Richmond Flowers on ESPN Classic

[sport historian]

If you haven't seen it before, ESPN Classic is running a bio of Richmond Flowers Jr. at 7pm ET tonight (Tuesday). His son, an Ole Miss WR, is up for the Draft this year. Colonel Reb has mentioned him.

 

[Don Wassall]

Man, they really dished out the PC slop heavy in this one. The only reason ESPN had any interest in Richmond Flowers Jr. was in order to air as much anti-white footage from the '60s as could be crammed in a half hour show.


Richmond Flowers, Sr. the politician (who subsequently went to prison for corruption) was praised as ahead of his time when it came to race relations. But Richmond Jr. was also ahead of his time -- the NFL switched him from wide receiver to safety rather than cornerback, despite the fact that he possessed world class speed!

 

[Kaptain]

I remember the name Richmond Flowers only because I was watching a arena football league game about a year ago and noticed a white WR/LB dominating the field on both sides of the ball. I believe it was Richmond Flowers the 3rd and he was playing for the New York Dragons. He looked like a shoe-in to make an NFL roster. I had heard that he tried out for the cowboys last year and that they cut him - typical.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

Guys, as I watched that program, I felt pretty strange. Nothing in it made much sense to me. I had no clue as to Richmond Sr. or Jr's. activities during the civil rights era. It was a bunch of PC anti-white and anti-South garbage. The only thing I knew about Jr. was that he had played football.

I know his son Bill is as good as they come, both on the field and off. You will not meet a nicer football player than him, and believe me, I've met a lot. He deserves a decent chance somewhere. If he runs a 4.5 40, and I'm here to tell you he does, he can be a playmaker in the NFL. He is a smart player, has great hands, and can get the extra yardage after the catch. He left many a black SEC DB in the dust and/or grabbing at air. Even with his sharing time with other receivers, he is one of the most prolific WR's in Ole Miss history.

 

[Don Wassall]

I wasn't familiar with Richmond Sr. or Jr. but had read a little about Richmond III and knew he was a talented receiver trying to make the NFL.


The NFL Network has had a show the past three years following the training camp of a different team each season. It's picked three of the blackest teamsstarting withBaltimore followed by Dallas then Jacksonville last year.


One of the shows about the Cowboys featured Richmond Flowers III trying to make the team. He's big and fast, a good looking kid, a prototype of what NFL receivers looked like back in his father's era.


Of course he was cut. At the end of the show, right after being waived, he was filmed in his training camp dorm room, talking to his father on the telephone. His father said, "It's all politics, it's all decided before camp who's gonna make it and who isn't," or something close to that. To me it sounded like his father was trying to state the racial realities of the present day NFL in so many words. ESPN Classic portrayed Richmond Jr. as a bleeding heart liberal, same as Richmond Sr., but he didn't come across like that talking to his son. Maybe time has opened his eyes, if he ever felt thatway to begin with.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

I think you might be right Don, the realities of a changed world may have dawned on Jr and woke him up. I imagine he had to adjust his views somewhat. I know that you can't have a son trying to get on a pro football team these days without running into the politics/race issue, it has to stare you in the face.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

In fact, it kind of reminds me of a song by Blind Faith, Presence of the Lord---"everybody knows the secret, yeah, everybody knows the score." If they don't at first, they'll learn.

 

[sport historian]

Don, you asked me to give an evaluation of Richmond Flowers Jr. (I saw him play several times for Tennessee) on the Forum several months ago. To repeat, he was a very good college WR. The defenses gave him so much cushion, he and the other Tennessee receivers would catch passes underneath all day.


Yes, the ESPN show was an exercise in PC propaganda, but I thought those who hadn't seen it would want to. Richmond Jr. once indicated that he wasn't that much interested in politics in those days. Most athletes have a tunnel vision and are zoned in on what sport(s) they play.


That is amazing. Richmond Jr. telling Richmond III that due to politics he had no chance to make a team. As I said in my post several months ago, Richmond Jr. was a class act who brought good publicity to UT. His sons are much the same. You would think somebody would like to have a good (even if he's not a superstar) player like that on their team.


Regarding Richmond Sr.'s political career, it wasn't like you're expected to think. It has been inferred that Attorney General Flowers was convicted and sent to Federal prison in 1968by George Wallace's minions because of his civil rights stance. Nothing could be farther from thetruth. Flowers Sr. was prosecuted by LBJ's Justice Dept. led by Ramsey Clark. Flowers Sr. was a venal politician "on the take." A VERY fictional TV movie about the Flowers family, Unconquered (1989), has this theme of the crusading liberal persecuted by "racists." Do you really think Ramsey Clark would send a Southern liberal to prison ifFlowers guilt wasn't overwhelming?


I hope Bill Flowers can make an NFL team. The odds may be against it. Thanks again for the anecdote about Richmond Jr. telling his son that politics were against him.

 

[StaleyWasScrewd]

Here's an even more explicit example of Richmond Jr. being critical of the NFL's politics. I was watching an Arena League game last year that Richmond III was playin in, and Richmond Flowers Jr. was being interviewed in the stands. He said that in another era, Richmond III might have gotten a chance to be a Biletnikoff-type player in the NFL, but that there wasn't really a place for him in the league nowadays. It was obvious what he meant, and the announcers seemed to quickly move on to the next question...

Actually, though, even the comparison to Biletnikoff is erroneous. Biletnikoff was over 6 feet and not known for his speed; Richmond III is the classic "smurf" receiver: short, and fast as hell.

 

[Don Wassall]

Here's ESPN Classic's accompanying article about the show:


http://espn.go.com/classic/biography/s/Flowers_Richmond.html


Note the racist title-- "Fastest White Boy Alive." Even though it's in the form of a quote, you'll never find a show about, say, Willie Davenport entitled "Fastest Black Boy Alive."


I thought Richmond III is tall but StaleyWasScrewed is right, he's 5-11. Here's a biography of him from before the '04 Arena League season:


http://www.aflroundhouse.com/players/f/flowers_richmond.htm

 

[Colonel_Reb]

You sure won't find a quote like that Don. Even though he was the fastest thing going and progressive to the Caste System's standards, he was still just a white boy. The article states that Richmond called himself the fastest white boy, but I wonder how many times he really called himself that. I can see him at Tennessee in the mid to late 60's going up to the press and saying hello my name is Richmond Flowers and I'm the fastest white boy! What do ya'll think about my observation?

 

[white lightning]

I think that you are right on with your observation.If
anything,Richmond took pride in being the fastest hurdler
in the country or one of the top 2.You don't hear a black
man say he is the fastest black boy.Second,why are whites
always called white boys?You never hear a black man
called a black boy.It doesn't matter how old a adult
white male is,he is still a white boy.There are so many
double standards.

 

[sport historian]

No, he didn't go around calling himself "the fastest white boy alive," he was a rather modest fellow. Flowers was notable as the only white American Olympic Class hurler or sprinter in the late 60s. An injury caused him to miss the 1968 Trials after beating Willie Davenport aseveral times in Spring 1968. Davenport won the Gold in Mexico City.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

That's what I thought guys. It's just another stab at the white US male, the most attacked and endangered species in the world. If you call a black kid boy now, he'll probably think your a racist. I know kids who are programmed by their elders, I can't say parents, to think and act that way from an early age.

 

[speedster]

I think Richmond Flowers was a far better hurdler than a football player.Back in 1970 when he got a shot to start at safety he madea real blunder that did him in.Chiefs RB Ed Podolak was fixing to score as he was making a beeline for the endzone,Flowers had the angle on him and looked as though he was going to explode on to Podolak and prevent the touchdown,instead Flowers launched himself into Podolak with a feet-first baseball hook slide,entangled Podolak and was able to bring him down,of course he was flagged for tripping.This took place in front of Tom Landry who just shook his head while Cowboy RB Walt Garrison gave the umpire sweeping motion and said "he's safe".Flowers didn't last much longer with the Cowboys.This question is for the track guys white lightning and sports historian,who know their stuff about track history.Correct me if I'm wrong,but Flowers wasn't the only white world-class hurdler in the U.S.in the late 60's.Weren't Pat Pomphrey,Garry Power,Bill High and to a certain extent,Jeff Howser out of Duke considered world-class.I guess you can throw in guys like Geoff Vanderstock,Boyd Gittins and Ron Whitney as well,but they were 400 hurdle guys.I am so into finding out more about white American sprinters from the 40's,50's and the 60's,I just wish there was a book out there on the white sprinter.

 

[sport historian]

Yes, Richmond Flowers Jr. was a better hurdler than football player. Still, most world class sprinters can't play football as well as Flowers could. There were other white hurdlers, but Flowers was the one who might have won the Gold in 1968 if he hadn't been injured.


Richmond Flowers was on the cover of SI in 1966 and in a Newsweek article about that time as I remember. A big angle to these stories was the fact that Richmond Flowers Sr. was opposing George Wallace at the time.


You can find a lot on white sprinters of the 50's in Sports illustrated articles of the decade. Yes, SI used to run articles about white sprinters. I have two of them in my hand at the moment. The issue of 7-2-56 has David Sime and Bobby Morrow on the cover in a great color photo. The 6-4-56 issue has a article on Sime titled, "Dave Sime: Superman In Spikes."


Sime was considered better than Morrow in Spring 1956. Sime pulled a muscle before the Trials and Morrow swept the Gold in Melbourne that fall.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

There were a couple of white track guys on my high school football team. They were pretty good. So were the baseball players. The three fastest guys on the team were a white who played baseball, another who ran track, and a black who ran track. The white track star still holds some school records too. They all ran under a 4.6 in public high school in 1992 and 1993.

 

[white lightning]

Alot of people may not know the name of Casey Combest.
He holds the All Time National High School Record in the
60 meters with a 6.58.He did this in high school.He
should have been the next Bobby Morrow.He was quite a
site to see.He was only around 5'9 and probably weighed
around 130 at the most.To see this skinny white kid
blow everyone away was a site to see.Too bad he got
mixed up with the wrong crowd and gave up track.This was
only around 6 years ago.He still is only around 23 or so.
There was talk of a comeback last year,but I guess he
changed his mind.What a incredible waste of talent.He
had speed like you would not believe!I don't see his
h.s. record being broken for the next 20-30 years.He was
that good but made some stupid decisions.Most pro
sprinters/men from 20-30 have trouble running a 6.58
in the 60.He did is at 16!What a shame!Casey could have
and should have been the first white to run a sub 10
second 100 meters.It makes me sick!

 

[Colonel_Reb]

Man, so close!

 

[surfsider]

Michael Larrabee won the 400 at the '64 Olympics at the age of 30. He had run collegiately at USC. In '76 the runner-up to Edwin Moses for the silver medal was Mike Shine. I'm not completely sure but I think he was from Penn State. Bill Toomey, the winner of the '68 decathlon, holds the world record still for the 400 meters in that event. His time at Mexico City would have put him fourth in the open 400 of that Olympics in what was for a long time the fastest 400 race.