Steroids and Black Athletes

[SteveB]

This is a good thread, but it is has been covered here many times in the past. I think if whites had been using PEDs in the numbers that blacks have been over the past 25 years, there would be just as many white sprint champions. The perfect example is Kenteris. He is the only white male sprinter that has been suspected (though he didn't fail a drug test) of using PEDs over the last 25 years. What did that get him, an Olympic and World Championship title in the 200m. If the list of white sprinters busted for PEDs were as long as the list of black sprinters, the list of white Olympic and World Champion sprinters would be just as long.

Prior to 1980, the 10 second barrier had only been broken by two men and whites had run times within 0.04 seconds of the world record. Since then, the 10 second barrier has been broken well over 100 times and whites are now over 0.30 seconds from the world record. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that the times are artificially inflated.Edited by: SteveB

 

[StarWars]

Completely true about Kostas Kenteris. In summary:


-Black people have been caught with steroids but not punished because sprinting is "theirs" and some people are trying to make us think they arre better by allowing them to get away with it, and whites being the "anomoly" would never get away with it.


-The one white sprinter who is suspected of taking the easy way out because of a nationalistic Greek goernment similar to Soviet Union allowed him to get away with itgot a gold medal at the 2000 olympics and ran a 19.85 at the European championships.


-Before 1980, although the advent of steroids and growth hormones existed; drugs were not commonly translated to track. Whites and blacks were equal or whites were slightly better. Post 1980 blacks dominate 100m./200m. by using steroids.


Solutions: make track an amateur sport or make steroids legal for everyone


Must be done: take away records that are steeroid aided and implement one of the solutions. Disregard racial stereotypes so every race is confident on the track, and the "superior" blacks have no false confidence. And be aware that whites can run fast too.

Edited by: StarWars

 

[SteveB]

-The one white sprinter who is suspected of taking the easy way out because of a nationalistic Greek goernment similar to Soviet Union allowed him to get away with it  got a gold medal at the 2000 olympics and ran a 19.85 at the European championships.

Don't forget that he won the 2001 World Championships in a time of 20.04, beating Shawn Crawford, Kim Collins, and Christopher Williams.Edited by: SteveB

 

[GiovaniMarcon]

One thing worth mentioning, and I think it's kind of important -- people who supposedly believe in the equality of races find nothing wrong with trumpeting the so-called "Asian IQ superiority" over Caucasians (which in itself is very minor) as a vindictive weapon to use against whites who point out the IQ differences between first and third world peoples -- as if to say, it's okay to imply that Asians are a superior race intellectually over whites, but it's never okay to say anyone is intellectually superior over blacks, and especially not okay for whites to do it.

It seems people who always apologize for black failure or lack of achievement want to have it both ways.

As it stands, I'm perfectly willing to concede that East Asians have, on average, higher IQs than white Europeans, but that difference is very slight, and, I believe, part of it has to do with the incredibly high pressure Asian families put on their children to succeed.
Nevertheless, whites on average "can hang" with the best Asian minds, where as Blacks -- cultural allowances accounted for -- have a much harder time of it.

It's seems okay for people to laugh at whites and lie about us not being able to jump, but woe betide the man who implies black people shouldn't take up room in college classrooms from vastly superior white and asian kids.

 

[StarWars]

To be honest I do not believe IQs are entirely accurate. GiovaniMarcon makes a good point about how white people cannot claim to be smarter than blacks but Asians can claim to be smarter than whites.


IQ in my opinion is entirely irrelivent to actual intelligience. Real intelligeience is the ability to apply knowledge, not copy or memorize it. Through culture Asians have focussed entirely on rotor memory when it comes to learning, and Western culture, although its destructive capacity is arguably a worse culture, is more successful based on active learning. We invented capitalism, separation of powers, and have proven to be the best philosophers such as John Locke.


Intelligience has nothing to do with any test in my opinion, but an indepth understanding and search for who we are. To understand oneself is in my opinion genious.


No race is really "superior," as long as we learn to capitalize on our strengths whether through culture or inherited genes.


One fact remains: Whites are as fast or faster than any other race. And if nobody proves it soon then I'm just going to hae to do it myself.

 

[jaxvid]

To be honest I do not believe IQs are entirely accurate. GiovaniMarcon makes a good point about how white people cannot claim to be smarter than blacks but Asians can claim to be smarter than whites.


IQ in my opinion is entirely irrelivent to actual intelligience. Real intelligeience is the ability to apply knowledge, not copy or memorize it. Through culture Asians have focussed entirely on rotor memory when it comes to learning, and Western culture, although its destructive capacity is arguably a worse culture, is more successful based on active learning. We invented capitalism, separation  of powers, and have proven to be the best philosophers such as John Locke.


Intelligience has nothing to do with any test in my opinion, but an indepth understanding and search for who we are. To understand oneself is in my opinion genious.


No race is really "superior," as long as we learn to capitalize on our strengths whether through culture or inherited genes.


One fact remains: Whites are as fast or faster than any other race. And if nobody proves it soon then I'm just going to hae to do it myself.

If Asians have superior "rotor" intelligence as you say then why didn't they invent the helicopter??

Just kidding!

The thing about IQ tests is this-----they may not measure what you or I think is "intelligence" but they DO predict with AMAZING accuracy a whole bunch of things about a person and the group that they belong to. Things like school grades, criminal behavior, good moral actions, are ALL very closely related to IQ scores. It would be ridiculous to ignore such great predictive information no matter what the results or how they break down by race. A high IQ person will be better behaved and more succesful in almost ALL cases in society. Why dismiss that kind of evidence?

 

[StarWars]

I agree that it is a general estimate of intelligience, but it is based too heavily on logic. Obiously someone with an IQ below 90 isn't going to be a success for the most part, but there are other facets of intelligience that are far more important, like the ability to communicate, express yourself through language and writing, and creativity.


IQ tests just measure potential I guess I'm trying to say. And I think EastAsians score high just because they are forced to learn and memorize material from a young age, where white kids are usually encouraged to be creative.


I think a high test score doesn't mean someone is smart, but a very low test score probably means the person isn't. I just had a hard time explaining that.


I admit I am undecided to whether black IQ is so hugely low because of culture or genetics. I am now going on thin ice but I am leaning towards believing black people are slightly dumber, but not as dumb as the test indicates. Edited by: StarWars

 

[Jimmy Chitwood]

I admit I am undecided to whether black IQ is so hugely low because of culture or genetics. I am now going on thin ice but I am leaning towards believing black people are slightly dumber, but not as dumb as the test indicates.

been around many blacks for externded periods of time, mate?


from my personal experience, which is a lifetime of playing athletics and working around them, if anything i'd submit that blacks are actually dumber than the test indicates. especially considering how virtually every test known to man has to be significantly altered in order not to have blacks score EXTREMELY lower than every other ethnic group.


recently, blacks have even claimed that multiple choice tests (the easiest test format out there) is racist.


i mean, seriously, is there any way that blacks can possibly measure up to anyone else on matters non-athletic? the answer, of course, is a big fat NO.

 

[StarWars]

What makes it hard to argue that blacks are NOT faster than us and they ARE dumber than us is that society needs to concede something. I do not approve of this, but society has given blacks sprinting probably because most people know deep down that black people are not as as intelligient as whites. Some people may view me as a white supremecist just because I want to argue that white people are just as fast and smarter, but in reality it is the only logical argument.


Black people have only proven they are faster than white people when they are on steroids and we are not; that is whatwe have proven in this thread. The only white person to follow suit, Kostas Kenteris, won a gold medal and ran a 19.85.


Society needs to preach only facts. Their opinion should be that whites and blacks are athletically equal when noton steroids, and black people are slightly less intelligient on average. That does not mean that black people cannot be smart, and that white people cannot be dumb.


The amazing thing about our capitalistc society is that anybody can make anything of themselves if they want to, even black people. We need to stop treating them like babies and let them mature, and eradicate steroid use or make them legal. A main obstacle of this is that many stupid fans are enamored with watching black athletes, and view whites as boring.


Some whites are just going to have to step up like Sebastian Bayer, Craig Pickering, Fabio Cerutti, Christophe Lemaitre, Christian Blum, and Jeremy Wariner. They need to prove that whites can win the Gold too, and if they don't I am going to have to.


I always ask myself when this caste system will end though, and sometimes I think we should encourage our athletes to take steroids. Sometimes I think maybe we should let the system get so out of hand that whites wake up. I just don't know...all I can do is hope we make it.Edited by: StarWars

 

[The Hock]

A Tough J. Riggins fades away, a StarWars pops up. Hmmm.Edited by: The Hock

 

[dwid]

toughj was more into football, starwars seems to know alot about track, i doubt its the same personEdited by: dwid

 

[The Hock]

Just sayin'...juuust sayin'...

 

[white lightning]

Not the same person. Trust me I know. I understand why people think that as we do have people come and go sometimes under different names.

I think all of the white sprinters should retire so we can just watch star wars go sub 10/sub 20 and sub 43!

StarWars will be the worlds greatest sprinter!

 

[StarWars]

Don't patronize me White Lightning

. I don't have the speed endurance to run a 200 or 400 meter dash. I think I can start running some very elite times once I squat a lot more weight. The turnover is already there.

I am not Tough J. Riggins. He is taking a break and will be back again, he's done it before.

Edited by: StarWars

 

[Jimmy Chitwood]

how old are you StarWars, if i may be so bold?

 

[StarWars]

23

A common argument that black people are faster than white people is that white people lack "fast twitch muscles." That is why we lose the 100 meter and 200 meter sprints.

So therefore whites should not dominate other fast twitch explosive events such as high jump, recently long jump, shot put, javelin, hammer throw, discus throw, and weightlifting. But we do.

So how do you explain this so called mystery of black dominance in sprinting, specifically sprint endurance races such as the 100 and 200 meter? Simple: steroids. How do you explain why this dominance is in the last 20 years? Simple; steroids.

It is also a lie that you cannot improvee your speed. You are confined to the speed the amount of fast twitch muscles your body has. Please. Most highschool athletes will improve their 100 meter by over a second to the low 11s by senior year off of a couple hills and squats alone.

Even if black people have more fast twitch muscles, they are obviously not the determinant of speed, or lifting, or throwing, or jumping. I bet I could take any skinny white kid and improve his natural 100 meter by over a second within a month. I'd bet my life on that. I dont care how many fast twitch muscles he has. Most healthy people with training could break 12 sec. with mild training.Edited by: StarWars

 

[StarWars]

Best performances:

High Jump: Technically best 9 out of 10. Or 10 out of twelve are white. The black people are the 1st, 11th, and 12th, although the 1st, Javier Sotomayor, tested positive for both anabolic steroids and cocaine. I call that complete domination.

Shot Put:Top ten shot putters in history. Enough said.

Triple Jump: Although 9 out of the top ten are black, the best by a long shot is white, being the only man to kill 18 meters.

These are events that require fast, explosive movements, strength, and speed. Things white people are not supposed to have.

I tried to research how well white people were sprinting before 1980, but it is really hard. IAAF only goves back to the 90's in their archives. My bet is they dominated it, and there were just as many black athletes. The obvious white sprinters are Shrirvo, Mennea, Kenteris, Wells, Borzov, and Nagel.



Edited by: StarWars

 

[j41181]

Jonathan Edwards is still the best. I saw his triple jump record in 1994 or 1995. It's still the stuff of legends.

 

[StarWars]

Jonothan Edwards is so fast and explosive!

Regarding high jump, my theory is that whites dominate it because steroids do not play as much of a role in it as in sprinting. I mean, everyone is so skinny, so it is more about raw talent. Javier Sotomayor, the black world record holder, was caught with roids and cocaine to make up for his lack of ability, yet he still legally has the record. I wonder why?

 

[StarWars]

Unfortunately steroids help speed endurance. This is what the 100 meter dash and 200 meter dash measures. This is why blacks have done so well in the past 20 years. I don't thik steroids help top speed that much, other than that it allows you to train harder and more often, and also lift weights with a shorter recovery time.

 

[StarWars]

The best race in track to measure real speed and not speed endurance is the 60 meter dash. The second fastest man in African history is a white man: Morne Nagel 6.48 60 meter dash. If this is true, i don't know why this has not occurred to me before. Tt is the perfect one liner rebuttal to an ignorant person: the second fastest man in AFRICAN history is white. LOL

That is much more embarrassing than the fastest man in America being Black, because they are 13% of our population, but we are like 2% of Africa's population.HAHAHA

I think we should disregard any of the USA or Carribbean records in sprints. They are both cheaters and liars when it comes to performance enhancing drugs!

 

[white lightning]

Very good point S.W. Morne Nagel was so quick out of the blocks. The funny thing is that he was very skinny. He never had the build of these roided up guys that he raced against. I think he would have gone sub 10 if he would have added some more strength. He would just not hold his form over the last 30-40 meters.

What is weird however is that he actually was a very good 200 meter runner. It seems like if he had the endurance for that, he would run a faster 100. One thing that hurt Morne Nagel is that he trained in Africa. Just like Australian Sprinters, they peak at the wrong time of the year. They tend to burn out come summer where the big money meets are. They really need to limit their races for those countries with there summers being most other countries winters.

 

[StarWars]

I saw that he ran a 20.11 200 meter and a 6.48 60 meter dash. In my opinion this is all mental he never went sub 10. Also skinny guys don't do very well over the last 40 meters, I would know; maybe that explains it.

White people make up 6.5% of South Africa's population but always produce the best sprinters like Wilhelm Van der Vyver and Nagel. How is Van der Vyver doing by the way?

Does anyone have a vid of Nagel racing, Ive never seen it before?

 

[StarWars]

Also people need to realize that it is stupid to say whites are stronger but slower. White successes in powerlifting should equate to success on the track. The only reason it doesn't is because speed endurance is what wins races in track, and STEROIDS help speed endurance. Who does steroids: black people.

Ive been told black people are faster because they had to run from lions and hyinas. Well, that makes no sense because I'm pretty sure sabre tooths were just as scary!

 

[white lightning]

You know I have never seen Nagel anywhere on youtube. Kind of strange. I will let you know if I can find a video of him racing anywhere. Wilhelm has been missing in action. Not sure what he is doing but I imagine it must be related to school. Hopefully he will start racing more this summer.

Another young guy to watch is Julian Reuss of Germany. He has some nice potential.