I've been spending some time checking out white college RB of the 70's and 80's particularly the guys I'm not that familiar with like Mike Voight,Don McCauley,Steve Beaird,Louie Giammona,Steve Giese,Steve Jones,Mike Esposito,Mike Augustyniak and Steve Strachan to name a few.I came across a fellow who played in the 60's named Mike Hull.This guy had good speed and was elusive enough where he was given the nickname Bambi yet he was mostly a blocking back for Mike Garrett and O.J.Simpson at USC.Sound familiar,geez that type of crap took place way back then.Some years later he said he was proud to have blocked for O.J. and Garrett and Gale Sayers as a pro.It made me think of Brian Leonard when he said he was happy to block for Ray Rice,I just hope he doesn't say that as a pro.
Mike(Bambi)Hull
- Thread starter speedster
- Start date
Giammona was the nation's leading rusher in 1974 with Utah State. I believe he was the last white player to do so until Chance Kretschmer led the country as a freshman at Nevada in 2001, a span of 27 years.
Kretschmer was rejected in total by the NFL, not even being signed as a free agent for training camp fodder. Giammona didn't fare much better even 30 years ago, playing in the NFL for six seasons with two teams, but only once getting more than 39 carries in a season.
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/GiamLo00.htm
Kretschmer was rejected in total by the NFL, not even being signed as a free agent for training camp fodder. Giammona didn't fare much better even 30 years ago, playing in the NFL for six seasons with two teams, but only once getting more than 39 carries in a season.
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/GiamLo00.htm
Colonel_Reb
Hall of Famer
Wow! I would have thought Mr. Everything "the best player in college football" Archie Griffin would have been the top runner in football in 1974. I wish the Aggies started a white back now. Kretschmer's case is a real travesty. I've heard of Mike Hull before, but nothing about his college days.
I recall seeing a Washington game on ESPN Classic from 1979 a few years ago and being very impressed by Steele. He looked very fast and elusive. There's not much info on him on the Internet, but he did set the Huskie career rushing mark with over 3,000 yards. He was drafted by the Seahawks in the 5th round but isn't listed in Pro Football Reference so he must never have played in the NFL.
Colonel_Reb
Hall of Famer
speedster, you might also look up Hoyle Granger while your at it. I know his son, who was a good running back at his school several years back.
Joe Steele was a good find as he had over 3,000 yards rushing for his career at Washington.It's kind of cool when I'm checking these guys out and it turns out they're white.The latest RB I found was Chuck Heater out of Michigan who I thought was black.Sometimes it works the other way when I think a guy is white and isn't like Charles Wysocki out of Maryland.Ebay is good in finding the race of these players and for the numbers I go to the schools website and click on to their football media guide.Going back to Chuck Heater his Michigan teams sure ran the ball a ton,as much as 75 times again.
Louie Giammona was a terrific player, though the night I saw him, in 1975, the Texas Longhorns held him in check. I believe that Giamomona is related to Dick Vermiel, one of the reasons he wound up playing for him in Philly.
Hoyle Granger! YES. As a kid, he was my favorite Houston Oiler. Power, power, power. I recall his son played at Katy High, Reb, I'd be interested in knowing more about him.
Mike Voight was superb at NC and I really remember Steve Beird at Baylor who was a bowling ball. Joe Steele was a big, strong back but I believe he suffered some injuries in college.
Some other white backs of the 1960s and 70s:
Charley Tolar "The Human Bowling Ball" of the Houston Oilers 1960-66; Billy Cannon was a bit of a disappointment as a pro but was versitile enough to switch to TE late in his career and last a long, long time. Ode Burrell of the Oilers and Mississippi State.
Dick Post Univ. Of Houston and the SD Chargers was really something else. A forgotton but fine back who actually outshone the much-hyped Warren McVea. Added bonus: McVea said Post "didn't like black players." Jim Strong of U Houston and the NO Saints ran for 1,300 yards in 1969.
U of Texas: Steve Worster, Chris Gilbert, Ernie and Ted Koy, Jimmy Saxton, Ray Pouge. For my money, Gilbert was the best of this bunch, fantastic runner, speed, balance, EVERYTHING to be a star. But he prefered to go to med school rather than play with the NY Jets, DAMN. Gilbert was the first runner in NCAA history to gain 1,000 yards in three seasons(1966, 67, 68).
Ernie Koy was a teammate of Tucker Frederickson's in NY with the Giants, another white back you should check out.
Tommy Mason (Tulane), Bill Brown and Dave Osborne of the Minn. Vikes.
Bert Coan from Pasadena, TX played at Kansas prior to Sayers and later plaed with the KC Chiefs. Big speed back.
Bill & Bobby Burnett at Arkansas. Bobby was AFL rookie of the year with the Bills.
Don't forget Steve Bartalo of Colorado State who played in the 1980s. Still holds records for the Rams, a really fine player.
Fred Willis was an underrated back with the Bengals and Oilers in the 1970s, played at Boston College.
Mike Richardson and Johnny Roderick at SMU in the 1960s. Mike played at Houston and Roderick with Miami.
Man, there are so many.
Hoyle Granger! YES. As a kid, he was my favorite Houston Oiler. Power, power, power. I recall his son played at Katy High, Reb, I'd be interested in knowing more about him.
Mike Voight was superb at NC and I really remember Steve Beird at Baylor who was a bowling ball. Joe Steele was a big, strong back but I believe he suffered some injuries in college.
Some other white backs of the 1960s and 70s:
Charley Tolar "The Human Bowling Ball" of the Houston Oilers 1960-66; Billy Cannon was a bit of a disappointment as a pro but was versitile enough to switch to TE late in his career and last a long, long time. Ode Burrell of the Oilers and Mississippi State.
Dick Post Univ. Of Houston and the SD Chargers was really something else. A forgotton but fine back who actually outshone the much-hyped Warren McVea. Added bonus: McVea said Post "didn't like black players." Jim Strong of U Houston and the NO Saints ran for 1,300 yards in 1969.
U of Texas: Steve Worster, Chris Gilbert, Ernie and Ted Koy, Jimmy Saxton, Ray Pouge. For my money, Gilbert was the best of this bunch, fantastic runner, speed, balance, EVERYTHING to be a star. But he prefered to go to med school rather than play with the NY Jets, DAMN. Gilbert was the first runner in NCAA history to gain 1,000 yards in three seasons(1966, 67, 68).
Ernie Koy was a teammate of Tucker Frederickson's in NY with the Giants, another white back you should check out.
Tommy Mason (Tulane), Bill Brown and Dave Osborne of the Minn. Vikes.
Bert Coan from Pasadena, TX played at Kansas prior to Sayers and later plaed with the KC Chiefs. Big speed back.
Bill & Bobby Burnett at Arkansas. Bobby was AFL rookie of the year with the Bills.
Don't forget Steve Bartalo of Colorado State who played in the 1980s. Still holds records for the Rams, a really fine player.
Fred Willis was an underrated back with the Bengals and Oilers in the 1970s, played at Boston College.
Mike Richardson and Johnny Roderick at SMU in the 1960s. Mike played at Houston and Roderick with Miami.
Man, there are so many.
Keith Lincoln was a star runner with the Chargers in the '60s, but injuries cut short his career.
Joe Don Looney has been mentioned before. He had a world of talent but was too flakey to realize it in the NFL.
Rob Lytle set Michigan's single season rushing record in '76 and finished third in the Heisman balloting, but didn't do much in the NFL.
Heisman winner Steve Owens had one good year in the NFL (over 1,000 yards with the Lions in '71).
Joe Don Looney has been mentioned before. He had a world of talent but was too flakey to realize it in the NFL.
Rob Lytle set Michigan's single season rushing record in '76 and finished third in the Heisman balloting, but didn't do much in the NFL.
Heisman winner Steve Owens had one good year in the NFL (over 1,000 yards with the Lions in '71).
sport historian
Master
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2004
- Messages
- 2,954
I remember that Mike Hull had a good year at USC in 1966, the year after Mike Garret's senior year, and the year prior to O.J. Simpson's arrival. In 1967, Hull was injured and missed the entire season. The Bears drafted him in 1968 and tried him at TE as I recall. Hull played with George Allen's Redskins from 1971-74 as a special team specialist. I remember a Sport magazine story in 1968 on the leading prospects. The scouts described Mike Hull as "a beautiful looking runner who doesn't deliver in games as you think he should." He never seems to have recovered from college injuries.
I saw Joe Steele play on TV for Washington in a Rose Bowl. Warren Moon was his QB. Steele had his best year as a sophomore, but tailed off due to injuries. An oddity is that he was nearly 6-4, runners with extra height usually are injury prone.
Bert Coan was a high school sprint champion. He went to, I believe TCU, but transferred to Kansas. Coan had a big year at Kansas in 1960, but the NCAA ruled him ineligible, forcing Kansas to forfeit the games he played. He played for the Kansas City Chiefs from 1963-68, Hank Stram said that Coan reminded him of Tom Harmon. Coan always had trouble with his legs. He was also 6-4.
I saw Joe Steele play on TV for Washington in a Rose Bowl. Warren Moon was his QB. Steele had his best year as a sophomore, but tailed off due to injuries. An oddity is that he was nearly 6-4, runners with extra height usually are injury prone.
Bert Coan was a high school sprint champion. He went to, I believe TCU, but transferred to Kansas. Coan had a big year at Kansas in 1960, but the NCAA ruled him ineligible, forcing Kansas to forfeit the games he played. He played for the Kansas City Chiefs from 1963-68, Hank Stram said that Coan reminded him of Tom Harmon. Coan always had trouble with his legs. He was also 6-4.
Colonel_Reb
Hall of Famer
The University of Houston integrated early for a Southern school and by the late 60s played quite a number of blacks. It doesn't surprise me to hear Dick Post's comments. I have a 1966 Ole Miss yearbook with highlights from the 1965 season. Under the Houston game, there is a picture with a Rebel laying a crushing form tackle on McVea. The caption reads "who says we discriminate?" I thought it was hilarious.
Edited by: Colonel_Reb
Sports Historian,what kind of year did Mike Hull have in 1966 in terms of numbers.Did he lead USC in rushing?In Mike Voight's senior season he was joined in the backfield by James Betterson who also rushed for 1000 yards,was he white? One more.Jeff Logan of Ohio State who played in the mid-seventies and went to North Canton Hoover high school,was he white? Does anyone know.
speedster said:
Jeff Logan is as white as driven snow. However, he was used as more of the old school type running fullbacks and not a halfback. He was used as a goaline guy and the lead blocker for Archie Griffin. He was captain of the 76' OSU team I want to say.
sport historian
Master
- Joined
- Dec 18, 2004
- Messages
- 2,954
speedster said:
I checked in my basement where I have hundreds of sports magazines going back to the 60s. I had a college football preview for 1967, but couldn't find it, nor the Sport Magazine I mentioned that referred to Mike Hull.
As I remember, USC used two other tailbacks in 1966 in addition to Hull, who also played some FB. He didn't have a big yardage total, but looked good at times. Hull may have led USC in rushing but I'm uncertain. He had good "triangle numbers." I don't know what happened, but Hull suffered an injury and played hardly at all in 1967. O.J. came from junior college and started setting records.
I have a memory of watching the 1968 Rose Bowl on TV, and during a shot of the USC sidelines, saw Mike Hull wearing No. 23 kneeling near the Trojan bench. It stood out to me because he had played in 1966 and was mentioned in the preseason magazines.
Hull went to the Bears, but had lost his speed. After a trial at FB, he was moved to TE. As I said previously, he was a special team player for Washington from 1971-74.
James Betterson was black. Jeff Logan was white, as has already been said.
Don Wassall said:
Steele was fast and elusive.
I remember he was also used as a kick-off returner.
I was sure he was going to make it big in the NFL, but he tore up his knee (I think) in college, and that effectively ended his career.
Shame. He was an unusual running back in that he was tall.
I do recall Jeff Logan at Ohio State. Smallish, but very tough. I also remember Brian Baschnagle who played for the Bucks around the time of Archie Griffin as did Champ Hensen.
Jim Otis was a member of the 1968 Ohio State team but I remember him playing for the St. Louis Cardinals in the 1970s. He was a good back who ran for 1,000-plus in 1975. Another Ohio Stater: Tom Barrington of the NOLA Saints.
Cannot believe I left Jim Bertelsen out of my original post! Bertelsen was a really fine all-American (1971) runner at Texas and then played with the LA Rams.
Three backs from the Oakland Raiders to remember: Marv Hubbard, Pete Banaszak and Mark VanEeghen. Van Eegahan was a very underrated back who had three 1,000-plus yard seasons in 1976, 77 and 78. When I was in high school he was one of my favorites. Like VanEeghan, Hubbard played college ball at Colgate and was a tough fullback. Banaszak played with the Raiders from 1966-78 13 seasons!
I am saving Joe Don Looney for a whole post. Looney might have overshadowed Jim Brown if he had his head on straight. He certainly deserves mention.
Steve Owens is another of my favorite runners.
Let's not forget Ed Marinaro who was fantastic as at Cornell but had low rushing totals in the NFL. Cosmo Iacavazzi of Princeton, a very tough Single Wing fullback who led the Tigers to an unbeaten season in 1964. Also Keith Elias of Princeton: 1,500 yards in 1992 and 1,700 in 1993.
Jim Otis was a member of the 1968 Ohio State team but I remember him playing for the St. Louis Cardinals in the 1970s. He was a good back who ran for 1,000-plus in 1975. Another Ohio Stater: Tom Barrington of the NOLA Saints.
Cannot believe I left Jim Bertelsen out of my original post! Bertelsen was a really fine all-American (1971) runner at Texas and then played with the LA Rams.
Three backs from the Oakland Raiders to remember: Marv Hubbard, Pete Banaszak and Mark VanEeghen. Van Eegahan was a very underrated back who had three 1,000-plus yard seasons in 1976, 77 and 78. When I was in high school he was one of my favorites. Like VanEeghan, Hubbard played college ball at Colgate and was a tough fullback. Banaszak played with the Raiders from 1966-78 13 seasons!
I am saving Joe Don Looney for a whole post. Looney might have overshadowed Jim Brown if he had his head on straight. He certainly deserves mention.
Steve Owens is another of my favorite runners.
Let's not forget Ed Marinaro who was fantastic as at Cornell but had low rushing totals in the NFL. Cosmo Iacavazzi of Princeton, a very tough Single Wing fullback who led the Tigers to an unbeaten season in 1964. Also Keith Elias of Princeton: 1,500 yards in 1992 and 1,700 in 1993.