Kelly Pavlik vs. Edison Miranda

White Shogun

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Looking at their records and reputations, why was Pavlik such an underdog?

Just goes to show that being muscle bound and ripped isn't always what it's crack up to be.
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Angelcynn

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Absolutly fantastic news! They didn't show the fight over here across the pond but im so glad to here he won. Can't wait to watch the highlights on Youtube, the Pavlik hate mob must be o so silent now!!! If Pavlik doesn't get the praise and acknowlagement that he deserves by Boxing pundits after this fight then thats just awful. The 'ghost' is well and truly up there with the best and whether he or Calzaghe fights Taylor, we all know that it's time for the white boxer to take over this division once and for all and shut the mouths of the anti white fighter!
 

emt1

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I missed this fight too, but i'm glad Pavlik won, hopefully someone would post this fight on youtube.
 

speedster

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Kelly showed no fear he swarmed him from the outset with every punch in the book non-stop.Miranda looked like a beaten fighter early on.Another big-mouthed mental-defective negro, who made an ass of himself at the pre-fight press conference,gets pounded.They will never learn.Congratulations,Kelly you truly are the main man now and with that height and reach advantage you will be very tough to beat.
 

Maple Leaf

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Truly a fine piece of entertainment, this fight. The outcome was foreseeable. Miranda couldn't beat a man with a broken jaw who couldn't breath -Abraham- because he doesn't have the skills to do it. So how was he supposed to Pavlik? Essentially, Miranda's reputation came from being a hard puncher, being black, being in good shape, and being a wild swinger in the ring. Pavlik's has been poorly regarded by many, although they will not admit it, because he is white. Pavlik is an enormous middlewight. He has very good skills, takes a punch like a kick to the head, listens to his corner and is coachable, and he has what most whites have naturally in abundance: power. That is something that is rarely mentioned anywhere and yet is difficult to ignore: whites are naturally the strongest race and it takes strength to have punching power...

Saying that is enough to get you booted off many websites forever. Man I love this website...
 

guest301

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emt1 said:
I missed this fight too, but i'm glad Pavlik won, hopefully someone would post this fight on youtube.

Ditto. Great news. Don't have HBO. Hope it gets posted on youtube soon.Pavlik is a hero in my neck of the woods. Hometown boy.
 

Hockaday

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White Shogun said:
Looking at their records and reputations, why was Pavlik such an underdog?

Just goes to show that being muscle bound and ripped isn't always what it's crack up to be.
smiley36.gif

To be fair, this was Pavlik's first step up from B level competition. Miranda had fought a somewhat higher level and had already been in a title fight. So on the surface Miranda was the favorite. Even at that, he was only 7-5, so the oddsmakers were on to his limitations and Pavlik's firepower.

The surprise to me was Pavlik's chin. I watched the replay, and he took some hellacious shots. Miranda's morale plummeted when he saw that.

I understand that somebody had to really go to bat for Kelly to get him on HBO. Some of the clueless tightasses there (the same morons who think Jerlame Taylor is star material) just couldn't buy into a white knockout artist.

Now they know.
 

Charles Martel

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Kelly Pavlik's promoter Bob Arum has connections at HBO. Usually the top men at HBO won't do anything that might help promote a white boxer.Edited by: JD1986
 

JD074

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Yeah, Pavlik's chin was the X-Factor. (We already knew about the punching power.) And also his stamina. At one point I thought he might punch himself out. But instead he punched out Miranda!
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Maple Leaf said:
Essentially, Miranda's reputation came from being a hard puncher, being black, being in good shape, and being a wild swinger in the ring. Pavlik's has been poorly regarded by many, although they will not admit it, because he is white.

Yeah, Miranda was a "perfect storm" of hype and exaggeration. Black, muscular, good power, trash talker, tragic childhood, and a controversial loss on his record (that gives something for the fans to rant about.) That's a friggin' wet dream for the media and fans who yearn for black fighters to worship.
Edited by: JD074
 
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JD1986 said:
Yes Hockaday, Kelly Pavlik's promoter Bob Arum has connections at HBO. Usually the top men at HBO won't do anything that might help promote a white boxer - I know why, but that's a big can of worms I shouldn't open on this website.


OPEN IT!!! OPEN IT!!!!....LOL...That's why were here...LOL....Got me interested...lol..Are HBO boxing programers black or something??....
 
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Doc Holliday said:
JD1986 said:
Yes Hockaday, Kelly Pavlik's promoter Bob Arum has connections at HBO. Usually the top men at HBO won't do anything that might help promote a white boxer - I know why, but that's a big can of worms I shouldn't open on this website.


OPEN IT!!! OPEN IT!!!!....LOL...That's why were here...LOL....Got me interested...lol..Are HBO boxing programers black or something??....

Bob Arum is a big supporter of white fighters.He loves the klitschkos.Taylor's mandatory is Kelly "The Ghost" Pavlik.Taylor has one year to face his mandatory or he will be stripped of his WBC middleweight title.
 

Charles Martel

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I wonder if Pavlik will face Taylor next? I think Taylor will try to avoid him, and choose an easier opponent like an aging Hopkins or a smaller fighter.Edited by: JD1986
 
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JD1986 said:
Are HBO boxing programers black or something??....

Not Black, but "or something" and most of them hate white boxers, in fact all white athletes and all white people who are not in their group. Bob Arum is one of these "or somethings", but he doesn't seem to hate us. They own 96% of the media in the US, including HBO, and most media in Canada and Britain as well.

You can probably figure out who I mean. They've been promoting black athletes for many decades now. They see black people as less threatening to them so they always favor them over whites. But see I've opened a nasty can of worms and should say no more.[/QUOTE]


GOTCHA!!!.....& see why u wouldn't want to go there...LOL..Especially on this site...LOL...

Thanks!!!...


Another cheers for Kelly Pavlik!!
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dkr77

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I really liked how Pavlik made Miranda fight off his heals. Pavlik was non stop aggression and initially I thought his strategy might backfire. I was dead wrong. Apparently, Pavlik has a good corner and they know exactly what he is capable of. I don't think Taylor want's anything to do with Pavlik and he will most likely duck him.
 

Hockaday

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dkr77 said:
The key to this fight is Pavlik's jab and some good lateral movement. Top it off with a sprinkling of body shot's and some well timed overhand right's and Miranda might not see the 6th round. Looking forward to it
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Good call.
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Especially about the body shots. Those really brought Miranda's hands down. Bookmaker material here. Edited by: Hockaday
 

JD074

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Arum was beaming like a proud papa after the fight. Or maybe he was just thinking about dollar signs.
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In the past, Arum said that Pavlik was being held back because of a "negative perception of white fighters:"

Arum last week said on a national conference call that middleweight champion Jermain Taylor and contender Winky Wright are afraid of Pavlik because of his power. Arum then raised both eyebrows and ire when he suggested that Pavlik hasn't been embraced by HBO or Showtime because he's white.

Arum was careful to say that Pavlik is not the victim of evil intentions, only that a negative perception of white fighters might stand in the way of a contract with one of the two major networks.

"You can't say, 'He's a white kid who can't fight. Why waste time with him on the network?'" Arum said. "Really, that's the reverse prejudice we have now. Not that the network people are bad people. It's just a perception. They judge people by their racial background.

"The general tendency is [to believe] that white guys can't fight. It's much tougher for a white kid to break through, like a Kelly Pavlik."

[url]http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/boxing/news/story?id=228599 3[/url]
 

Charles Martel

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A British version of the Pavlik vs. Miranda fight is now available on YouTube. Just go to YouTube.com and search Pavlik Miranda and several videos will come up.
 

Angelcynn

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I can't believe it! Yea I saw that on youtube aswell JD1986 and it was from the Skysports channel which is a British sports channel which I have! I missed the fight thinking it wasn't going to be shown! dammit, o well at least I saw what mattered and that was the KO! BOOM!
 

JD074

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For Pavlik and Co. this win was more than just about securing a title shot at Taylor - who would decision Spinks later that evening - it was about changing a stereotype/skepticism that exists with white fighters from the Midwest.

This white guy showed he can fight (a lot).

"I think I had to prove it," said the 25-year old native of Youngstown. "And I think that is behind us now. I think the world knows I'm legit." Pavlik would then point out that other world champions that have his complexion, like Wladimir Klitschko, Ricky Hatton, Joe Calzaghe and Mikkel Kessler. But what makes Pavlik unusual is that he hails from the United States. Which in the 21st century is a rarity.

And those who have handled his career have had to fight the perception that this wasn't just another built-up 'white hope' or a boxer to be used as cannon fodder.

"Well, forget Ohio, if you say you have a white fighter, they immediately say, 'He can't fight'. Doesn't matter if he's from New York City or Philadelphia, wouldn't matter. So you're always going to live with that. But y'know what? A lot of that's true and I'm not going to sit here and argue that it's not- because it is" says Dunkin (who, by the way, is Caucasian himself), laughing at the subject.


This win was particular vindication for his promoter Bob Arum, who a few years ago, when he suggested that Pavlik would be an ideal prospect to feature underneath Bernard Hopkins, was basically scoffed at by the HBO brass.

"The topic was what we can do to improve and get people more interested in boxing, a plan," Arum would recall of that meeting at the network's offices. "I kept hitting on Kelly Pavlik, I said, 'This is the kind of kid that the whole country can get behind' and they were laughing. But I wouldn't say I was laughed out of the office; it was greeted with general hysteria."

Arum adds: "Let's be honest about it, white kids from the Midwest are not received as being really serious class-A fighters. They come in very often as road kill, to build up records and nobody takes them seriously. What I was saying is this kid is different and I couldn't convince anybody because he was white and from the Midwest."

[url]http://www.saddoboxing.com/boxing_forum/index.php/topic,4782 4.0.html[/url]Edited by: JD074
 
G

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OK, so whites can't box. But do "hispanics" have a reputation that they can box? Because I can't see why they would. They have to hide behind weight classes in the first place, and they can't get belts, or barely even be contenders, at 175 and up.

And then, even when they're hiding down at 140 pounds or whatever, they just get beat down by black guys anyway. So, how are "hispanic" boxers really any better at boxing than white boxers?
 

Hockaday

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nevada said:
OK, so whites can't box. But do "hispanics" have a reputation that they can box? Because I can't see why they would. They have to hide behind weight classes in the first place, and they can't get belts, or barely even be contenders, at 175 and up.And then, even when they're hiding down at 140 pounds or whatever, they just get beat down by black guys anyway. So, how are "hispanic" boxers really any better at boxing than white boxers?

Whoa, fella. Either you're very young, or you live so far out in the Nevada outback you don't have television or newspapers. Or maybe you just have never really followed boxing.

A short list of very good to great Latino champions off the top of my head: Vicente Saldivar, Ruben Olivares, Carolos Palomino, Roberto Duran, Alexis Arguello, Wilfredo Gomez, Wilfredo Benitez, Edwin Rosario, Carolos Monzon, Victor Galindez, Michael Carbajal, among others. All held championships and defended multiple times. Your statement that black fighters always beat them down is almost troll like in its
egregious ignorance. Latino fighters very often beat the best black fighters when no one else could.

I don't think anyone should post in the boxing forum till they've shown some respect for the sport by following it enough to have a sufficient body of knowledge to work from. You never catch me in the Hockey forum, because I know little about the sport.
You should have at least half a clue, anyway.
 

WHITE NOISE

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May I ad: Arroyo, Sanchez,Chicon, Little Red Lopez. All very good, heroic fighters in the ring.
 

Hockaday

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speedster said:
Danny"Little Red"Lopez was actually part Ute Indian but I always considered him white.

Me too. And man, could punch. He would hit a guy with an average looking shot and the dude would be in la la land.Edited by: Hockaday
 
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