The Tillman Story
- Thread starter DWFan
- Start date
sport historian
Master
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2004
- Messages
- 2,986
In August, it was released in New York and LA to rapturous reviews from the film critics. When Pat Tillman's death was announced, many on the Left mocked him as a "dumb patriotic jock" and figured he was a Bush supporter.
"The Tillman Story" is pretty much a garden-variety leftist documentary from what I can tell. I haven't seen it because it hasn't been shown in Tennessee.
In their reviews, the film critics saw Tillman as their kind of guy-He is an atheist, despises Bush, supports gay rights, constantly uses the F-word (a Tillman family trait) and admires Noam Chomsky.
Despite the critical praise, the film didn't attract an audience in the big cities and has been "tossed out" in the hope of some Oscar notice. I just checked IMDB and it still isn't scheduled in Tennessee or the Deep South.
A review I saw said that none of Tillman's NFL teammates were interviewed for the film. Jon Krakauer's book indicated that the only football player Pat Tillman was ever close to was Jake Plummer, a teammate at both ASU and the Cardinals.
"The Tillman Story" is pretty much a garden-variety leftist documentary from what I can tell. I haven't seen it because it hasn't been shown in Tennessee.
In their reviews, the film critics saw Tillman as their kind of guy-He is an atheist, despises Bush, supports gay rights, constantly uses the F-word (a Tillman family trait) and admires Noam Chomsky.
Despite the critical praise, the film didn't attract an audience in the big cities and has been "tossed out" in the hope of some Oscar notice. I just checked IMDB and it still isn't scheduled in Tennessee or the Deep South.
A review I saw said that none of Tillman's NFL teammates were interviewed for the film. Jon Krakauer's book indicated that the only football player Pat Tillman was ever close to was Jake Plummer, a teammate at both ASU and the Cardinals.
sport historian
Master
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2004
- Messages
- 2,986
DWFan said:
Is "The Tillman Story" being shown where you live? If it is, could you see it and give us your opinion?
The movie does a good job of exposing just how corrupt the U.S. military is beyond the problems inherent to a large bureaucracy. Hopefully it will discourage other idealistic white men from joining the military.
The term 'friendly fire' doesn't do justice to the way he died. Murdered is more accurate. Then the coverup and the use of the death to promote the war. And then when the truth came out very selective and very limited punishment.
The movies shows just how incredibly political and stupid the conduct of the war in Afghanistan is. Special forces are put into impossible situations because the general methods employed are not adequate; too few troops covering too much territory, confused mission, officers interested in achieving 'combat experience' only for purposes of promotion.
I don't think many people, including 'experts' at the Pentagon and State Department, understand just who the other side is. The main opposition is Pashtun. They are not Arabs. The are Indo-Europeans. Their traditional enemies are the Asian tribes, remnants of the Mongol occupation, who constituted the Northern Alliance. The Afghan army is now overwhelmingly made up of these Asians like Tajiks and Uzbeks.
When you see photographs of the Taliban Pashtun fighters, gaunt with full beards, you're reminded of the Confederacy. So you have mostly white Americans, largely from the American South, being sent to fight other Indo-Europeans who, in their own way, are attempting to gain the freedom to manage their society as they see fit with their own 'peculiar institutions'.
The Pashtuns have been described as among the most non-materialistic people in the world. So why do they fight? Why did the Confederates?
At one point the U.S. government paid the Taliban $1 billion p.a. to stop the cultivation of opium. The Taliban did just that. Heroin supplies dried up in Europe and Russia. Now that the evil Taliban is out of power Afghanistan produces a majority of the world's heroin (or at least the precursor to heroin).
(What did the Taliban do with the $1 B? Religious schools, clinics, farm machinery, extra wives, irrigation gates, extra goats, guns, designer turbans, etc. If only they had built yeshivas all would be well.)
The early Taliban were seminary students who took up guns and took over the country. It's as if all the male students at bible colleges in the U.S. commandeered tanks and artillery and took over D.C. Maybe that's what really troubles our corrupt elite.
The term 'friendly fire' doesn't do justice to the way he died. Murdered is more accurate. Then the coverup and the use of the death to promote the war. And then when the truth came out very selective and very limited punishment.
The movies shows just how incredibly political and stupid the conduct of the war in Afghanistan is. Special forces are put into impossible situations because the general methods employed are not adequate; too few troops covering too much territory, confused mission, officers interested in achieving 'combat experience' only for purposes of promotion.
I don't think many people, including 'experts' at the Pentagon and State Department, understand just who the other side is. The main opposition is Pashtun. They are not Arabs. The are Indo-Europeans. Their traditional enemies are the Asian tribes, remnants of the Mongol occupation, who constituted the Northern Alliance. The Afghan army is now overwhelmingly made up of these Asians like Tajiks and Uzbeks.
When you see photographs of the Taliban Pashtun fighters, gaunt with full beards, you're reminded of the Confederacy. So you have mostly white Americans, largely from the American South, being sent to fight other Indo-Europeans who, in their own way, are attempting to gain the freedom to manage their society as they see fit with their own 'peculiar institutions'.
The Pashtuns have been described as among the most non-materialistic people in the world. So why do they fight? Why did the Confederates?
At one point the U.S. government paid the Taliban $1 billion p.a. to stop the cultivation of opium. The Taliban did just that. Heroin supplies dried up in Europe and Russia. Now that the evil Taliban is out of power Afghanistan produces a majority of the world's heroin (or at least the precursor to heroin).
(What did the Taliban do with the $1 B? Religious schools, clinics, farm machinery, extra wives, irrigation gates, extra goats, guns, designer turbans, etc. If only they had built yeshivas all would be well.)
The early Taliban were seminary students who took up guns and took over the country. It's as if all the male students at bible colleges in the U.S. commandeered tanks and artillery and took over D.C. Maybe that's what really troubles our corrupt elite.
I didn't see the movie, but it appears that Tillman had very negative thoughts about the war on terror (to put it mildly). It was convenient for the war machine operators that he just happened to die before going back to America and telling all about the war. Then, there's the pattern of bullets that killed him. Suspicious to say the least.
The U.S. is in dreamland if it feels it can defeat the Pashtuns. Not gonna happen. Like it or not, the Pashtuns are going to win and their enemies are going to lose. I think we should cut our losses and go home. Just my 2 cents
The U.S. is in dreamland if it feels it can defeat the Pashtuns. Not gonna happen. Like it or not, the Pashtuns are going to win and their enemies are going to lose. I think we should cut our losses and go home. Just my 2 cents
sport historian
Master
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2004
- Messages
- 2,986
DWFan said:
It will be on DVD pretty soon. The army lied initially, but admitted that Tillman was accidentally killed by members of his platoon about a month later.
The platoon had been split into two groups, with Tillman's group in front. The second group came under fire, and Tillman, accompanied by a friendly Afghan militiaman ran back with the rest of his group to see what was happening.
Members of the second group saw the Afghan and assumed he was the enemy and started shooting. The Afghan, who had foolishly fired warning shots, fell dead. Tillman stood up and yelled, "I'm Pat F*****g Tillman!" The second group didn't hear and kept shooting, hitting Tillman in the head, killing him instantly.
It took a while for them to stop. They even hit Tillman's platoon commander and radio operator.
This type of incident happens all too frequently in war. There was NOT a coverup. The army did admit the truth after the initial CYA moment. Contrary to what is claimed, Tillman's family did not uncover the truth, and there was no coverup, just an organization whose members tried to avoid blame after a stupid blunder.
Jon Krakauer's book, "Where Men Win Glory," has the best account.
sport historian
Master
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2004
- Messages
- 2,986
The DVD has neen released. The Sony edition is around $25 and the Blue-Ray, $31. Yesterday, I rented it from a video store. This is the best option as in my opinion, it isn't worth the puchase price.
The director, one Amir Bar-Lev, both in the film and a commentary shoves Tillman (and his family's) militant atheism in the audience's face at every opportunity. They would have objected if someone's religion had been put front and center.
The film claims "we don't know why he joined up and it would invade his privacy to give his reason." Well, why make the film at all?
Tillman's platoon mates played the Cover Your *** routine before the higher-ups did. The film infers the troops felt that Tillman was a fool for standing up and yelling "I'm Pat F****** Tillman!"
Combat veterans I talked to said that Tillman should have kept his head down until the idiots in the second group stopped shooting.
The army's purpose initially was to turn defeat into victory by giving Tillman a posthumous Silver Star. The whole thing was a combination of CYA and stupidity.
The director, one Amir Bar-Lev, both in the film and a commentary shoves Tillman (and his family's) militant atheism in the audience's face at every opportunity. They would have objected if someone's religion had been put front and center.
The film claims "we don't know why he joined up and it would invade his privacy to give his reason." Well, why make the film at all?
Tillman's platoon mates played the Cover Your *** routine before the higher-ups did. The film infers the troops felt that Tillman was a fool for standing up and yelling "I'm Pat F****** Tillman!"
Combat veterans I talked to said that Tillman should have kept his head down until the idiots in the second group stopped shooting.
The army's purpose initially was to turn defeat into victory by giving Tillman a posthumous Silver Star. The whole thing was a combination of CYA and stupidity.