Kevin Love

One place Love gets props every night is on the NBA TV post-game show, though to look at the studio analysts they run through there's never been a white NBA player. But they take a few minutes on every game, so Kevin is talked about every night, and have had break-downs and interviews with him. NBA TV has showed his 30-rebound games a few times in rebroadcast.
 
Despite another loss, Kevin Love had 30 points and 19 rebounds tonight. The guy is a superstar. Anyone that thinks he isn't has to be blind. They try to stop him but he still finds a way to get it done night after night. His offensive game is really coming into it's own as of late. This guy is just amazing. I'm in awe watching him. We have an american white all star again and a guy that will make it for the next decade in my opinion.
 
He's defying the naysayers on all fronts. As of now, Blake Griffin gets more attention due to his typical athleticism and flair, in part he's matching Love (mano e mano) in the DOUBLE-DOUBLE department.

But, I see Love as way more skilled of the two (shoot, rebounds, pass), Griffin would be nothing without his athleticism. He's not really a shooter (field and FT's), he could become like Amare Stoudamire eventually.

Kevin Love is becoming a freakish version of Dirk Nowitzki on a whole new level.
 
j41181 said:
He's defying the naysayers on all fronts. As of now, Blake Griffin gets more attention due to his typical athleticism and flair, in part he's matching Love (mano e mano) in the DOUBLE-DOUBLE department.



But, I see Love as way more skilled of the two (shoot, rebounds, pass), Griffin would be nothing without his athleticism. He's not really a shooter (field and FT's), he could become like Amare Stoudamire eventually.



Kevin Love is becoming a freakish version of Dirk Nowitzki on a whole new level.
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The funny thing is that both Griffin and Love had 35 inch verticals.
 
Yeah but the media would never tell you that. They almost never describe any white basketball player as athletic. The are slow, plodding and lumbering. Love can really jump as can David Lee.
 
whiteathlete33 said:
j41181 said:
He's defying the naysayers on all fronts. As of now, Blake Griffin gets more attention due to his typical athleticism and flair, in part he's matching Love (mano e mano) in the DOUBLE-DOUBLE department.

But, I see Love as way more skilled of the two (shoot, rebounds, pass), Griffin would be nothing without his athleticism. He's not really a shooter (field and FT's), he could become like Amare Stoudamire eventually.

Kevin Love is becoming a freakish version of Dirk Nowitzki on a whole new level.
Click to expand...
The funny thing is that both Griffin and Love had 35 inch verticals.
Click to expand...

Measured how exactly? Griffin is one of the most explosive leapers for his size, ever. I Love Love, but he's a below-the-rim player.
 
Being in Minneapolis, Minnesota is perfect for Kevin Love. As the first White American NBA Superstar (since John Stockton), he's playing for a predominantly white city (70% white), and white state (90%).

Minnesota has a considerable history of producing some outstanding white b-ball players (notably Kevin McHale). Stockton played for a predominantly white city (Salt lake) and state (Utah). Coincidence? Maybe, but it also counts.
 
whiteathlete33 said:
Both of their max verticals are 35 inches.  See for yourself.  http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?year=2009&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&source=All&sort=12  GriffinLove http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?year=2008&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&source=All&sort=12
Click to expand...

What was that Mark Twain quote? Outside of dunk contests, "Max vertical" isn't particularly useful to basketball, it's how quick and explosive you are off the floor. Even no-step vertical doesn't tell the entire story, it's still how long does it take you to get off the floor, and how many times in a row can you do it that quickly? All it takes is 10 seconds watching both players to know that they aren't similar in that way. I'd also venture that after he left UCLA, Love was "teaching to the test" and came in super-fit and explosive so as to push off the perceptions of him as a white athlete. That's not necessarily playing to his strengths, though, and now he's where he should be, a 270 pound post player who is more quick and nimble in the short distances of the lane than playing over the rim.Edited by: GreatLakeState
 
GreatLakeState said:
whiteathlete33 said:
Both of their max verticals are 35 inches. See for yourself. http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?year=2009&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&source=All&sort=12 GriffinLove http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?year=2008&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&source=All&sort=12
Click to expand...



What was that Mark Twain quote? Outside of dunk contests, "Max vertical" isn't particularly useful to basketball, it's how quick and explosive you are off the floor. Even no-step vertical doesn't tell the entire story, it's still how long does it take you to get off the floor, and how many times in a row can you do it that quickly? All it takes is 10 seconds watching both players to know that they aren't similar in that way. I'd also venture that after he left UCLA, Love was "teaching to the test" and came in super-fit and explosive so as to push off the perceptions of him as a white athlete. That's not necessarily playing to his strengths, though, and now he's where he should be, a 270 pound post player who is more quick and nimble in the short distances of the lane than playing over the rim.
Click to expand...

I've played basketball may years and I know what you say is true. However, I was simply pointing out that Love can get up. A 35 inch vertical for a guy his size is very good and is the same as Griffin's.
 
whiteathlete33 said:
GreatLakeState said:
whiteathlete33 said:
Both of their max verticals are 35 inches.  See for yourself.  http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?year=2009&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&source=All&sort=12  GriffinLove http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?year=2008&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&source=All&sort=12
Click to expand...

What was that Mark Twain quote? Outside of dunk contests, "Max vertical" isn't particularly useful to basketball, it's how quick and explosive you are off the floor. Even no-step vertical doesn't tell the entire story, it's still how long does it take you to get off the floor, and how many times in a row can you do it that quickly? All it takes is 10 seconds watching both players to know that they aren't similar in that way. I'd also venture that after he left UCLA, Love was "teaching to the test" and came in super-fit and explosive so as to push off the perceptions of him as a white athlete. That's not necessarily playing to his strengths, though, and now he's where he should be, a 270 pound post player who is more quick and nimble in the short distances of the lane than playing over the rim.
Click to expand...
I've played basketball may years and I know what you say is true.  However, I was simply pointing out that Love can get up.  A 35 inch vertical for a guy his size is very good and is the same as Griffin's. 
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It's NOT his game, even though Kevin Love can as leap high as Blake Griffin, it's not his game. Love's game is below the rim and from the perimeter. Blake Griffin does lots of post ups, drives, and run the break for rim rocking jams. Love can make some quick cuts to the hoop for monster jams himself, but he's simply more METHODICAL in his game. He's not going to make many alleyoop slams, unlike Griffin.

Here's a rare monster dunk from Larry Bird...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaKRghcLQSY
 
j41181 said:
whiteathlete33 said:
GreatLakeState said:
whiteathlete33 said:
Both of their max verticals are 35 inches. See for yourself. http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?year=2009&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&source=All&sort=12 GriffinLove http://www.draftexpress.com/nba-pre-draft-measurements/?year=2008&sort2=DESC&draft=0&pos=0&source=All&sort=12
Click to expand...



What was that Mark Twain quote? Outside of dunk contests, "Max vertical" isn't particularly useful to basketball, it's how quick and explosive you are off the floor. Even no-step vertical doesn't tell the entire story, it's still how long does it take you to get off the floor, and how many times in a row can you do it that quickly? All it takes is 10 seconds watching both players to know that they aren't similar in that way. I'd also venture that after he left UCLA, Love was "teaching to the test" and came in super-fit and explosive so as to push off the perceptions of him as a white athlete. That's not necessarily playing to his strengths, though, and now he's where he should be, a 270 pound post player who is more quick and nimble in the short distances of the lane than playing over the rim.
Click to expand...
I've played basketball may years and I know what you say is true. However, I was simply pointing out that Love can get up. A 35 inch vertical for a guy his size is very good and is the same as Griffin's.
Click to expand...

It's NOT his game, even though Kevin Love can as leap high as Blake Griffin, it's not his game. Love's game is below the rim and from the perimeter. Blake Griffin does lots of post ups, drives, and run the break for rim rocking jams. Love can make some quick cuts to the hoop for monster jams himself, but he's simply more METHODICAL in his game. He's not going to make many alleyoop slams, unlike Griffin.



Here's a rare monster dunk from Larry Bird...



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaKRghcLQSY
Click to expand...

As I recall Bird didn't have a good vertical. It was around 27 inches or so I think. I could be wrong. He only turned out to be arguably the best player of all time.
 
Bird was an extraordinary leaper in his younger days (he could slap well above the top of the square on the backboard), but he injured his back while in college and made a conscious effort at that time to alter his game. at least, that is paraphrasing what waswritten in a biography of his that i read a while back.
 
Jimmy Chitwood said:
Bird was an extraordinary leaper in his younger days (he could slap well above the top of the square on the backboard), but he injured his back while in college and made a conscious effort at that time to alter his game. at least, that is paraphrasing what was written in a biography of his that i read a while back.
Click to expand...
So when Bird aggravated his back in 1991, it was actually an OLD injury?

I'm amazed Bird NEVER had a knee injury, although back injuries top that anytime.
 
j41181 said:
Jimmy Chitwood said:
Bird was an extraordinary leaper in his younger days (he could slap well above the top of the square on the backboard), but he injured his back while in college and made a conscious effort at that time to alter his game. at least, that is paraphrasing what waswritten in a biography of his that i read a while back.
Click to expand...
So when Bird aggravated his back in 1991, it was actually an OLD injury?

I'm amazed Bird NEVER had a knee injury, although back injuries top that anytime.
Click to expand...


if i recall the biography correctly, j41181, yes. in the book, Bird spoke frankly about how when he was in high school and early on in college he would do 360-dunks and other highlight-material slams. but the back injury changed all that, and thus his varied arsenal of offensive wizardry began.

if i get the chance, i'll see if i can dig up that book and share a more exact recap. it might be a while before i can get to it, though.
 
Bird also seriously injured his back (mid-80's) making his mother a
driveway instead of hiring someone, which was the beginning of the end
for him. Bird played the last 5 years of his career in chronic pain and
caused him to retire a relatively young 35.
 
Great info about Larry Bird. What a player!

Back to Kevin Love. I have seen him do some dunks that were amazing. I have also seen him swat some shots away that would also take some explosive jumping. He is not nearly as tall as listed. David Lee gets the same treatment despite winning the national high school slam dunk contest. Lee was doing JR Rider/Kobe Dunks between his legs in high school. Yet in the NBA, Lee concentrates on the fundamentals just like Kevin Love. All I'm saying is that they both could be alot flashier if they wanted to. White athletes in general are more about the good of the team than trying to showboat. Griffin is a good player but I still don't think he will have half of the career of a Kevin Love or Dirk Nowitzki when all is said and done. One last thing. Kevin Love broke a glass backboard in high schoo with one of his high powered dunks. The guy can jump and he brings his slams with power! I love his game.
 
Love and Griffin will both be top NBA forwards for a long time, just as they are right now.
Who will be better? Both will have great stats. It will be determined by who wins more.
Speaking of Larry Bird, Love's stats compare very favorably to Bird. At this age, Bird was a rookie and averaged 21 points, 10 rebounds and 4 assists. Love is at that level in points and WAY above that in rebounds. Bird was a 6 assist guy in his career. I am not sure if Love will do that, I think he will be closer to a 4 or 5 assist guy.
In terms of rebounds, Moses Malone averaged a high rate early in his career but his maximum was around 15 a game.
Other great rebounders that you can compare to (in rebounding ability) are Dennis Rodman, Jayson Williams, and Ben Wallace. The last two were around 30 when they got 15 or so boards a game. Rodman's great rebounding days started when he was 28. Kevin Willis averaged over 15 boards one year but I believe he was also in his late twenties or early thirties.

So Love compares VERY favorably to Bird, Moses Malone, and Dennis Rodman. Another thing, Bird was a great shooter but never hit a lot of threes in his career. Love might hit more.

If Rubio comes in and does well then Rubio-Love could be the new Stockton-Malone or even the new Cousy-Bill Russell. If Love starts to block a lot of shots -- watch out! Blocks are a matter of timing and being an alert help defender. Look for Love to improve his this area too. A career block average of 1.5 or so a game is very possible.
 
JReb1 said:
Pistol Pete, I've seen Rubio compared to the great Pistol on many occasions, how would you rate his game compared to Pete's?
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I haven't watched him play much. He has some good YouTube highlights. Decent size, passing flair, not a great shooter. He might be a better NBA player than a Spanish league guy. I have seen one analyst pro rate his game to the NBA player and it turned into 8 points 12 assists and about 5 or 6 rebounds a game. Not a great shooting percentage. Sounds like Jason Kidd. He needs to go to the right team I think. A fast paced team with great scorers and good big men. I like him on the Clippers since you have Blake Griffin (a top five player RIGHT NOW), paired with DeAndre Jordan along with Chris Kaman up front. A 20 point scorer in Eric Gordon, the solid Aminu, gunner Bledsoe, and Baron Davis. Bring Rubio off the bench or just play a three guard rotation of Gordon, Rubio, and Davis. Start Rubio in a couple of years. If the T Wolves could get Kaman, Bledsoe, and the Clippers 1st round pick for Rubio they might wanna do it. Fredette might be a better point guard for them, and you have a big man rotation of Love, Kaman, and Darko (better half court guys) along with Beasley (next Carmelo?) and Wesley Johnson and Ridnour along with Bledsoe. I think they then draft a big guard with their own pick or Vesley. If they want to pick up a veteran or two in the off season they should go with Shane Battier as a backup defender, jump shooter and glue guy. He can also play some power forward. If they want to build around Kevin Love, Beasley and still use Darko effectively then they might want to play a half court style game. Fredette as a dead eye shooting quarterback, Love-Kaman-Darko, Beasley as the 2nd or 3rd option with Ridnour and Bledsoe at back up point guard, Battier as the expert role player and the athletic Wes Johnson and Corey Brewer on the wings. I think Vessley might be the best pick. Sounds like he could be a Kirelenko/Josh Smith type player. Trade Jonny Flynn for cash/picks/backup veteran power forward and keep Martel Webster. That would be a very good team. That would be the low risk play. High risk: keep Rubio, hope he turns into a Stockton/Maravich hybrid and make a great draft pick and hopefully get something from Jonny Flynn. Then still draft Vesley and sign Battier. Go after another good big man.

Either way, I think Rubio needs good big men along with great scorers/athletes. Rubio is not a first option scorer, more like Rajon Rondo. Rondo plays with KG, great perimeter scorers and lots of solid big guys and savvy vets. Vesley, Battier/OJ Mayo makes a lot of sense. Marc Gasol might be a good pick up but he is not a great defender. If they decide to keep Rubio then they should model their team after the Boston Celtics. Love and Darko is a good combo at power forward and center. If they go out and get a third big man they should get a guy that can block shots and get up and down the court and could play with either Love or Darko. It will be interesting to see what they do.
 
Michael Beasley is THOROUGHLY OVERRATED.

Minnesota's poor defense (and that includes Beasley) is why they have lost so many games (late) that they've had good leads in.

If a team doesn't win, like Minnesota, it's personally hard for me to "annoint" their players. Ridnour and Love have been solid, but Love needs to improve his "D" as well..
 
Love's defense really needs polishing, not after he (and Milicic) allowed Aldridge to score 37 points (career-high). I can't help but say Griffin's (career-high 47 points) got the edge on Love right now. His athleticism is smack of the charts, and the Clippers are playing great basketball in their last 2 games.

Minnesota's poor defense lies in it's OVERALL inexperience. They lack veteran leadership in that department. Edited by: j41181
 
I had a 33" vertical (at 6'8) in HS/college & I could touch the top of the backboard (square) above the rim. I'd say Griffin's vertical is 35-38" (at 6'10) as he can hit his noggin on the rim.
 
Love is coming into his own because he is still only now the age of rookie who did 4 years of college apprenticeship(notice I didn't say school). In some ways I wish he stayed in school as he could have been a college legend and won a POY award or two. I agree on the comparisons of Love and Griffin. Edited by: white is right
 
Kevin Love had another sensational game against the Thunder. He had his third 30-20 game of the year. Kevin poured in 31 points while pulling down 21 rebounds!The Twolves lost by one due to Durants huge game. I like what this team is doing though. They are slowly learning how to play with the better teams in the league. It took a career night from Durant and a missed free throw for the Thunder to win. The Timberwolves are going to be a suprise team next year. I sure hope they get Rubio but maybe Fredette ends up there. You never now.They will have their choice with a very high draft pick. Love is a beast!
 
Love had 21 and 12 in a Wolves win over Toronto. Michael Beasley layed an egg..
 
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