Slow Black Running Backs Play Forever

[Don Wassall]

Two snail-like running backs with few moves but incredible NFL staying power have signed with new teams. Antowain Smith is now the backup for Deuce McAllister in New Orleans, while Ron Dayne, one of the biggest busts in NFL history, signed with Denver.


Smith, 33, has averaged over 4.0 yards per carry just once in his career. Dayne is short, fat, slow, has very little power and even fewer moves. A white running back with similar attributes -- assuming one like that couldby some miraclebe a high draft pick as Dayne was -- would have been laughed out of the league in no time flat, but these guys are like the Energizer Rabbit when it comes to the NFL.

 

[white lightning]

Exactly Don.Chance Kretschmer might not get drafted
because he runs a 4.6.Ron Dayne,Smith,M.Clarett and
many others are looked at as stars even though they
are alot slower than Chance.Gee,I have no idea why that
could be?We all know the sad truth.Why is Matt Jones
not the first pick in the draft?Why is he not allowed
to be a qb or even a number one receiver?How can you
put a guy that runs a 4.37 40 at the slot receiver or
tight end.Give me a break!We could go on and on.Why
was Mike Alstott forced to play fullback?You get my
drift.We need a Lumsden to break through worse than ever.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

LOL Don, Your right! They just keep going and going. It is unreal the extent to which coaches have bought into the lie when it comes to black speed, RB's etc. They are really hurting the league.

 

[Bear-Arms]

Clarett shouldn't even be drafted, but you can add Anthony Thomas to
slow runningback although he is yet to sign with anyone.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

Clarett needs to go back to wherever he came from and get a job. His actions prove he shouldn't be on an NFL squad. Plus he's slow. I could almost outrun him in high school.

 

[bigunreal]

Don't forget the Packers during the mid-90s, when their running game
was in the hands of two incredily slow, should-have-been FBs, Edgar
Bennett and Dorsey Levens.During at least part of this time, they had
the young Travis Jersey on the roster, and never seriously considered
letting him take carries away from these two plodders, even though he
was much, much faster than either of them. Levens continues to
get carries with the Eagles at tailback. Incredible!



In recent years, the NFL has seen a bevy of plodding black RBs be given
a lot more chance than they deserve to start for their teams. Some of
these, off the top of my head: Shawn Bryson (slow FB allowed to get
substanial carries in Buffalo and Detroit); Iron Head Heyward (huge,
slow and full of off-field problems, yet the league seemed to love
putting the ball in his hands); Duce Staley (productive but he'd
unquestionably be a typical blocking FB if he were white); Jerome
Bettis (this guy will make the Hall of Fame, but can you imagine a
white guy that fat, who wanted to play RB, even making it through one
preseason game before being cut?); Eric Pegram (real overachiever who
was handed the starting job for awhile in Atlanta); Tyrone
Wheatley (another slow RB who has had a decent career and never lacked
for opportunities). There are many more, but I think you get the point.
At the same time, no team gave a real chance, during this same basic
time period, to much more talented, faster white RBs like: Vance
Meueller (the Raiders never seriously considered letting this fast
phenom carry the ball for them, and he was never given a chance by
anybody else; Gil Fenerty (more talented and faster than the group of
mediocre backs the Saints had in the early 90s, yet he never was
considered starting material); Brad Muster (super talent who was made
into a FB with the Bears and quietly spent a short career blocking for
Neil Anderson); Tommy Vardell (was drafted 5th overall by the Browns,
but then-coach Bill Bellicheck preferred three other slow black
plodders-Kevin Mack, Ernest Byner and Leroy Hoard-to him, and he later
was converted into the stereotypical blocking FB by the Lions); Tom
Rathman (was actually given somewhat of a role in the 49ers offense,
but he clearly had more talent than many of the mediocre black RBs in
the league at that time). I'm sure you all can remember others. What a
double standard!


Edited by: bigunreal

 

[White Shogun]

Bigunreal, I agree with you on all those guys except the Bus. He is
fat, but he can definitely run the ball. He is a step above the
other guys in your list for sure, IMO.



However, I also agree with your assertion, were he white he'd have never gotten the chance to play as he has in Pittsburgh.



I doubt he'd have even been allowed to play fullback.

 

[white lightning]

I would love to see Mike Karney get to try out at the
running back for the saints.He is a beast.He played at
ASU and had some very big runs.Mike might even be
stronger than Alstott and he has good speed.I know that
I'm dreaming.He is only allowed to block while Bettis
gets to be a star.Especially being stuck on a team like
the Saints.

 

[Realgeorge]

Hokie Gajan was excellent white running back with Saintsca. 1985.... Good LSU background. Great ballplayer, never got much recognition outside Louisiana

 

[Don Wassall]

Hokie Gajan -- all right, Real George! I've tried to remember that unusual name several times when writing material for Caste Football but could neverrecall it. He averaged a superb 5.4 yards per carry but had a very short career, just four seasons. His last season was '85, just as Riggins and Craig James were finishing up and the Iron Law against whites running the ball went into full effect.

 

[sport historian]

I remember a SI article about a Ram defeat by Tampa Bay early in the 1979 season. Regarding Ram RB's Lawrence McCutcheon and Cullen Bryant, SI said, "They couldn't juke past a light pole." It was such a good line that It has always stayed with me. John Cappeletti missed the season with an injury. I was a Ram fan at the time. The LA Rams of the 70's had a great defense but didn't have a great passer or runner. Their defense in 1979 had Jack Youngblood, Jim Youngblood, Fred Dryer, Jack Reynolds, Bob Brudzinski, Dave Elmendorf, and Nolan Cromwell.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

Don, I've never heard it called the Iron Law before, where did you get that term. Just curious. I wish there had been someone willing to give whites a chance around 1985 or 1986. I know there were a few white RB left but no one played a lot after that. You'd think they would remember James and Riggins getting over 1,000 just during those years, but they sure forgot quickly didn't they.

 

[Don Wassall]

"Iron law" has been around. It's used to refer to anything that seems to be immutable. The "Iron Curtain" was another version of it. Iron law is a slight exaggeration when it comes to the NFL and white running backs, but not by much!

 

[Colonel_Reb]

Thanks for the insight Don. I wasn't sure if it was something I'd missed out on or not. Your right, it's not much of an exaggeration.

 

[white lightning]

Good to see you back posting again Colonel Reb.I know
you have been busy.

 

[iso420]

Welcome to the world of 2005. The majority of the time a black athlete will be picked over a white athlete. And do you know why? B/C the majority of the blacks are more athletic than whites. I have seen a great deal of great white athletes, but I have seen far more greatblack athletes.Its not a coincidence that the great sprinters in track are predominantly black.

 

[Don Wassall]

So therefore, if the average black is more athletic than the average white, there should be absolutely no white running backs or cornerbacks in the NFL in perpetuity? So therefore white football players who put up great measureables at the NFL Combine shouldnot be draftedbecause the average black is a better athlete than the average white? If the average white is slightly more intelligent than the average black, should only whites be allowed to work in occupations that involve brain power? If the average white is a better shooter from long distance than the average black, should only whites be guards in basketball? If the average white is a better hockey player than the average black, should Jarome Inginla be shut out of the NHL?The same goes for the 98 percent+ of sports that have a minimal or nonexistent black presence. We're talking about giving qualified individuals a level playing field, not shutting out an entire race because allegedly one race on average is better athletically than another. Your logic leaves much to be desired. Edited by: Don Wassall

 

[Colonel_Reb]

It's good to be back posting white lightning! Don, your right. I think iso420 is suffering from Caste System overload which has apparently clouded his ability to think logically and truthfully about race and sports. Why do blacks get the exposure that whites don't get iso420? Because they have a near media monopoly on their side that has an agenda that is against whites and that furthers false notions about black athletic superiority. How many Olympic champions are white and how many are black? Whites only make up about 10% of the worlds population. Go do some research and you'll see what I'm talking about. By the way iso420, I'm glad you found Caste Football. If you are open-minded, you will get your eyes opened to the truth about the Caste System.

 

[Highwayman]

Don't forget the Packers during the mid-90s, when their running game was in the hands of two incredily slow, should-have-been FBs, Edgar Bennett and Dorsey Levens.During at least part of this time, they had the young Travis Jersey on the roster, and never seriously considered letting him take carries away from these two plodders, even though he was much, much faster than either of them. Levens continues to get carries with the Eagles at tailback. Incredible!

I've seen a lot about Travis Jervey reading through the many excellent posts and articles on this site. I am a Packer fan too, and I recall watching and especially rooting for Travis for a couple reasons, one that he played at The Citadel which made him rather unique, and two that he was white and I don't find anything wrong with rooting for a member of similar ethnicity especially when they're in an underdog situation. I recall how brilliant he looked with the Packers in preseason, it seemed every time he touched the ball it was 7-10 yards before they could get him, though that was against 3rd and 4th-stringers of course.


But I don't believe he was discriminatedagainst based on being white--not with the Packers at any rate--and I think an objective look into it would validate that. If anything, he was discriminated against because he had trouble holding onto the ball. Also, due to running an offense in collegethat didn't use himoften in that capacity, he was inexperienced catching the ball out of the backfield--which was a requirement for the offense we ranthen.


Not being able to hang onto the ball is one thing Mike Holmgren will not tolerate regardless of your hue. Recall in Seattlehe rid himself of Ahman Green to the Packer'sdelight for the exact same reason. I do remember Travis fumbling, especially returning kicks, and if you're trying to earn a position in the NFL--especially with a Mike Holmgren--a fumble or two is all it takes to be relegated to the doghouse.


Edgar Bennet was not especially fast nor powerful, but he did have a couple of useful attributes.He had great hands catching the ball and he had fantastic balance and sure footing, making hima significant asset on bad fields, and most importantly to a guy like Holmgren, he never fumbled.He went through like two full years as a feature back without ever losing a fumble--something like that.


Dorsey Levens might not have been very fast, but he had a motor that didn't quit, was as poweful as a horse, and had incredible stamina and would wear down defenses over the course of the game. He also had great hands and was an asset recieving out of the backfield. I think Dorsey proved in the Eagle's playoff game against the Vikes (or was it the Atlanta game?) why he's still in the league when he got that ball on the five and pushed that pile of four or fivedefenders into the endzone by putting his head down, driving his legs and never quitting. One of the most amazing displays of power I've seen from a back that old since Czonka retired.





Perhaps this is unwelcome here, but both Edgar Bennett Dorsey Levens played their hearts out for the Packers and I can think of nothing they ever did to be worthy of scorn. Travis Jervey might well have been treated unfairly when he got to Atlanta, but I don't think those two ever benefitted at Travis's expense for racial reasons, but because of Mike Holmgren's well-known intolerance of losing the ball. Perhaps Travis was just too excited, or was unlucky and they were freak instances, but he did lose the ball a couple of times in close succession and that's all it takes with a Mike Holmgren--just ask Ahman Green.

 

[Don Wassall]

Welcome to the board, Highwayman. You sound like another of the many knowledeable people here.


We'll have to agree to disagree on Jervey. First, I don't remember anyone ever posting anything negative about Levens and Bennett.The complaint is thatJervey was never developed despite his remarkable physical gifts. He played for a small college and was raw, and was left that way. Many gifted black running backs are given years to develop. The only way to get over a fumbling problem is with experience. Also, if all the Packers running backs hadn't gotten injured in '98, Jervey would never have played halfback at all, other than the very occasional token carry at the end of a blowout.


It's true that Holmgren traded Ahman Green. But if it was all about fumbling, then how do we explain his saint-like patience with "hands of stone" receivers Koren Robinson and Darrell Jackson? Robinson has the worst hands in the NFL, and has been suspended several times and is, to put it nicely, about as immature as an adult can be. Yet Robinson has never lost his starting job, and Holmgren continues to coddle him as if he is his three-year-old son.


Holmgren also had zero patience for Bill Schroeder. So we have a talented white running back and a talented white receiver, and both, despite having no character problems whatsover, maintained permanent status in Holmgren's "doghouse." There's more than a slight discrepancy in treatment there.

 

[surfsider]

Welcome Highwayman. I agree with your assessments of Bennet and Levens. Those were two guys whose effort could not be faulted. But you know that all else being the same if they were white they would never have been given a sniff of the football.

Don, I can't think of a worse pair of receivers than Jackson and Robinson. Holmgren's patience with them stands in stark contrast as you say to his treatment of white players with supposedly "bad hands".

 

[Highwayman]

We'll have to agree to disagree on Jervey.


First, I don't remember anyone ever posting anything negative about Levens and Bennett.The complaint is thatJervey was never developed despite his remarkable physical gifts. He played for a small college and was raw, and was left that way. Many gifted black running backs are given years to develop. The only way to get over a fumbling problem is with experience. Also, if all the Packers running backs hadn't gotten injured in '98, Jervey would never have played halfback at all, other than the very occasional token carry at the end of a blowout.

Fair enough, actually we don't disagree all that much--on Jervey. I don't think he got a fair shot, not even in Green Bay, but I think there's evidence there were other factors at work besides racial bias during his tenure here.He played at least four years for us, andwas given carries from the very beginning in pre-season,it appearedwe were willing from thestartto give him an opportunity to develop, and it's not like four years is a small window ofopportunityfor a player to prove himself.

It's true that Holmgren traded Ahman Green. But if it was all about fumbling, then how do we explain his saint-like patience with "hands of stone" receivers Koren Robinson and Darrell Jackson? Robinson has the worst hands in the NFL, and has been suspended several times and is, to put it nicely, about as immature as an adult can be. Yet Robinson has never lost his starting job, and Holmgren continues to coddle him as if he is his three-year-old son.

That's a bit different, it wasn't dropped passes thatHolmgren was irrational about, it was fumbling. He gave Antonio Freeman, whocould have been nicknamed 'Hands of Stone' early in his careertime to sort out that problem too. I notice I might have given the wrong impression when I noted off the cuff that Jervey was inexperienced catching the ball out of the backfield, and we had others with that acquired skill. I brought that up to point out Jervey might not have been a good fit in Green Bay, with an offense required a back to do a great deal of route running and catching on the run. That sort of thing is kinda tough to pick up at the NFL level, whereas he likely would be better off in an offense like the Bears of the past few years which seldom demands the backs do much of that at all. I think that combination of factors cost him an opportunity to shine in GreenBatandthat really disappointed me too.

Holmgren also had zero patience for Bill Schroeder. So we have a talented white running back and a talented white receiver, and both, despite having no character problems whatsover, maintained permanent status in Holmgren's "doghouse." There's more than a slight discrepancy in treatment there.

Here Ido disagree. Favre had no patience with Billy Schroedereither.Publically displayed it too, more so than with any other reciver I ever saw him play with. If you watched the Packers during Billy's time here, I don't think it possible to forget just how many times Favre was all over Schroeder for running the wrong routes and short-arming the ball. Rumor has it during one practice session Favre grabbed Schroeder by the facemask and told him face to face if he ever saw him do that again he'd get one of those infamous rocketballs in the back of the helmet the next time he lined up.


When Shroeder played in Green Bay he put up decent numbers, but once he was out of our potent offense he couldn't hold a starting job. Billy was a tremendous physical specimen, a decathlete,who was worth trying to develop--but he never did acquire the skills of a good NFL reciever. Don't get me wrong, I liked him and rooted for him the whole time he was here, and even with Detroit as well as him trying to make the Bucs last year.He was a local boy and yes I'll admit I followed himespeciallybecause he was white and I remember growing up how there were guys like Freddy Belitnikoff and Golden Richards playing on top teams for kids like me to identify with and there are so few today.While I do agree there's evidence of a caste system in football, I don't think you want to hang your hat on Billy Schroeder. He hadthe physical abilities, he just never became a very good football player.





Look at it this way: He is a fine person and aWisconsin boy and was available for nothing at the beginning of last season when we had only four wide recievers on the roster. There was no public demands or campaigns to get him back in Green Bay if you recall. That outta tell you something...Edited by: Highwayman

 

[Don Wassall]

Schroeder was everybody's whipping boy, including Favre's at times.But somehow I doubt Brett "I'll Curl Up in the Fetal Position so Strahan Can Break the Record" Favre would have acted the same way toward a black receiver who made the same type of mistakes.


Schroeder did start for Detroit after he left Green Bay, but the entire offense struggled not just Schroeder. With Tampa he had a huge game on Monday Night earlylast season and was rewarded by never seeing the field again, then finally being waived. He was never a superstar, but for a three-year stretch there he was a fine receiver, made a lot of nice catches and had a fair amount of long TD receptions.


Jervey was indeed awesome in the preseason. So why didn't he get to carry the ball once the regular season began? And during his very brief stint as the emergency starter in '98 the running plays they called for him were terrible, mainly run into the pile with both hands on the ball stuff, plays more suited for a 250 pound back with no speed or moves rather than a runner with, as the saying goes, "blinding speed." The reality is that Jervey and Schroeder never received positive reinforcement; it's fair to say that psychological warfare iswaged against all white receivers and running backs in the NFL in subtle and not so subtle ways and Jervey and Schroeder were certainly no exception.


A dropped pass is no different than a fumble. I think a lot of Holmgren's "irrationality" about fumbling has a lot more to do with his not wanting to play whites at "taboo" positions than anything else.

 

[Kaptain]

I'll have to disagree highwayman. According to NFL.com, Travis Jervey NEVER fumbled in 1998 - the only year he was allowed to start due to injuries of course. He had 83 carries and a 3.9 yard average. Dorsey Levens had 115 carries and a 3.3 yard average. Jervey was dismissed at the end of the year. Levens, on the other hand, took over the starting job and fumbled 5 times in 1999. He, however, was allowed to continue being a packer and over the next three seasons averaged 3.7, 2.9, and 3.8 yards per carry.


The idea of developing players entails that they allowed to play from time to time in crucial game situations and given some measure of carries to prove themself. Travis was given 1998 and that was it.


As far as Bill Shroeder goes, I don't think you could be more wrong. After Green Bay Shroeder wasn't given much of a chance to be a starting receiver and he was in terrible offenses to boot. Up to the last year he performed well when given a chance. I believe he scored 2 touchdowns in the last game that he started in TB. It is true that Favre gave him some public tongue lashings, but when the head coach treats a player disrespectfully it makes it easier for his fellow teammates to do the same especially when you're a white guy playing a forbidden position. Perhaps Holmgren should confront his current recievers with such zeal. Is he afraid to?

 

[Highwayman]

Schroeder was everybody's whipping boy, including Favre's at times.But somehow I doubt Brett "I'll Curl Up in the Fetal Position so Strahan Can Break the Record" Favre would have acted the same way toward a black receiver who made the same type of mistakes.

I'm going to let this drop after this as I don't want to give the wrong impression, but I would like to clarify what I was trying to say as oftentimes I just put my head down and do a lot of typing and it comes out all jumbled.

However if you've watched Favre you'll note he does the same thing regardless of who it is, he just did it a lot more with Schroeder. An example you might remember from the Superbowls we were in was with Andre Rison in '96 when Rison again got wide open and should have had another long TD but turned the wrong way and if you've access to a tape of the game you'll see Favre making it perfectly clear to everyone he ran the wrong route. The following year on our last drive he did something similar when Antonio Freeman made the same mistake.

The reality is that Jervey and Schroeder never received positive reinforcement; it's fair to say that psychological warfare iswaged against all white receivers and running backs in the NFL in subtle and not so subtle ways and Jervey and Schroeder were certainly no exception.

I don't diagree with that at all; someone (perhaps you?) wrote an article on that sort of thing going on in lockerrooms that I found quite intriguing. Certainly something like that could have been going on behind the scenes and that's not something I can dispute.

A dropped pass is no different than a fumble.

I disagree, I think there's a huge difference. A dropped pass costs you a down and at worst might make you have to punt, but a fumble gives the ball to the other team right then and there and just might be returned for a TD. Also fumbles are not nearly as common, so losing a couple in a row seemsmoreoutrageous than a couple dropped passes.

I think a lot of Holmgren's "irrationality" about fumbling has a lot more to do with his not wanting to play whites at "taboo" positions than anything else.

I think that effect is probably more unconscious than intended, and Holmgren at least has shown consistancy on this issue between Jervey and Green.