Olympics vs. NBA white performance

[referendum]

Since 2000, the performance of European teams, plus Argentina has been phenomenal in Olympic play as well as in the World Championship games, defeating a US team on a regular basis, albeit one not quite running at full capacity, but still with a healthy dose of NBA all-stars. Yet, when members of these same teams (Lithuania, Spain, Argentina, Serbia etc.) play in the NBA they don't do nearly as well. Admittedly, a Ginobili or a Nowitzki will excell, but there are plenty of underperformers out there as well. Question is, are they not getting enough playing time, and if not, why then do Nash, Gausol, Nowitzki and Stojokovic get loads of playing time? Are the blacks on the teams shutting them out, and if thats the case, what about the same players I mentioned, why are they able to rise above the situation and excell? Perhaps one indication is that of the international players one does have an elite, (Nowitki, Nash, Stojakovic, and Gausol) with a small middle class (Kristic, Giricik, etc.) and a big lower class, like Milicic, Caparbacka, Lampe, Welsh, etc. If one had an even playing field perhaps more of the lower class would be in the middle class calibre of play?

 

[jaxvid]

I think a lot of things go into a player being succesful in the NBA. I'm sure you watch games and see that the rotation and the game situation has a big effect on how a player does. There can be no doubt that a lot of white foreign players are going to be shutdown because:

1) the coaches don't want to disturb team chemistry and make them the go to guy and call their number,
2) they are not gonna get the shots that the black players do,
3) they are not going to get the calls that the black players do
4)they are not going to get the ball enough

Most foreign players that succeed do so because they generate their own offense and are less dependent on having someone get them the ball. And most foreigners are brought over to be role players not stars so you see a lot of big center types, and other role players, not the kind of guys that garner the big media attention.

 

[KG2422]

They pass the ball. In their home countries it comes back to them for a good shot and they make it. Here, the blacks like to bounce the ball too much.

 

[Guest]

they're a lot better when 5 of them play together. i think that's all there is to it.

in the NBA they get stripped down to 1 on 1 play where blacks are much, much, much better. few men of any race can beat a black man off the dribble.

 

[White Shogun]

few men of any race can beat a black man off the dribble.

Thanks, Jody! You actually made me laugh out loud for real, with that inane comment.

You use the term "black man" like they're some kind of monolithic super being, all endowed with an innate ability to bounce a round ball beyond the comprehension of us mere mortals. Would you like to continue by educating us on how the 'black man' is a better dancer and more well-hung than any other male on the planet?

Oh, before I forget, is Shaquille O'Neal a black man? Have you ever seen him dribble? And I'm not talking about drool, either.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

Good retort WHite Shogun!

 

[Guest]

blacks are great dancers and do have the biggest dicks. so what?

the NBA is 90% black because blacks are 10 times better at basketball than whites and 100 times better than mexicans and asians. NBA basketball is about 1 on 1 play. blacks totally, TOTALLY dominate that.

the demographics of the NBA have almost nothing to do with discrimination. it's not like the NFL at all.

 

[White Shogun]

jody:

i will type in small letters with no capitilization and little grammar so you can keep up

every message you post to the forum begs the question, why are you here? for what purpose do you post on this forum you do not support white athletes you don't think white athletes are discriminated against and you think blacks are superior all-around athletes

are you counting how many messages you can post before you get banned?

are you telling all your friends how badly you are telling off all the white neonazi redneck hillbillies on castefootball and that they should come check out your hilarious hijinx?

and your sarcasm meter needs retuning, this

Would you like to continue by educating us on how the 'black man' is a better dancer and more well-hung than any other male on the planet?

was sarcasm, not a statement of fact

so, tell us why you are here jody what does being a member of caste football do for you

 

[Guest]

white shogun:

somebody asked a simple question and i gave the simple answer. i'm sorry the truth about basketball bothers you.

white players are better in international play because they are better when 5 of them play together. when they are stripped down to 1 on 1 play in the NBA they consistently get beat off the dribble. white players are dramatically worse than black players at driving, creating their own shot, and defending. i am not even going to argue about this with you because i simply know more about this than you. i actually watch every NBA game i can and have for years.

those are the plain facts. the only interesting question left is why no NBA franchise takes advantage of this and fields a team with 12 white players. the answer is: because it would cost too much, and because they would still lose too much to other balanced teams. it wouldn't guarantee a championship.

whites are still a lot better than every other race at basketball, but in the harsh world of sports, second place is the first loser.Edited by: jody

 

[GreatLakeState]

Luckily none of these guys were self-hating defeatists:

Bob Pettit
Steve Nash
Paul Arizin
Sarunas Marciulunas
Larry Bird
Rick Barry
Drazen Petrovic
Dirk Nowitzki
John Havlicek
Bob Cousy
Chris Mullin
Jerry West
Pete Maravich
Kevin McHale
Bobby Jones
Detlef Schrempf
Dave Cowens
Dan Issel
Dolph Shayes
Billy Cunningham
Jerry Lucas
Dave DeBusschere
Cliff Hagan
Bill Sharman
Bill Bradley
Gail Goodrich
Frank Ramsey
Jack Twyman
Arvydas Sabonis

 

[white tornado]

jody did you watch the playoffs last year. Steve Nash and Manu got to the rack every game. Also Andrei Kirilenko is the best defensive player in the league.

 

[White Shogun]

jody says:

i actually watch every NBA game i can and have for years.

or, to paraphrase: I Watch Games on TV, so I Know What I'm Talking About.

Did you also stay at the Holiday Inn? Edited by: White Shogun

 

[REDNOSE]

Jody-


Most black players are ballhogging, attention craving, selfish players. Yes, they tend to drive to the hole more. They want the limelight on themselves rather than pass to the wide open man ready for the shot. Therefore, they attempt to drive to the hole more, and much of the time draw questionable foul calls(Kobe and Iverson), that many white players wouldn't get. You also fail to recognize arguably the best slasher in the game(Manu), who the white hating Charles Barkley absolutely raves about on TNT. He loves Manu and the cast on that show consider him to have the quickest first step and love the way he finishes. Manu accomplishes all this while being draped on all the way to the basket and doesn't receive half of the foul calls that other black players get.

 

[JD074]

the only interesting question left is why no NBA franchise takes advantage of this and fields a team with 12 white players. the answer is: because it would cost too much, and because they would still lose too much to other balanced teams. it wouldn't guarantee a championship.

How would it cost too much? Are you saying that white players are more expensive? You must mean something else.

And what do you mean by balanced? Teams with both black and white players?

No, an all-white team doesn't guarantee a championship, but neither does an all-black one. But that hasn't stopped so many owners and GM's from having all black or nearly all black teams for years.

 

[hedgehog]

Dont waste your time responding to Jody. He is just trying to impersonate and develope a character/attitude that contradicts what this web site is about., in the hopes of getting angry replies. .

 

[White Shogun]

Dont waste your time responding to Jody. He is just trying to impersonate and develope a character/attitude that contradicts what this web site is about., in the hopes of getting angry replies. .

Thank you, KJ. I agree 100%, despite my previous attempts to engage him/her/it in worthwhile debate.

 

[Uberberserker]

referendum, I think the reason for the disparity is that there is a MASSIVE difference between the NBA style game (lots of Isolation plays, lazy players don't want to play Defense) and the International Styles of the game. (more ball movement, actual plays being run, and more 3-pt shots due to shorter 3pt line) There is also a further difference when one adds in the College Hoops style game as well as that is WAY more Coach controlled.

Basicly what it comes down to is one is talking about three different things and the skill sets that are useful in one style of game may not be useful in another style.

When you take the Black NBA players who know nothing but the NBA style of play and put them in the International Style they just don't have the proper skills to compete (one of the big ones is not being used to playing against Zone Defenses, which are almost never used in the NBA) Also many of them are used to getting preferential treatment from the Refs and that disappears in the International Style and they actually get called for fouls (can you say Tim Duncan? LOL!)

 

[Southern Knight]

I will agree with jody on one point -- the NBA is really a one-on-one
league. In fact, the league has reduced the floor-play to what is
essentially 5 simultaneous games of one-on-one basketball. (In
fact, I really don't consider the NBA to be a pure "basketball" product
at all). This makes for great highlights and high-flying action,
but the game itself is L.O.U.S.Y.



The NBA has all but abolished lane violations and traveling
fouls. Pushing, shoving, and "posting" have replaced
intelligent ball movement and "flow." Great shooters are ignored
in favor of talent-less dunkers.



If the NBA played the way the rest of the world plays, i.e. the "right"
way, White players would be more prominent in the league, no
question. As it is now, Whites are either superstars (Ginobili,
Nowitzki) or end-of-the-bench journeymen employed to provide a few free
throws at the end of the game.



It gladdens me to know that fan interest in the NBA has been droping for several years. For once, we have a nice trend.

 

[Gary]

Let me see now-Argentina won the Gold Medal in basketball not Kenya. So based on these facts White men must play better basketball!

By the way Gene Kelley was a great dancer!! Elvis Presley had much better hip movement then Stevie Wonder!!

 

[Uberberserker]

I will agree with jody on one point -- the NBA is really a one-on-one league.

Yes it is.

One good example would be to watch Cavaliers games where they do nothing but give the ball the Lebron James (although I must say I can't really blame them since he is a good player). Watch for the few minutes that Lebron James is out of the game and you will just see 5 players standing around not sure of what to do. No ball movement at all! In fact on ESPN they actually had a segment that highlighted this last year. (in case you are curious I like to watch Cavaliers games to cheer on Luke Jackson who is from around here, in fact I need to go and check out some of his stats for this year...)

Really when one thinks about it the NBA is far closer to AND1 Streetball then it is to International or College type basketball and the later are certainly more 'pure' forms of basketball certainly closer to what James Naismith probably intended. We should just be able to call a spade a spade (irony intended!) that's all.

 

[Alpha Male]

Hey Jody,

whites can't play defense, huh? Why don't you tell that to John Stockton, the all time steal leader. Not to mention asists as well. Edited by: Alpha Male

 

[ch2sagana]

The NBA-poweredUSA fivedid not win in the recent Olympics because guys like Allen Iverson and Stephon Marbury dribbled too much and did not shoot well enough from the perimeter to break a strong zone defense. The forwards were not better either . Shawn Marion's ugly jumpers didn't go in oftenenough to make a difference. Of course, the Americans were playing in an unfamiliar grounds but the facts were obvious in the American game: poor perimeter game, too much dribbling and isolation plays, bad fundamentals anda matching attitude.


Theoriginal Dream Team of 1992 was the greatest ever not just because ofits collection of talentsbut more so to their adherence to teamworks and fundamentals. And everyone in the team, from the John Stockton (the smallest guy) to David Robinson (the tallest) had a JUMPSHOT- a fast dying art in American basketball.