White flight

[highschoolcoach]

I've been a high school coach in both the Cleveland (OH) and Cincinnati metropolitan areas and noticed long ago that, once the black enrollment gets to a certain point, white football, basketball, and track & field athletes become almost non-existent. Some of the schools in which it is especially noticeable are Cleveland Heights, Shaker Heights, Euclid, and Maple Heightshigh schoolsin the Cleveland area and Princeton and Winton Woods high schools in the Cincinnati area. And, to add insult to injury, those schools are not even strong in soccer, cross-country, volleyball, etc., the alternative "white" sports that all the good white athletes could flock to.


However, it does not have to be that way, because Colerain H.S. in the Cinci area has powerhouse football teams with both black and white stars.


So why is this so? I would greatly appreciate some thoughtful insights into this situation.

 

[C Darwin]

I'm not trying to be smart, but if you have ever spent any significant
amount of time around blacks, you would know the answer to your
question. As a whole, blacks are more violent, vulgar, are poor at
showing respect, mass consumers, and rarely leave anything
improved from which they found it.

White Flight is the wrong word to use. WF implies that whites have a
choice to stay in the neighborhoods that they created. They don't.
The mere presence of blacks depreciates the value of homes, local
schools are sucked dry from the special education needs of blacks.
Resources decrease when you have to provide smaller class sizes for
these kids. They bog down teachers and administrators with the
discipline and attendance problems. Blacks usually score lower on
standardized tests. These results are often obtained by real estate
sales people. Good test scores keep real estate values high.

It's not flight. Whites are forced out of neighborhoods that they have
resided in for generations. It should be correctly be referred to as
White Diaspora.

The Cincy team with w&b stars must have a reason for this
phenomenon. The coach may have a connection w/ recruiters, the
team may draw from more than one school, the school might be
large enough to have "advanced" classes for the civil kids. Who
knows?

 

[highschoolcoach]

Apparently "white flight" is not the proper name for this thread. It should better be "white non-participation". The high schools to which I am referring are racially mixed, probably majority-white, high schools in which the term "white athlete" is almost an oxymoron. I am not referring to whites moving out of the school district. They are in the school district and in the schools, but vastly underrepresented in athletic participation.


The behaviorlal and academic achievement problems of blacks are well documented. I was a teacher in an all-black high school and it had lots of problems. There was a magazine article about that school called "The School Where Thugs Took Over". But,. I and, at least, some other white teachers had no problem. They respect you if you don't act afraid. But, that's not the point of the post. The point is "why don't white kids participate in sports in schools with a sizeable, but not majority, black enrollment?"


I think that its a point that can provoke some good analysis of the situation. Personally, I think that, in many cases, whites have just resigned themselves to their supposed, but not actual, inferiority.

 

[Deus Vult]

Personally, I think that, in many cases, whites have just resigned themselves to their supposed, but not actual, inferiority.

There may be kids and parents who buy into the black superiority thing. Only you know what your experience is.

For the most part I believe that whites just don't want to mix with blacks, at least not when blacks gain a numerical advantage, or when coaches let blacks run amok (i.e. act like blacks). When blacks take over a team, even when they are not in a numerical majority, it is because white (or black) coaches let them do so. Coaches cater to them, to avoid confrontation. White players get disgusted. Black players stick together and use their solidarity against individualist white players. Blacks run off whites by their racist behavior.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

Personally, I think that, in many cases, whites have just resigned themselves to their supposed, but not actual, inferiority.

There may be kids and parents who buy into the black superiority thing. Only you know what your experience is.

For the most part I believe that whites just don't want to mix with blacks, at least not when blacks gain a numerical advantage, or when coaches let blacks run amok (i.e. act like blacks). When blacks take over a team, even when they are not in a numerical majority, it is because white (or black) coaches let them do so. Coaches cater to them, to avoid confrontation. White players get disgusted. Black players stick together and use their solidarity against individualist white players. Blacks run off whites by their racist behavior.

I'd agree with that in total. I have seen it at one of the two white majority public schools in the Mississippi Delta. With a 60% white enrollment, the football team is over half black, and the starters are 2/3 black. In basketball, whites pretty much ride the bench, except for the occasional white starter. There is some participation by whites in track, but the whites are more into soccer, tennis, cross country, baseball, etc. I think most don't want to put up with the blacks, and some probably feel like they don't have a shot at playing time. Considering how most coaches are, a lot of them are right.


BTW, the argument about real estate agents using test scores to determine property values is a new one for me. I'd like to learn more about that if someone has the time to explain it to me further. The reason is, a lot of liberals claim that the real estate agents are racists for the devaluation of black majority areas. I would like to know why they use test scores, as neither I nor the libs I have debated this with knew by what criteriathey use todevalue the minority areas.

 

[highschoolcoach]

Sounds quite possible to me. I did not notice that type of thing when I coached track & field at a racially-mixed high school.But, it was a college-prep high school with generally more intelligent students and I tried to run the team objectively. Sprinters were those who won the intra-squad races, jumpers were those who won the intra-squad contests, etc. However, as stated in a previous post, initially all the white self-declared themselves to be distance runners and, of course, the blacks declared themselves to be good at all the other events. However, after intra-squad competitions, some white sprinters (with deceptive speed, of course) rose to the top.

 

[Gary]

I would never want to live in a mixed hood or send my kids to a mixed school. We have lots of American Indians here but they go to there own schools which seem to be rebuilt every few years because like the black schools I knew in Akron,Ohio they get trashed so fast. In any nation,state or big city with lots of blacks the same story is told-high crime,VD,low SAT scores,wrecked classrooms,low standard of living and morals.If a coach played more Whites then blacks on a team the blacks would cry racism and the coach fired.
We have a "mercy rule" here in high school football-the White teams seem to mercy rule the Indian teams every game.I believe it's 45 pionts ahead and the game is stopped.We had a team named Hoban{all-white] in Akron back in the 1960's who almost always beat any black or nearly all-black city team in football.The Hoban Knights.

 

[Gary]

Cleveland St.Ignatius High School is a very white school with a very white football team. They have been Ohio State Champs in football 9 times and National Champions 3 times. They are better at football,smarter in the classroom and better behaved then any inner city school in Cleveland or any other big city in Ohio. Akron Buchtel is very black and St.Ingnatius kicked there booty bad in football. You can't compare White schools with black schools it's like comparing the standard of living between Kenya and Norway.

 

[highschoolcoach]

All posts regarding white non-particiaption are appreciated because it is an issue that has bothered me for decades. Of course, the non-participation is not 100% and I can cited examples of whites who not only participate, but excell, but they are few and far between. Every once in a while a 6'8' or taller basketball player or a 250 lb. or over football player will not go to a private school and play for his public school. But, as stated, the examples are few and far between. In fact, I'll bet that you can go to a school and find exceptionally big white kids who did not even try out. Ask why and I'll bet tha tyou get some lame answer.

 

[C Darwin]

Coach,

I think your observation of the white HS athlete is limited. There are
droves of high schools, both public and private, with full rosters of
great white kids. If one was truly interested in the white HS athlete,
they would have to research way beyond what the media will offer.
These kids play though schedules and receive very little accolades
from the media. They play for the love of their sport because no one
else but they and their families gives a hoot.

I recently had a conversation with a inner-city HS boys varsity
basketball coach. He took over a team that consistently performed
well in sectional competition. He overhauled the philosophy of the
team and cut all the thugs. The team went winless in conference play
this year. He told me he never has enjoyed coaching more, now that
the riff-raff was gone. The team remained all black, but he chose to
keep the players with better recommendations from their teachers.

He went on to tell me that there has been MORE DI, DIII & NAIA
scouts looking at this winless team that stays out of trouble than the
thug filled teams that could score 110 pts on an opponent.

You see, this is what the white HS athlete is up against. The handing
over of sport to the black. It simply is being given to them. What you
see in professional athletics is not natural selection. There is too
much evidence that there is prejudice if not outright racism towards
white athletes.

Euro-Americans need to begin to claim what we want, if we don't, it
will be given to the lowest bidder. Edited by: C Darwin

 

[highschoolcoach]

To get the point of my posts you have to read the initial "New Post". It is not about lack of participation in football, basketball, and track & field in general, but about lack of participation by whites in schools with a significant percentage of black enrollment. Specific high schools are cited because I have been familiar with them, in some cases, for decades. Obviously there are plenty of white high school athletes who are talented and tough-minded, but, apparently,very fewat a number of high schools that have a sizeable, but not majority, black enrollment.


I follow high school sports avidly and know what I see. If it makes you feel better, there are contrary examples such as Warren High School in Illinois in which the very good boys basketball team is mostly black, but the very good girls basketball team is mostly white. I'll cite some other examples after doing some research because I don't want to "spout off" without first getting the facts.


As always, posts on the topic are appreciated. And, until proven otherwise, I think there is a strong tendency for whites to stop participating after the black enrollment gets big enough. Prove me wrong.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

I don't think its enough to just attribute low white numbers to a lack of interest. Just like so many other things whites are bombarded with, they aretold from an early age that they are inferior. This is certainly a factor when a lot of blacks move in. I think an equally important factor is that most coaches have bought into the big lie as well. They don't give whites a fair shot, slot many into certain positions, and a lot of the kids know it, so they don't even give it a shot. It doesn't really matter if there are a lot of blacks or not. That and the the fact that most whites, when given a choice, don't like to be around blacks because of many aforementioned reasons.

 

[cslewis1]

I think there is a strong tendency for whites to stop participating after the black enrollment gets big enough.  Prove me wrong.

I agree with that in total. it's a cultural thing, at least now it is. Whites are simply more individualistic than other minorities But it's hard to be a lone warrior trying to play football with a team that's filled with mostly loud and obnoxious blacks who seem to be joined at the hip in defense of one another, with coaches who kiss their asses.
So, one by one, the lesser whites say "screw that, why put up with the ridicule and hostility. I'm going to join the lacrosse team" and then it just snowballs.

The ones who stay have my respect, but for them to fit in they must start embracing the ghetto culture, or else they'd be really hanging out to dry. And that's what ticks me off, when our own sell themselves out.

I do believe too that whites have been bred to take the path of least resistance nowadays.We simply have attained a level of prosperity that is so good, we are afraid to rock the boat in any way. We can't stand up against illegal immigration, agains affirmative action, against teaching Kwanzaa in school for fear of retribution and being ostracized. Basically, we have lost our survival skills.

 

[highschoolcoach]

I don't think its enough to just attribute low white numbers to a lack of interest. Just like so many other things whites are bombarded with, they aretold from an early age that they are inferior. This is certainly a factor when a lot of blacks move in. I think an equally important factor is that most coaches have bought into the big lie as well. They don't give whites a fair shot, slot many into certain positions, and a lot of the kids know it, so they don't even give it a shot. It doesn't really matter if there are a lot of blacks or not. That and the the fact that most whites, when given a choice, don't like to be around blacks because of many aforementioned reasons.

I think this to be a good post because it is true to some of my observations as a coachat a racially-mixed school that competed with some other racially-mixed schools. As previously stated, my first season as the t & f coach at that high school the vast majority,if not all, of the white boys and girls self-declared themselves to be distance runners. Not believing that to be true, or not wanting it to be true, I required everyone to race in the 100 meter dash. And, wonder of wonders, some of the whites were among the fastest sprinters. In particular, a sophomore boy was hands-down the best 400 meter runner, and ran a leg on the 4 x 100m. relay because he was one of the four fastest. During the course of the season he gained a great deal of respect and the members of the 4 x 400 relay team insisted that he be the relay anchor man, in place of the black senior whom I had designated as such.


Regarding coaches who stereotype whites out of certain events (or positions in team sports), one of my white assistant coaches kept telling me that another white boy should not be on the JV 4 x 100m. relay and should be replaced by a black sprinter. Later in the season there was a JV meet and both boys ran the 100m. dash. Amazingly, the white sprinter's deceptive speed enabled him to run faster than the black one and he did not have to be kicked off the 4 x 100m relay. I'm convinced that the coach totally bought into the black superiority thing and did not even consider that a white could actually outsprint a black.


My final statement is that i wish to use this forum to espouse the message that white athletes should not identify themselves as victims of racially inferiority. They should have the attitude that they will make the competition beat them, not let the competition beat them. While one cannot lose if he does not compete, neither can he win.

 

[Gary]

Most young whites I know don't want to play on the same team as blacks, they want to play against them. It makes you train harder and play better and is more fun. We know were better all we want is to play them. European teams beat the "dream team" in basketball. Russians beat blacks in boxing. We won't even discuss hockey,strongman contests or MMA fighting. White Private schools beat black inner city schools so often it's almost funny. We want to play against them not with them.
If I was in high school and the school had lots of blacks-I'd transfer to a very white school and play sports with pride.I think most whites feel the same way.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

I agree with you Gary. All my experience around football tells me that is the case. I have never known any white guys who wanted to be the sugar sprinkling on a chocolate cake. I also agree that we need to compete head to head with and defeat blacks if we are ever going to see things change. Otherwise, we end up with private school leagues who never see any recruiters on the sidelines because of the supposed "lack of competition" that they see when there are mainly whites involved.

 

[highschoolcoach]

I agree with you Gary. All my experience around football tells me that is the case. I have never known any white guys who wanted to be the sugar sprinkling on a chocolate cake. I also agree that we need to compete head to head with and defeat blacks if we are ever going to see things change. Otherwise, we end up with private school leagues who never see any recruiters on the sidelines because of the supposed "lack of competition" that they see when there are mainly whites involved.

Gary and Colonel_Reb, I started this discussionfrom a different point of view and still believe it, but also agree with you.The bottom line is that whites need to confidently compete head to head with blacks, whether it be for a roster or starting spot on the same team or as competitors on opposing teams. As the wins mount up, perceptions will change and the annoying blather of sports columnists and commentators will get more sensible.


Lastly, I am glad that there have been so many comments posted. Not much gets accomplished if nobody does anything.

 

[jaxvid]

Here's input from a guy that played ball at a mixed school although a while ago but maybe it's applicable because I didn't really understand the situation until years later.

Sports, especially football and basketball is an "intimate" activity. I grew up playing with my brothers and friends. In those games you are in close contact with your opponants. You sweat on them and they on you, you hold each other, crash into each other, roll around on the ground, even bleed together.

Frankly, and this will sound quite racist, but I can't stand the smell and the odor of blacks. I know its all un-PC to say something like that but it's absolutly true. I was always grossed out having to have them lean on me all sweaty and stinky, getting that all over me, YUCK, and having to hold and grab them and take them to the ground. God forbid sharing a locker room and towels and stuff.

I know a lot of other white people feel this way. No one will ever admit to it, but is it really surprising? Even if it's not a racial thing it's a cultural thing. So what's the difference?

I would hope that blacks feel the same way about whites so it would encourage them to stay away. But it seems to me that they crave physical closeness with whites. There were black guys that I played with that were all over me and the other white guys. And we all know how much they like white women. Once when I was younger I was with a black girl, she was pretty but....all I can say is, it will never, EVER, happen again.

A person can't pick which things make them feel uncomfortable and which they don't like, which smells and sights, etc. It doesn't mean that blacks are "inferior" or bad, it just means (to me) that they are different.

This has been the way that people have felt for centuries. The current paradigm states that we are all the same. SURPRISE! It's not true.

I think that at some level white kids do not want to be with blacks in any kind of close quarters. They can't say why of course. That kind of truth is not allowed, but they can stay away. And they do. Good for them. If mixing is something they do not want to do then I totally support it.

To be honest I have no idea why any white man plays in the NFL. It must be torture.

BTW I have not mentioned the unwanted social interaction. I hated black athletes, they are even stupider and more assine then the rest of the demographic. That alone would be enough to avoid interaction. I am assuming that anyone of intelligence here understands that the reason white kids hang with other white kids and black kids hang with other black kids is because they can't stand each others company in social situations. That all should be obvious to anyone here but I thought it important to point out another important reason for self segregation in the athletic arena.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

Ditto your post jaxvid. Thats part of what I meant by whites not wanting to be around blacks. I've had the same experiences as you at a mixed school.The school where I played in 1992-93 in Louisiana was and still is about 65% white. Our team, strangely enough, mirrored the schools demographics. Even so, it was no fun being with them in the locker room. It was a whole different dynamic than when I went to an 85+% white school and was in locker rooms with almost all whites. I think one reason there were fewer blacks on the team is that they were just getting one started. After a few years, I noticed the teams getting a little blacker. After seeing some pics of their games last year, they look to be starting between 1/2 and 2/3 blacks, even though the team is about 50/50 or maybe even majority white. Edited by: Colonel_Reb

 

[Tired old White]

Col. Reb

I also played at a racially diverse high school. You cannot start a white player at a skill position other than QB or kicker because the blacks will not block for them. My senior year in high school the White and black high schools in our county consolidated. I was not a star I returned kicks offs and punts and occasionly was used as a flanker. One of the sports columinst for our local paper who was a retired math teacher wrote an article on the number of missed blocks on the return squad by black players when the guy returning the ball was white. He wrote a staistical proof that blacks appeared unable to block for white returners. This was like 40 years ago and no he did not get fired. We did however end up with 10 white players on the KO an Punt return team . The lone black was one of the two returners. This is why coaches at racially mixed schools will not play a white RB.

 

[highschoolcoach]

Col. Reb

I also played at a racially diverse high school. You cannot start a white player at a skill position other than QB or kicker because the blacks will not block for them. My senior year in high school the White and black high schools in our county consolidated. I was not a star I returned kicks offs and punts and occasionly was used as a flanker. One of the sports columinst for our local paper who was a retired math teacher wrote an article on the number of missed blocks on the return squad by black players when the guy returning the ball was white. He wrote a staistical proof that blacks appeared unable to block for white returners. This was like 40 years ago and no he did not get fired. We did however end up with 10 white players on the KO an Punt return team . The lone black was one of the two returners. This is why coaches at racially mixed schools will not play a white RB.

This is the kind of post I like the most. Somebody did something other than cite anecdotal evidence. The results of the math teachers anlaysis do not surprise me, although my experiences as a coach at a racially diverse high school were generally positive. (see previous posts)


Although there is very, very little mention of it, blacks can be just as prejudiced, racist, and mean-spirited as whites are constantly accused of being. To paraphrase Archie Manning in the book about the Manning family, not all blacks are noble and not all whites are bigots. Each race has it's good and it's bad and they can be better or worse depending upon the circumstances.

 

[Weltner]

"Although there is very, very little mention of it, blacks can be just as prejudiced, racist, and mean-spirited as whites are constantly accused of being."


No....they're far,far WORSE. It's racial pathology.

And because of their friends in high places( i.e. White and Jewish Uncle Tom/Race Traitors) they have been allowed to get away with it, since the 196660s.

 

[highschoolcoach]

To get the point of my posts you have to read the initial "New Post". It is not about lack of participation in football, basketball, and track & field in general, but about lack of participation by whites in schools with a significant percentage of black enrollment. Specific high schools are cited because I have been familiar with them, in some cases, for decades. Obviously there are plenty of white high school athletes who are talented and tough-minded, but, apparently,very fewat a number of high schools that have a sizeable, but not majority, black enrollment.


I follow high school sports avidly and know what I see. If it makes you feel better, there are contrary examples such as Warren High School in Illinois in which the very good boys basketball team is mostly black, but the very good girls basketball team is mostly white. I'll cite some other examples after doing some research because I don't want to "spout off" without first getting the facts.


As always, posts on the topic are appreciated. And, until proven otherwise, I think there is a strong tendency for whites to stop participating after the black enrollment gets big enough. Prove me wrong.

Case in point: Zion-Benton Township H.S. in Illinois


Enrollment is 52% white, 17% Hispanic (Caucasian), 29% black. It may be that all the white and Hispanic boys (but 1) are short, slow, and uncoordinated, but I doubt it.

 

[highschoolcoach]

Another case in point:


Warren Township H.S. in Illinois


Enrollment is 67% white, 17% Hispanic, 9% black.


http://www.wths.net/extra/athletics/bball/default.htm



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[Colonel_Reb]

Highschoolcoach, I guess I just don't know what you are driving at in this whole discussion. You said that you haven't seen whites bow ou, but admitted that it happened at the school you coached at. What exactly are you trying to prove or get from your questions?