Racism affects White athletes more in basketball and football than it does in track in my opinion. But I do believe the slower physical maturation of Whites is critical in track. Whites who attend integrated schools are not as physically developed as their Black counterparts when 7th grade track starts. I don't think we really catch up until we are 21 or 22. This is important when recruiting college athletes as well. The Black kid may be faster at 18, but the White kid may pass him in a few years if he continues to train. Most don't. Most aren't recruited.
Reality!
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KG2422 said:
Let me ask you this...
Why do we not see great sprinters from Russia,Poland,Germany,Italy,China,Japan,Sweden,Denmark,Czech ,Ireland? Yes I know there was a few, just none as fast as those from Nigeria,Jamaica and Trinidad.......why? Certainly nobody is telling those guys it's a black thang.
Why has Nigeria had a handful of sub10.00 sprinters while Asia/white Europe have had none?
You mentioned rate of maturation. Well if you believe that, then it means that you do see a difference other than just skin color. Well another difference is speed.
Edited by: RaZor
I do see differences, and I wouldn't trade places. There will be at least one White sprinter break through in the 100 or 200m soon. What will be your claim to fame then? People counted us out in Basketball and Boxing and we're back. This will be no different.Edited by: KG2422
Colonel Callan
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Ah Razor playing the game as usual. Sprinting is not, never was, a big
deal in most European countries. It was and is a big deal in the US. But
this was already dealt with earlier. Blacks taking their cue from other
blacks is no surprise.
Randy Moss is no burner. He's fast on a slant, but to tell us he's a flash in
a straight line is bunk. Of course, if a white is big and fast - Shockey,
Jurevicius when he was young, McCaffrey etc. they are ignored, or called
slow or assumed to be slow when they are not slow at all. Given the way
whites are systematically shut out of the NFL, who knows how many
potential superstars are tossed to the side? It's the opposite for blacks,
who are given every opportunity in the world, and amaze us each week
with speed coupled with bad hands, poor decision making, fumble fingers
and self centeredness. The blacks given a shot at being starting QBs are
an embarrassment for the most part, something you'd never see happen
with white players. If not for the color, they'd be out of work. Then
again, we never hear RaZor or Brutal or whatever his name is today look
at the other side of things. Why are blacks such miserable QBs, despite all
the breaks - is the league going to resort to fixing everything to allow
them to win? Why do so many blacks whose statistics are held up as the
'greatest ever' turn out to be players who hung on forever, because of ego
- or poor financial acumen - and turn out to have been carried for years
while being mediocre, something that just doesn't happen with whites?
Why is this a reality?
The shrill tone coming through has been getting louder and louder. It
started with Potter and Steele, grew when Wariner showed up, became a
wail when Andy Rock began to bloom and now it's getting to be non stop.
The pendulum has begun to swing the other way, and the footsoldiers are
out in full force to deny it, belittle it, try to get us to ignore it. Too late.
The genie is out of the bottle. Fast whites are popping up here and there
around the US all of a sudden. Klech, Schuerman, etc. That's the reality.
deal in most European countries. It was and is a big deal in the US. But
this was already dealt with earlier. Blacks taking their cue from other
blacks is no surprise.
Randy Moss is no burner. He's fast on a slant, but to tell us he's a flash in
a straight line is bunk. Of course, if a white is big and fast - Shockey,
Jurevicius when he was young, McCaffrey etc. they are ignored, or called
slow or assumed to be slow when they are not slow at all. Given the way
whites are systematically shut out of the NFL, who knows how many
potential superstars are tossed to the side? It's the opposite for blacks,
who are given every opportunity in the world, and amaze us each week
with speed coupled with bad hands, poor decision making, fumble fingers
and self centeredness. The blacks given a shot at being starting QBs are
an embarrassment for the most part, something you'd never see happen
with white players. If not for the color, they'd be out of work. Then
again, we never hear RaZor or Brutal or whatever his name is today look
at the other side of things. Why are blacks such miserable QBs, despite all
the breaks - is the league going to resort to fixing everything to allow
them to win? Why do so many blacks whose statistics are held up as the
'greatest ever' turn out to be players who hung on forever, because of ego
- or poor financial acumen - and turn out to have been carried for years
while being mediocre, something that just doesn't happen with whites?
Why is this a reality?
The shrill tone coming through has been getting louder and louder. It
started with Potter and Steele, grew when Wariner showed up, became a
wail when Andy Rock began to bloom and now it's getting to be non stop.
The pendulum has begun to swing the other way, and the footsoldiers are
out in full force to deny it, belittle it, try to get us to ignore it. Too late.
The genie is out of the bottle. Fast whites are popping up here and there
around the US all of a sudden. Klech, Schuerman, etc. That's the reality.
white lightning
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It is a trend that will hopefully continue.Boxing has been taken over and they know it.From the middle weights and up.Basketball has seen a uprising not seen since the 70's to 80's.It will continue.Look at the players dominating their teams like Tyler Hansbourough of N.Carolina.He is breaking the mold and dominating leading the team in scoring & rebounding.Duke being the number 1 team in the nation virtually all season with 4 out of 5 starters being white.Josh McRoberts dunks like Kevin Garnett yet they try to ignore it.Ha.ha.ha.
Track will be no different.All we need is for kids in America to start believing in their ability again.We have been kicked and beaten down for far too long.It will happen.Look at Colt Davis who just signed with Arkansas.Even some of the big schools are slowly opening their eyes.Our biggest problem is that we are good in so many sports.Too many of these kids end up in Baseball and other sports.I have seen it for years.Parents and coaches tend to steer kids where THEY BELIEVE that the kid will have the best chance of succeeding.Wariners parents believed he could make it in track.More white parents need to support their kids and encourage them to play whatever sport they desire.Break the norm!
It will happen in football too.We just need them to give some kids like Kyle Bell a fair shot.J.Lumsden runs a 4.4 at 225 lbs of muscle.Nick Hartigan runs a 4.5 at 240 lbs of beef.These kids are huge and they do have wheels.Can you hear me Brutal?Try and be open minded and give these kids a chance!Imagine if it were your kid.He would deserve every opportunity for a fair,equal shot at making the team.
Track will be no different.All we need is for kids in America to start believing in their ability again.We have been kicked and beaten down for far too long.It will happen.Look at Colt Davis who just signed with Arkansas.Even some of the big schools are slowly opening their eyes.Our biggest problem is that we are good in so many sports.Too many of these kids end up in Baseball and other sports.I have seen it for years.Parents and coaches tend to steer kids where THEY BELIEVE that the kid will have the best chance of succeeding.Wariners parents believed he could make it in track.More white parents need to support their kids and encourage them to play whatever sport they desire.Break the norm!
It will happen in football too.We just need them to give some kids like Kyle Bell a fair shot.J.Lumsden runs a 4.4 at 225 lbs of muscle.Nick Hartigan runs a 4.5 at 240 lbs of beef.These kids are huge and they do have wheels.Can you hear me Brutal?Try and be open minded and give these kids a chance!Imagine if it were your kid.He would deserve every opportunity for a fair,equal shot at making the team.
white is right
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Germany had great sprinters, but like the US their will to compete in the sport is minimal. The first flat 10 guy was a German and he did it clean. After Hary all champions to me are suspect, because roiding was in vogue from the mid 60's in the throwing events and then later on in the sprints........Guests said:
Jimmy Chitwood
Hall of Famer
reality check here. let's take a look at what you're biased thoughts are and the corresponding facts, or "reality" as you seem to prefer...
What we don't see coming from white players is great size and speed. Go ahead give me the name of a big fast white anything? We see lots of 200 pounders or guys 6-3 with speed in the black athlete. We don't see that in his white counterpart. There just aren't white Randy Moss's or Reggie Bush's.
as has been posted already, Matt Jones is about as big, fast, and white as anyone could draw up. so big in fact, he was actually considered to make a position change to tight end. so fast that no quarterback ever ran faster than him at the combine. EVER. (remind me, didn't mike vick run at the combine a few years back?) and so white, that the NFL is bound and determined to find a way to keep him from succeeding... see the various media reports that have been posted discussing how terrible his potential is. there are others, but you just asked for one, and he's the most recent to enter the league.
as for white randy moss's, there is one... but he plays in the NBA and wishes he's black, which i'm sure you can relate to. he's the starting point guard for the Miami Heat: Jason Williams. have you heard of him? high school teammate and best friend of the aforementioned moss, he's got all the problems and drug use any black athlete lover could possibly want! plus, he is incredibly physically talented and might be the quickest player in the league. how much closer a comparison could anyone make.
and a white reggie bush? hmmm... if you had actually been looking, it wouldn't have been hard to find one. but one that actually got a chance to play Division I football would require a bit more effort. but, as sad as it will be for you, there was an equally impressive running back that emerged a couple of years ago. ever heard of Luke Staley? he was bigger (6'1", 227 pounds), averaged almost identical yards per carry (his rushing average of 8.1 yards per carry led the NCAA), was just as good of a receiver, scored more touchdowns (he led the nation in total touchdowns, 28, and scoring, 15.5 points per game), was just as fast, and won the Doak Walker Award as the nation's top running back. was he the second pick in the NFL draft and considered the savior of an NFL franchise? nope. try getting picked in the seventh round, #214 overall, and never getting a carry in an NFL game. fair and equal, right.
Martt Jones is no Randy Moos or Terrell Owens and never will be.
well Martt, or Matt as the rest of the world knows him, certainly isn't a Randy Moos or even a randy moss or terrell owens. and thank God for that! he's got no legal troubles, he's a terrific teammate, and he's never ran over a cop with his car. hmmm, poor guy will never have a chance to be great. ha!
Do you really think if some white athlete has real talent he won't get his shot?
do i really think a great white player won't get the opportunities and hype he deserves? absolutely! check out the treatment Mike Hass got. when's the last time a Biletnikoff Award winner lasted until the sixth round of the NFL draft? here's a hint...never. furthermore, how many times did you see highlights or segments about him on Sportscenter? again, never. the same could be said of Nick Hartigan, arguably the best running back ever to play in the Ivy League. but unlike former Dallas Cowboy and black running back, Yale's calvin hill who was a first round pick (#24 overall), Hartigan went completely undrafted and took several weeks to get a shot just as a rookie free agent.
shall i continue?
I've been into this stuff a lot longer than you have and I've never seen that. If he can run/play he runs/plays.
old people can be just as stupid as everyone else. and you don't get much of a view with your head in the sand. there are LOTS of white guys who can play but never get the chance.
Why do we not see great sprinters from Russia,Poland,Germany,Italy,China,Japan,Sweden,Denmark,Czech ,Ireland? Yes I know there was a few, just none as fast as those from Nigeria,Jamaica and Trinidad.......why?
check out some of the other threads. there are numerous young sprinters from those countries emerging even as i type this, although none have yet broken the 10 second barrier. maybe they should cheat like so many of their black peers have? and no one on this site has ever espoused complete white dominance of any sport. just a fair and balanced playing field on which to compete.
What we don't see coming from white players is great size and speed. Go ahead give me the name of a big fast white anything? We see lots of 200 pounders or guys 6-3 with speed in the black athlete. We don't see that in his white counterpart. There just aren't white Randy Moss's or Reggie Bush's.
as has been posted already, Matt Jones is about as big, fast, and white as anyone could draw up. so big in fact, he was actually considered to make a position change to tight end. so fast that no quarterback ever ran faster than him at the combine. EVER. (remind me, didn't mike vick run at the combine a few years back?) and so white, that the NFL is bound and determined to find a way to keep him from succeeding... see the various media reports that have been posted discussing how terrible his potential is. there are others, but you just asked for one, and he's the most recent to enter the league.
as for white randy moss's, there is one... but he plays in the NBA and wishes he's black, which i'm sure you can relate to. he's the starting point guard for the Miami Heat: Jason Williams. have you heard of him? high school teammate and best friend of the aforementioned moss, he's got all the problems and drug use any black athlete lover could possibly want! plus, he is incredibly physically talented and might be the quickest player in the league. how much closer a comparison could anyone make.
and a white reggie bush? hmmm... if you had actually been looking, it wouldn't have been hard to find one. but one that actually got a chance to play Division I football would require a bit more effort. but, as sad as it will be for you, there was an equally impressive running back that emerged a couple of years ago. ever heard of Luke Staley? he was bigger (6'1", 227 pounds), averaged almost identical yards per carry (his rushing average of 8.1 yards per carry led the NCAA), was just as good of a receiver, scored more touchdowns (he led the nation in total touchdowns, 28, and scoring, 15.5 points per game), was just as fast, and won the Doak Walker Award as the nation's top running back. was he the second pick in the NFL draft and considered the savior of an NFL franchise? nope. try getting picked in the seventh round, #214 overall, and never getting a carry in an NFL game. fair and equal, right.
Martt Jones is no Randy Moos or Terrell Owens and never will be.
well Martt, or Matt as the rest of the world knows him, certainly isn't a Randy Moos or even a randy moss or terrell owens. and thank God for that! he's got no legal troubles, he's a terrific teammate, and he's never ran over a cop with his car. hmmm, poor guy will never have a chance to be great. ha!
Do you really think if some white athlete has real talent he won't get his shot?
do i really think a great white player won't get the opportunities and hype he deserves? absolutely! check out the treatment Mike Hass got. when's the last time a Biletnikoff Award winner lasted until the sixth round of the NFL draft? here's a hint...never. furthermore, how many times did you see highlights or segments about him on Sportscenter? again, never. the same could be said of Nick Hartigan, arguably the best running back ever to play in the Ivy League. but unlike former Dallas Cowboy and black running back, Yale's calvin hill who was a first round pick (#24 overall), Hartigan went completely undrafted and took several weeks to get a shot just as a rookie free agent.
shall i continue?
I've been into this stuff a lot longer than you have and I've never seen that. If he can run/play he runs/plays.
old people can be just as stupid as everyone else. and you don't get much of a view with your head in the sand. there are LOTS of white guys who can play but never get the chance.
Why do we not see great sprinters from Russia,Poland,Germany,Italy,China,Japan,Sweden,Denmark,Czech ,Ireland? Yes I know there was a few, just none as fast as those from Nigeria,Jamaica and Trinidad.......why?
check out some of the other threads. there are numerous young sprinters from those countries emerging even as i type this, although none have yet broken the 10 second barrier. maybe they should cheat like so many of their black peers have? and no one on this site has ever espoused complete white dominance of any sport. just a fair and balanced playing field on which to compete.
Well said Jimmy Chitwood. Unlikely though it might seem, the Jeff Blake interview cited on some other threads certainly buttresses your point. While saying he thinks there should be more black NFL QB's he wonders where all the great white high school running backs, receivers and tracksters he played and ran against in Texas were. I wonder...
OC football
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One problem is that white kids just have so many sports to choose from. With blacks, however, it is between basketball, football and track.
Here is Southern Cali my friends played sports like ... water polo, swimming, diveing, surfing, skate boarding, volleyball, baseball, soccer, tennis (ok rare), gymnastics, softball, golf, lacrosse, and hockey... my high school offered each of these sports either as official CIF designations or through off campus-school sponsored-club leagues. I knew kids who participated in each of these sports and took them just as seriously as I took football (we were ranked 5th in the nation). Each of these sports are considered "white sports" in California with the sole exception of soccer. Soccer is, however, a white sport at the most competative high school level. Asians play badmitton and handball but we didnt have a team for those two sports. Anyways my point is that white kids are playing a diverse array of sports. We cant dominate EVERYTHING. But we will try.
Here is Southern Cali my friends played sports like ... water polo, swimming, diveing, surfing, skate boarding, volleyball, baseball, soccer, tennis (ok rare), gymnastics, softball, golf, lacrosse, and hockey... my high school offered each of these sports either as official CIF designations or through off campus-school sponsored-club leagues. I knew kids who participated in each of these sports and took them just as seriously as I took football (we were ranked 5th in the nation). Each of these sports are considered "white sports" in California with the sole exception of soccer. Soccer is, however, a white sport at the most competative high school level. Asians play badmitton and handball but we didnt have a team for those two sports. Anyways my point is that white kids are playing a diverse array of sports. We cant dominate EVERYTHING. But we will try.
sport historian
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Razor, I have heard of John Roderick, "the fastest white receiver to ever play in the NFL." Technically, Roderick played in the AFL with Miami and Oakland from 1966-68. You can find his stats at databasefootball.com. I don't remember any mention of him in the sporting press of the time, except for a football preview magazine which described him as a 9.3 sprinter. Databasefootball lists as 6-1, 180 pounds. I don't know what happened with him, probably either poor hands or injuries.