Trevor Hoffman

[speedster]

The save watch is on.Hoffman recorded save number 469 last night and is within striking distance of save leader Lee Smith who has 478.With a decent finish Hoffman will become the fireman king before the end of the year. What I find interesting but not surprising is that Lee Smith is one of very few black Americans who have ever cut it is a closer

 

[JoeV]

Yeah I remember Lee Smith when I was growing up in Chicago, he appears in Ferris Bueller's Day Off. The saves record in my mind will not be solidified until 50 years from now, as the save was only kept as a statistic recently. Hoyt Wilhelm would have killed any current save record with they kept track back then. Its kinda like when Babe Ruth used to keep hitting the most home runs, home runs were still kind of a new thing. As much as I like Hoffman and Lee Smith, they are barely, if not even in the top 10 closers of all time. Guys like Rollie Fingers, Bruce Sutter, Dan Quisenberry, and Dennis Eckersly are supremely better than those two.

 

[Don Wassall]

Congratulations to Trevor Hoffman for breaking the career saves mark. That was the only significant record to be held by a black pitcher and it seemed when Smith set it that it might stand for a long time.


It would have been nice to see Hoffman receive more media recognition the past few years. I remember a lot more being made of Smith's career than Hoffman's, but what else can we expect. Barry Bonds gets way more media attention than Roger Clemens, Greg Maddux and Randy Johnson combined.

 

[white is right]

Lee Smith was never regarded as the best reliever of his generation. He was regarded as a compiler. He was a longer lasting version of Jeff Reardon. That's why he has never been seriously regarded as hall of fame candidate. If Gossage isn't in Smith has to wait. Smith is more of veterans committee type to me.Edited by: white is right

 

[Don Wassall]

I agree with that assessment of Smith. Which reminds me again of one of my pet peeves -- the Veterans Committee should have been abolished a long time ago. If Smith (or anyone else) isn't deemed worthy of election to the Hall now, when those writers who covered his career are voting, how does he possibly merit election decades from now? The Veterans Committee was supposed to judge which players from the early 20th century merited induction as the Hall of Fame wasn't begun until the mid-'30s, not to be a permanent entity which continues to add clearly unworthy candidates, such as just about everyone who ever claimed to have played in the Negro Leagues.

 

[speedster]

 

[Don Wassall]

Here's an article about how little acclaim and coverage Hoffman's feat received. How often are all-time career marks topped in baseball? The author blames it on bias against West Coast teams, but does take a dig or two at Lee Smith. Hoffman deserves a lot better than just brief passing notice for a great lifetime achievement.


http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/6002212

 

[Weltner]

Lee Smith was never regarded as the best reliever of his generation. He was regarded as a compiler. He was a longer lasting version of Jeff Reardon. That's why he has never been seriously regarded as hall of fame candidate.




Yes,but at least Reardon saved enough big games with the Twins and the Braves,helping get both of them to a WS,and getting a ring with the Twins in 1987,including game 7.

 

[Weltner]

The save watch is on.Hoffman recorded save number 469 last night and is within striking distance of save leader Lee Smith who has 478.With a decent finish Hoffman will become the fireman king before the end of the year. What I find interesting but not surprising is that Lee Smith is one of very few black Americans who have ever cut it is a closer

And totally overrated.Having the most saves doesn't mean you're a winner,and Smith absolutely wasn't.Never delivered in the clutch when his teams needed it.

For me ,he will only be remembered for the following:

Game 4,1984 NLCS. With the game tied 5-5,and the Cubs up 2 games to 1, Smith gives up 2-run HR to Steve Garvey in the bottom of the 9th,losing 7-5.

Game 2,1988 ALCS. With the game tied in the top of the 9th,3-3,Smith gives up three hits,the last two coming with 2 out,allowing the Athletics to take the lead,and win it(The game winning hit was by Walt Weiss,a light hitting SS).

Game 4,1988 ALCS.With the Red Sox facing a four-game sweep,and the Athletics up 2-1 in the bottom 8th,Smith gives up a pair of runs,and the Athletics go on to sweep.

1994 All Star game,in Pittsburgh. Yes,it's only an ASG,but still,pitching for the AL,he was given the chance to hold on to a 7-5 lead going into the bottom 9th.But,with 2 out,and 1 on,Smith gives up a 2-run HR to Fred McGriff,and the NL goes on to win it in the 10th.

Good,but nothing great - Rollie Fingers,Goose Gossage,Bruse Sutter,Mike Timlin,hell,Mariano Rivera,(Just to name a few)he wasn't.For all of his saves,he never got to a WS,and it wasn't because he was on lousy teams and never got the chance,he was on some good teams,got two chances,and he simply didn't come through for them.