he dispels it by using his own analysis,interpretations,facts and pseudofacts

 

[White Shogun]

The most telling statistic of all are immigration patterns.

Where does everyone in the world want to live? The United States of America and Western Europe.

What effect does Third World immigration have on these nations?

Well, I'll answer with more questions:

Seen any videos of Paris lately?
Read any reports about gang rapes in Norway?
Assaults in Australia?
Crime rates in the USA?

Newsflash: it isn't white people setting Paris on fire (this time anyway

)

That's all you really need to know.

 

[LabMan]

White Shogun,

a fine bottom line post! As always,I propose a toast to your offerings ! and how about that jaxvid and pitbull!

 

[Bunnyman]

Here is a dose of reality:

BBC News, Jul. 20, 2004


Sub-Saharan Africa is the only region where the number of people living in abject poverty has grown over the past 20 years, says a United Nations report.

The UNIDO report says those living in absolute poverty in the region rose by 42% to 47% from 1981 to 2001.

It says absolute poverty dropped from 40% to 21% in the world as a whole.

The report says more foreign aid would help, but insists the best way to lift countries in the region out of poverty is to develop trade and industry.

The UN has set itself eight Millennium Development Goals (MDGs), which it aims to achieve by 2015.

They include:

halving the number of people in absolute povertyâ€â€￾those earning $1 a day or lessâ€â€￾compared with 1990
halving the proportion of people suffering hunger
establishing universal primary education
halting the spread of HIV/Aids.
But only a handful of more than 30 Sub-Saharan African nations were on track to reach the goals, said the report, by the United Nations Industrial Development Organisation (UNIDO).

The targets will not be reached by "the poorest countries... which are seriously off-track, unless the international community and the countries themselves engage in significant additional efforts", says the report.

"Such a breakthrough cannot be expected to happen as a by-product of development, since development is what is blocked to start with."

In addition to good governance and macroeconomic management in those nations, the report recommends that the private sector be developed, economies diversify and agricultural productivity be dramatically improved.

"The required higher growth rates are not unattainable. They have been achieved elsewhere by countries such as China, India, [South Korea] and Thailand, which started at levels of income similar to those of Sub-Saharan African countries today," the report says.

 

[Bunnyman]

More reality from a 2005 U.N. report:

"Norway tops the index that tries to assess nations' economic development, dignity and quality of life, and Niger is at the bottom. The United States is ranked 10th.

{snip}

Twelve of the world's 18 poorest countries are in sub-Saharan Africa, meaning one out of three people in that region live in a country that is worse off than it was in 1990, when the U.N. began to track the standard of living statistics.

The decline has been sparked mainly by the HIV/AIDS pandemic, causing South Africa to drop 35 places since 1990 and Botswana 21 places."

So even if Norwegians are the world biggest "druggies" thye create a far superior civilization than lowly Botswana.

 

[Bunnyman]

Notice things have declined in Africa since the end of white rule and the start of black rule:

Ed Stoddard, Reuters, May 23, 2005


JOHANNESBURGâ€â€￾The number of poor people in Africa almost doubled between 1981 and 2001 and the continent is home to virtually all of the planet's "ultra-poor" who live on less than half a dollar a day, a new study has found.

Published by the University of Cape Town's Development Policy Research Unit, the paperâ€â€￾"Poverty, Inequality and Labour Markets in Africa: A Descriptive Overview"â€â€￾paints a grim picture of a continent falling behind its peers.

Sub-Saharan Africa accounts "for almost all of the world's ultra-poor: namely those individuals living on less than half of the standard $1 a day poverty line," says the paper.

{snip}

"In absolute terms, while there were approximately 164 million poor individuals in sub-Saharan Africa in 1981, this figure had increased to 316 million in 2001," it said.

This gloomy state of affairs differs sharply from other developing regions.

The paper says that South Asia in the two decades from 1981 managed to reduce its levels of poverty by an annualised rate of between two and three percent.

POVERTY IN ASIA DECLINES

East Asia also reduced its poverty levels significantly, even with China excluded.

{snip}

 

[Bunnyman]

Here are some inconvenient facts about blacks and crime:

Nicholas Stix, Men's News Daily, Oct. 4


Imagine if one demographic group in America were 33 times more prone to commit crimes than another group. How would you feel about the relatively crime-prone group? The relatively crime-free group? Wouldn't you want to know about such differences?

But we don't have to imagine anything. The above contrast was not a hypothetical case, but rather the statistical relationship of black to Asian crime in America, as detailed in the ground-breaking new report, The Color of Crime, released by the New Century Foundation, the organization that sponsors American Renaissance magazine.

* " ... between 2001 and 2003, blacks were 39 times more likely to commit violent crimes against whites than the reverse, and 136 times more likely to commit robbery."

* Between 2001 and 2003, blacks committed, on average, 15,400 black-on-white rapes per year, while whites averaged only 900 white-on-black rapes per year.

* "Of the nearly 770,000 violent interracial crimes committed every year involving blacks and whites, blacks commit 85 percent and whites commit 15 percent."

But there are five-and-one-half as many whites as blacks. If anything, the numbers should be reversed. After all, as leftists always tell us, all groups are supposed to be equally represented in all categories, for good or ill. (Well, not really. Leftists never call on the NBA and NFL to institute racial parity for white players.)

* Nationally, youth gangs are 90 percent non-white. "Hispanics are 19 times more likely than whites to be members of youth gangs. Blacks are 15 times more likely, and Asians are nine times more likely."

* The only crime category in which Asians are more heavily represented than whites is illegal gambling.

* "Blacks commit more violent crime against whites than against blacks. Forty-five percent of their victims are white, 43 percent are black, and 10 percent are Hispanic. When whites commit violent crime, only three percent of their victims are black."

But how can that be, when for years commentators of all political persuasions have insisted that the majority of the victims of black crime were themselves black? But it has been true for some time, because blacks increasingly target whites based on the color of the latter's skin. The commentators have been guilty variously of lying and laziness.

* Far from being guilty of "racially profiling" innocent blacks, police have been exercising racial bias on behalf of blacks, arresting fewer blacks than their proportion of criminals: " ... blacks who committed crimes that were reported to the police were 26 percent less likely to be arrested than people of other races who committed the same crimes."

 

[Guest]

I guess I didn't convince you and you didn't convince me. SURPRISE! I will give you points for persistance, I'm sure you have had this type of internet debate before

Yes, many a time.

For instance blacks have only won Nobel prizes for "peace" and literature, political awards given out to further an agenda, you knew I meant prizes in the science fields.

No, I'm afraid you did not specify.

Anyway, what is wrong with winning prizes in literature?

Also a link to one or two architects is not really proving that blacks actually designed much of anything,

That was intended only as a sampling.

The point was to illustrate that africa, just like every other part of the world, does have it's core of designers who specialize in these trades. They do design some of the things you see in Africa, and they do have planners who plan out the construction of railroads and other things such as that.

It's really a basic fact. I don't understand why you're so afraid to admit it.

the African Union Peacekeeping Force is a joke and does not compare in concept to the foreign aid groups that go to ANOTHER people to offer help.

The African union and the red cross are both foreign aid groups who operate internationally. The african group is just continental, while the red cross is worldwide.

And then I could also mention the fact that the UN itself is headed by a Ghanaian.

Yes africans have built boats since the beginning of time, logs or rafts are not what I meant and you know it.

That's good, because I was not speaking of simple logs or rafts.

If you want sources for this boat building, I am willing to get them for you. Just ask.

Also african nations "helping" Europe develop an AIDS vaccine is not actually "discovering" a medical cure yourself.

Not likely, no, but I figured I'd throw it in there anyway.

But why I really want to end the discussion is because I admire your pride in your people that you would defend them. Also I would not want to disillusion you. I don't dislike blacks, I just dislike what they do to my people and culture. If what you say is really true, THAT'S GREAT! I'm all for it! I wish blacks would have greater success in the modern world. Because 1) I feel they are really f*cking it up right now so it would be fantastic if they stopped and 2) if they start to do so well on their own then maybe they will leave my people the hell alone!

Understood, I've heard that before from several WN.

It's not a competition. I don't care if black people do well, good for them I say, it is only that I think right now that they are doing piss poor and that is a problem for me and mine. It was not my intent to convince you that black people are doing poorly, I only offer the evidence to illustrate why white people are so pissed off.

This is just the part that I do not understand.

If you don't mind seeing black people do well, then why do you so doggedly refuse to give them credit for anything?
I mean, i've come here and presented some decent info about parts of the black world that were successful. I never said that jamaica was superior to America or anything, I never said that blacks are better overall or anything, etc, etc...all I said was that there are a number of successful black nations, and that blacks have shown they are capable of doing well with their own societies.

We are not all piss poor, we don't all live in poverty, and not al of our countries have to deal with civil strife. That's all I've tried to show, and yet with each point I put forth(like when I said "Barbados is as successful as certain European countries") you quickly tried to brush them off with things like "Barbados is just getting money from whites, they really aren't any good!"

I mean, seriously: if you really don't mind seeing blacks being successful, then why do you have such a huge problem with what I'm saying here? All I've said was that some black countries are successful, some of them actually can match up with europe in some standards, and that not all black governments are irresponsible.

Why can't you just accept that, then, if you don't mind seeing blacks being successful? I'm really curious about this.

Good to know there are guys like you out there, but honestly I know and have known a lot of really good black people, that is not the issue, the issue is that there are just so many messed up ones. And that's the problem. A good Jamaica or Botswana is never going to help the thousands of a-holes that live in places like Detroit.

Maybe not...but it does give us confirmation that there are solutions to the problem.

My solution is to promote and adopt white culture and bury that crappy black urban culture that is wrecking this country and threating the whole world, but you seem to understand that so there is no reason arguing with you, we already agree.

Well, you're right, much of the gangster culture is quite destructive, but that's not what we were arguing about anyway.

 

[Guest]

Kid, you're assuming the statistics are true. They are not. It undermines
your whole argument. Comparing FBI, state and local crime statistics
which are accurate to some BS you found on a website is simply not
credible. Sorry.

I really don't understand you.

I'll say it again: these statistics come from the UN, Interpol, Unesco, World Bank, OECD, and the official federal governments of the individual countries themselves.

How on earth can you say this is not reliable? You're not making any sense anymore.

You are avoiding the issue. You are the one repeating the same things
over and over. With no evidence at that. I never argued that Europe was
better than America. I argued that both were better than sh*tty Jamaica.

Here is what you said:"Your parents moved here because they think its a better country than
jamaica. So did my great great grandparents. Don't argue that jamaica is
such a great place, then move here."

You're implying here that I somehow said that Jamaica was better than America. Jamaica is a decent place, and that's what I've been arguing, but I never said it was better than America.

That was what you were implying with that passage.

And I'm not avoiding the issue. On the contrary, I've taken almost literary every post that you've directed at me, and responded to it piece by piece with lots of detail. I have not avoided the issue. Quite the contrary, in fact.
And please, don't tell me I have no evidence. I've sourced almost everything I put forth here. I put forth an army of links to my information as I presented it.

So far, you have nothing.

I didn't move here. I was born here. You moved here.

No, actually. I was born in Queens, NY, and I am a citizen of the US.
My mother was born in Jamaica. My father was from St Vincent. I have lived in Jamaica, as I said, from age 3 months to age 5. I went back when I was 9, and now I'm here.

Once again, you've paid no attention to the posts I've made. I outlined this all to you earlier.

You argued that
Jamaica was better than parts of Europe. Its not.

In terms of things like corruption and living standards? Yes, it ranks ahead of some places like Albania, Montenegro, Serbia, etc, etc.

You argued that what
success Jamaica had was mostly because of the blacks there. It is not.

You have not even come close to proving otherwise.

I posted this passage last time in response to this same issue. Refute it, and then talk to me about how intellectually inferior I supposedly am.

"Listen: blacks run these countries. They plan their own individual toursit industries. The hotels, cruise lines and airlines are foreign; the indigenous industry is NOT. They dsign their tourist infrastructure. They market their country. They build the infrastructure.
In some cases, they'll even go as far as to build their own cars for the work
(see here: http://www.islandcruiserjamaica.com/)

This is basic fact. They deserve a ton of credit for this, and anyone with half a brain would give it to them. You're just being ignorant right now."

Now, with that said: prove me wrong. prove that blacks in the government do not plan their tourist infrastructure. Prove that they don't launch government sponsored campaigns to market their country as a proper destination.
Prove that the black government is not the one sanctioning the construction of all those roads and ports, etc, etc. Prove that they are not the ones constructing these things.

PROVE IT. Right now, all you have to say to this is "It's not!"
That won't cut it. Right now, you are losing, and losing pitifully. You HAVE NOT been able to offer substantial evidence to disprove my thesis. You've offered no sources. You didn't even bother to refute my post about the tourism, all you had to say was "It's not!"

That won't cut it. You are losing this debate, and unless you grow a little rationality and sense, then you will continue to be in exactly the same situation.

The intellectual inferiority of blacks is just racist propaganda.

Fact: the intellectual inferiority of blacks in comparison to other groups
has shown up on every single test of of intellectual aptitude that has ever
been devised. Stanford Binet IQ tests, SAT, ACT, Armed Services Entrance
tests, GRE, MCAT, LSAT, State and Federal aptitude tests, Iowa Basic
Tests, etc, etc, etc. It is one of the most well-backed up phenomena in all
of social science-- a persistent 1.1 standard deviation lower IQ than
whites--15-17 points.

Oh, don't worry, I'm quite aware of that.
However, at the same time I have also found that the reasons for these issues are cultural.

For example: one study showed that black adoptees when raised among white households ended up with about a 95 score on their IQ, a full 10 points higher than average.
You'll note that such a score is about on par with some parts of Europe.

See for yourself.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IQ_and_the_Wealth_of_Nations#Na tional_IQ_estimates

scroll down to see the IQ scores by nation.

I have facts to back my posts up:

You have some crap you found on an obscure website.

Nationmaster is far from obscure.

And no, you don't have facts. You cannot source, nor can you prove what you say. I have reputable sources to use to prove that what I;m saying is plausible.

You have absolutely nothing.

Not one of these
so-called facts is has been independently verified, no metrics are given
for real comparitive evaluation, just subjective ratings, and no evidence
was given as to how the so-called statistics were compiled.

Interpol, UNESCO, the UN and the World Bank did a whole ton of that when they compiled these stats.
None of it's subjective. It's actual information from the most reputable sourcing we have today. These are actual sociologists, economists, and professional researchers giving us this info.

It's all been sourced, repeatedly.

http://www.nationmaster.com/statistics/sources

Crime stats on blacks and their
intellectual inferiority have been compiled and verified by independent
sources time and time again--local, state, federal governments, private
left wing and right wing organizations, service agencies, etc.

That;s exactly what has happend at nationmaster. You're making no sense right now.
The only reason you are not accepting these stats is because they do not show white superiority the way you want them to.

Furthermore, the fact is that you're right, statistics on the black crime rate have been gathered and shown. Nationmaster itself shows that South Africa has one of the worlds highest murder rates, along with jamaica. The US government has shown it's stats as well pertaining to the black crime rate here.

However, the stats I'm showing you here and not designed to refute those stats. They are simply different stats that show a different story altogether.

If you can find a way to accept stats from the US government pertaining to racial crime, but can't find a way to accept stats from the UN, Interpol and the World Bank pertaining to crime, then you're just silly. And you're ignorant.

I've dealt with blacks, seen how they work, and know quite a bit about
foreign building up of infrastructure. I've met a lot of different people
from different countries from all over the wowrld--black africans, indians,
chinese, latinos, europeans--all over. I remember talking to guys from
Nigeria who moved here. I asked them about Africa. You know what
these guys said? They shook their head and said thank God I got out of
that God forsaken continent. That's a quote.

Yes, and? My stepfather is a Ghanaian. He tells me that Nigeria's largest city, Lagos, is hell on earth, and that nobody should have the misfortune of living there.

What does that have to do with Botswana or the other black countries I mentioned?

That doesn't mean that
blacks don't do work--but it's not the intellectual work, the engineering,
the design, the finance, the planning that makes a country work. Blacks
perform the menial tasks. They might be the politicians, but they are not
the movers.

Doesn't hold up. If such a scenario were completely true then there would be no successful black countries anywhere at all.

Some black people must know how to plan, must know how to organize, and must know how to finance their nations. Otherwise, there would be no such thing as a successful black nation.

And, the fact is that there are successful black nations. There are many unsuccessful black nations. Do you know why those black nations are unsuccessful? Because their government has no idea how to plan or organize.
Do you know why certain black countries ARE successful? Because they actually know what the heck they're doing! It's really that simple!

Yep, you're the Fred Sanford of goofy internet website black racist
garbage with no realation to reality. I know. I read it on a website. It
said Dante Xavier Ellison was full of crap. It must be true. It showed a
picture of a 45 year old black guy building a house of cards with a copy of
the Final Call on his computer table.

Source? I've not heard about this.

You and yours moved here because America was a better place than
Jamaica. You're not taking chances, with all the AA handouts and welfare,
all the plentiful jobs, easy credit, etc.

We took plenty of chances. Had my mother moved back to jamaica after I was born, things would have been way easier for us. We already are in the upper social status down there. We already have plenty of houses, lots of family, etc, etc, back there.

But my mother wasn't like my grandparents who moved to England for a while and then came to stay back in Jamaica. My mother wanted to stay in America. She wroked hard. We did not get AA. We were dirt poor for some time. That's part of why I had to go live in Jamaica when I was younger; things were just toohard up here.

We were not eligible for all those welfare benefits, etc, etc, because my mother wasn't a citizen. We fought for everything: crappy apartments, crappy people, thieves, pests, etc, etc.
And now we live well. We have fought to get where we are, as hard if not harder thananybody else.

We don't get benefits. We don't prosper because of AA. My mom expects literally NOTHING from white people; she'll talk tot hem, she will befriend them, but she is wary and always has been because she lives in a white environemnt; she believes that racism is still common.

She does not complain about it, she simply goes and works every single day, thinking that she will need to get FAR better work done in order to succeed bewcause of the supposed racism.

I however, do not think the same way, which could be evidence by the fact that I even take the time to come here and talk with you. I don't really believe in racial Affirmative action. I don't want your grievances. I do not want your benefits. I do not want to be part of a quota. I don't want to tear down any cltures. I don't have the time to chase after your women; I don't need to waste my time with girls now. I don't have time to lie and to cheat. I'd rather gain a good education so I can EARN money, rather than take it.

I live by a code of honor. Stealing money is not honorable. Earning money, and reaching a high level through intensive study is honorable. I will hone my intellect the same way I've been honing my debating skills over the past 2 years, just so I can reach the level you see now.

I strive to be the best. I strive to maintain a high average in my classes. I strive to surpass others with my work, and stay at that level. When I get older, I may want to joiun the air force and become a fighter pilot. If I follow through with this, then I WILL become a fighter pilot. Not because I'm black, but because I will DEFEAT my opponents and get into that cockpit and fly as well if not better than everyone else.

I don't come here to mooch and put money in my pockets. My mother did not come here for money, because if she wanted that, she could have stayed in Jamaica and lived well like the rest of my family does down there. Instead, she came here, and fought, so I could have a better life. And I will fight to. I will not stand here and be told by the likes of you that I am inferior, that my family is full of leeches, and that I am nothing more than a parasite.
My mother didn't care about money. My grandparents didn't care about money. My family is full of intellect: my uncles is an associate vice president at Harvard. I have 5 cousins who have attended Ivy League schools, and at least 4 or so aunts and uncles who have done the same. I have an Aunt who is a head of a government division in the UK.
I come from a family full of doctors, lawyers and educators. We got here because we work, not because of benefits.
We don't cry about benefits. We don;t have time to do that. We don't need to waste our time crying about grievances here and there. We get places because we fight for things, because that is the only way you get something.

My grandfather could have also been a doctor, if he wanted to. Had he stayed in England, he could have made a ton of cash by simply climbing up the system and reaching a high level; it's not hard for us.

But instead, he chose to leave England and come back to jamaica. He left a deans position in England to come down and be a dean at a small, upstart Jamaican college. Why? He didn't care about money; he wanted to help his countrymen.

He became a well known educator, and to this day people still remember him although he passed 4 years ago. He didn't come to leech anywhere. He didn't come to gain benefits. he fought for what was right, and he adhered to a code of honor that I find unmatched in many men today.

My mother could have stayed in Jamaica, married a wealthy Jamaican man, and lived very well. She could have listened to my grandparents, who wanted her to pursue law. Had she done so, she would have made far more money than she has now.

But she didn't She chose a career with human resources. Why? Because she wanted to work with people. And why did she come here to do it? because while she knew it would be harder to rise up,she wanted me to have n opportunity. And I will take that opportunity.

Do you know why I type so well at my age? It's not because I leeched and cheated to learn anything. I type well because I study rigorously. I honed my language skills not only by debating, but by studying every chance I got. My grades are always high in english; that's not affirmative action. That is hard work.
I don;t go out and party on fridays. Heck, it's friday today. Most of the other kids I know are having social get togethers right now. Not me. I;m on the computer: i've got homework and debating to do.
I don't have time for that youthfull behavior. I have never even been to a party. I've never had a girlfriend. It's not that I don't want to be socially well off, but I understand the work it takes to become an academic.

Do you know why I debate so well? Because I have honed that skill over time. 2 years ago, I could not debate at all very well. That was when I first found this site.
2 years later, and I have improved greatly in that respect. Not because of affirmative action, but because of hard work.

I AM worthy. My family is worthy. We are as honorable and worthy as any white, asian, hispanic, or other black family is, if not more so. And damned if I will sit here and watch while you attempt to destroy my honor and that of my families with your racialist barbs and insults.

Running away from reality, valid arguments, and
referencing worthless, non-verifiable propaganda from bogus websites
doesn't change the truth.

You've not done a damn thing against me so far. I have yet to look at your family, your history, and your legacy and actually tell you to your face that it is worthless, and that your family is full of leeches, etc. I haven't dishonored your heritage by calling your family a group of white priveledge beneficiaries or moochers. I have not dishonored your home country by calling it a sh*tty place.

You, however, have done that to me this whole time, and in a very short span of time. You have no honor, PitBull. None whatsoever. No concept of chivalry, and no concept of respectful debate.

You will not win this debate because not only have you no honor, but you also lack the knowledge of proper debating technique(read:sourcing).
Keep going. Keep insulting, keep laughing. It will get you nowhere, and everyone sees your behavior for exactly what it is.

 

[Guest]

Here are some inconvenient facts about blacks and crime:

Nicholas Stix, Men's News Daily, Oct. 4


Imagine if one demographic group in America were 33 times more prone to commit crimes than another group. How would you feel about the relatively crime-prone group? The relatively crime-free group? Wouldn't you want to know about such differences?

But we don't have to imagine anything. The above contrast was not a hypothetical case, but rather the statistical relationship of black to Asian crime in America, as detailed in the ground-breaking new report, The Color of Crime, released by the New Century Foundation, the organization that sponsors American Renaissance magazine.

* " ... between 2001 and 2003, blacks were 39 times more likely to commit violent crimes against whites than the reverse, and 136 times more likely to commit robbery."

* Between 2001 and 2003, blacks committed, on average, 15,400 black-on-white rapes per year, while whites averaged only 900 white-on-black rapes per year.

* "Of the nearly 770,000 violent interracial crimes committed every year involving blacks and whites, blacks commit 85 percent and whites commit 15 percent."

But there are five-and-one-half as many whites as blacks. If anything, the numbers should be reversed. After all, as leftists always tell us, all groups are supposed to be equally represented in all categories, for good or ill. (Well, not really. Leftists never call on the NBA and NFL to institute racial parity for white players.)

* Nationally, youth gangs are 90 percent non-white. "Hispanics are 19 times more likely than whites to be members of youth gangs. Blacks are 15 times more likely, and Asians are nine times more likely."

* The only crime category in which Asians are more heavily represented than whites is illegal gambling.

* "Blacks commit more violent crime against whites than against blacks. Forty-five percent of their victims are white, 43 percent are black, and 10 percent are Hispanic. When whites commit violent crime, only three percent of their victims are black."

But how can that be, when for years commentators of all political persuasions have insisted that the majority of the victims of black crime were themselves black? But it has been true for some time, because blacks increasingly target whites based on the color of the latter's skin. The commentators have been guilty variously of lying and laziness.

* Far from being guilty of "racially profiling" innocent blacks, police have been exercising racial bias on behalf of blacks, arresting fewer blacks than their proportion of criminals: " ... blacks who committed crimes that were reported to the police were 26 percent less likely to be arrested than people of other races who committed the same crimes."

All of these are black American crime stats. I'm well aware of the issues facing the black american community, and I have not denied them.

None of what you're saying somehow proves thast Barbados has a higher crime rate than Russia, or anything like that. It has nothing to do with the topic.

 

[Guest]

THE TRUTH ABOUT CRIME AND JAMAICA (AP):

Crime and Tourism - The Statistics:

It is often said by Jamaican government sources that Jamaica has one of
the lowest crime rates for tourists in the Caribbean. This is arguable, but
not entirely wrong. It is true that there are few reported crimes committed
against tourists in Jamaica. However, the reasons for this are often
obscured. The factors follow below.

Most visitors to Jamaica seldom leave the resorts, and when they do, it is
in buses supplied by the resorts, with guides supplied by the resorts, with
visits restricted to one of the few Jamaican "tourist attractions". These are
usually Dunn's River Falls, Martha Brae River Rafting, Fern Gully, Green
Grotto Caves, etc. Otherwise, few tourists take it upon themselves to hire
a car and explore on their own (this kind of activity is discouraged by the
resorts, with warnings of various possible dangers).

Many of the visitors to Jamaica who are included in the statistics are
arriving on cruise ships (an ever increasing percentage of recorded tourist
arrivals). They visit Jamaica for a few hours, and then return to the boat.
The only parts of Montego Bay, Runaway Bay, etc, that they visit are
tightly controlled by the police.

The few tourists who venture into the hills and valleys of the island are
very experienced, and know what to be on guard against.

The reality is that there are few crimes committed against tourists in
Jamaica, because most of them never venture beyond the tourist
compound, or Dunn's River Falls, or the craft-markets located close to
where the boat is docked. Those few, thick-skinned, brave souls who do
are very careful. There is an exception to this scenario - Negril.

Negril acquired a reputation several decades ago of being a very laid-
back, peaceful part of the island. This was before the coast road was put
in from Lucea, when it was relatively isolated. It has changed greatly since
then. Nevertheless, for those who are after cocaine, ganja, or rent-a-
dreads (for the white, overweight, middle-aged women who can't get laid
at home), this is the place to be. There are few actual "compounds" - the
beach is public and most of the hotels front directly on it. Meeting or
buying your entertainment of choice involves an easy walk of 50 metres
from the buffet to a patio chair. Lots of tourists like it, and if that's your
idea of a vacation, go for it. But don't expect it to be problem free -
Negril has one of the highest rates of crimes against tourists in Jamaica,
some of them violent [1], [2], [3]. Of course, there are many old-hands
who have been visiting Negril for years and managed to survive, so if you
keep your wits about you, it's entirely possible to have a good time.

At any rate, the crimes that most tourists are likely to be victims of are
not violent in nature (although this does happen), but thefts. Of course, if
you report this, it won't make it into the statistics anyway, so it won't alter
what is claimed by the Ja government about crime against tourists.

Crime and Tourism - The Reality:

The threats to tourists in Jamaica follow in ascending order of
importance:

Harassment: Outside of the resorts, regular harassment can be expected
to varying degrees. If you are white, and driving around, expect to hear
regular yells of "White man!", "White bwoy!", "Joe!", "Jakes!", etc, in most
districts, whether urban or rural (this does not apply to Kingston and the
corporate area, where the population is more mixed - it primarily applies
to the western half of the island). Ignore all of this and keep on driving -
you'll get used to hearing it eventually, and it will then be less irritating.
When walking or bicycling (and we do not recommend this), things can be
more intense. You will be approached by people who are very insistent
that you stop and talk with them. If you do not, you will be accused of
disrespecting them, and berated in an intimidating way. If you do stop,
tremendous pressure will be put on you to give them something (money).
You cannot win either way. Keep in mind that they are unlikely to chop
you, so don't fear for your life, but it is not particularly enjoyable having
to put up with that crap. Bottom-line: don't walk - drive.

Theft: In Jamaica, if it is not locked-up, or nailed-down, it is liable to be
stolen. This does not just apply to tourists and their touristy things, but
to farmers, shop-keepers, and environmental NGO's. It is a rare person,
whether tourist or resident, who has not had something stolen in Jamaica
(having your car broken into is a given, unless you, or an employee, keep
a close eye on it). You must always be on guard for this. Even if you are
very careful, the thieves will get to you eventually. When it does happen,
don't blame yourself for having slipped-up - consider it as inevitable.

Road-blockages: Obstructing roads with debris, burning tyres, etc, has
become a popular pastime in Jamaica over the last few years. This can
happen for almost any reason, from an increase in electricity rates to a
local case of food poisoning. It is unpredictable and liable to happen on
any main road at any time. This would only be a matter of inconvenience
if it were not for the riff-raff who take the opportunity to rob those whose
cars have been brought to a halt by it. Although the resort bus drivers are
careful to bypass the disturbances (they're keeping tabs on things with
cellphones), it makes travel on the highways dicey for tourists and
residents alike.

Stray bullets: Jamaica has many people running around with guns who
have no problem using them. The murder rate in Jamaica is currently
jockeying for top position with Colombia and South Africa, with Jamaica
pulling ahead. In past years, the gunfire primarily occurred in Kingston
and Spanish Town, but it is now spreading out. St James (Montego Bay
parish) has seen increasing levels of violent crime (murder), as well as all
other parishes. At this time, the chance that you will catch a stray bullet
(meant for someone else) while standing on a main street in many of the
tourist centres of Jamaica is not zero. Fortunately, there are fewer
gunmen in the bush than in urban areas, so the further you get from
town in Jamaica, the better.

Homophobia: If you are gay, don't even consider stepping foot on the
island. Not only is it illegal to be homosexual in Jamaica, some Jamaicans
believe that gays should be killed. The primary musical genre, Dancehall,
is replete with songs that encourage this [4], [5], [6]. This belief is often
acted upon, such as with the recent murder of Steve Harvey.

Rape: There are many single female visitors who come to Jamaica for sex,
using the hired services of the many rent-a-dreads who congregate
around the resort areas. Unfortunately, because of this, most single white
women who come to the island are now regarded as being there only for
that reason, and will be harassed accordingly. In Jamaica, "No means no"
is not recognized amongst some segments of the male population and
harassment can lead to worse things. If you are a single female, be very
careful about whom you let become your friend, no matter how good the
patter. [For those women who are hiring the male prostitutes, it must be
noted that the island has a very high incidence of HIV, and as you already
know, condoms are not popular in Jamaica.]

Murder: As noted above, Jamaica is one of the most murderous countries
on the planet. Tourists are not generally exposed to this risk (much of it
is tribal politics in Kingston), but it cannot be disregarded. To be clear on
this: Your chance of being intentionally murdered while being a tourist in
Jamaica is relatively low, but not as low as visiting Cuba, or Costa Rica, or
a hundred other countries. If personal safety is the main concern with
regard to your vacation, go somewhere else.

Crime and Tourism - What to do:

It is possible to visit Jamaica successfully, without being cooped-up in a
resort, if you are an experienced traveller, have your wits about you, are
cognizant of the risks, and can tolerate the harassment. On this last
factor, harassment, we must note that if you are white or oriental, it will
be a constant factor. If you cannot put up with blatant racism directed at
you because of your colour, do not visit the island.


All in all, a slice of paradise. Much better than Europe. Get your tickets
now, while supplies last! It must be true, its on the web!

I never said it was better than Europe. I simply put it's living standard on par with Russia, and certain other places.

 

[Guest]

Even diamond rich Botswana has a life expectancy around 40. The living standards in these black countries suck.

Then please: explain to me why Botswana can have a higher quality of life rating than a place like Russia?

If it's that terrible, then why would it even be rated so high? None of you have provided a plausible explaination for this so far, and I'm anxious to see one.

 

[Guest]

More reality from a 2005 U.N. report:

"Norway tops the index that tries to assess nations' economic development, dignity and quality of life, and Niger is at the bottom. The United States is ranked 10th.

{snip}

Twelve of the world's 18 poorest countries are in sub-Saharan Africa, meaning one out of three people in that region live in a country that is worse off than it was in 1990, when the U.N. began to track the standard of living statistics.

The decline has been sparked mainly by the HIV/AIDS pandemic, causing South Africa to drop 35 places since 1990 and Botswana 21 places."

So even if Norwegians are the world biggest "druggies" thye create a far superior civilization than lowly Botswana.

If you would actually post the sources you're using, that would be appreciated.
BTW: I never said Botswana was better than Norway.

 

[PitBull]

Fellow Castefootballers,

This supposed kid is an idiot and never answers or recognizes any of the
points we make. He keeps changing the subject, avoiding issues,
andproviding BS statistics from anti-white socialist organizations like the
UN. This is a pro-white site and I'm tired of his BS stats and pro-black crap.
I would ask Don Wassall to either lay down the rules or ban him completely.
If anyone agrees, feel free to add your voice.