Israel v Muslims

[White Shogun]

I am interested in the members opinions regarding Israel and Muslims. I am open to convincing on this issue.

1) Do you believe that the main reason Muslims are against the West is because the West is seen as pro-Israel?

2) Were Israel allowed to be overrun and wiped out by its Muslim enemies, would this lessen the anti-Western sympathies of the Muslim world? To what degree, if so?

3) Do you think the Muslims are united against Israel because they support the Palestinians as fellow Muslims? Or are Muslims united against Israel because Israelis are Jews? Or both?

4) In case 3) above, do you see this particular viewpoint as rational, or irrational, on the part of the Muslims?

 

[Colonel_Reb]

1. Half of the main reason, they still hate Christians
2. Yes, about half
3. Both; RationalEdited by: Colonel_Reb

 

[guest301]

I think most people know what I think about this and so I won't go there again. I will say this. I don't think the muslims care a lick about the palestinians. They only started to care when they thought they could use the plight of the palestians to put Israel on the defensive militarily and in the court of world public opinion. If they really cared for the plight of the palestianians then they themselves would cede over some land to them. They in effect already have a palestinian country. It's called Jordan, which is 70% palestinian.

 

[Kiwi]

The muslims mission in life is to convert the world to Islam. They will keep on fighting the "infidel", Christian, Jewish or otherwise (although they particularly hate Jews and Christians) until they are dead or converted. Muslims don't really care about the palestinians either. They are just an excuse for the muslim nations to try and drive the people of israel into the sea.

 

[guest301]

Amen KIWI! That is certainly their purpose in life and the 70 virgins they get if they lose their lives in the cause.

 

[Southern Knight]

1. Yes.

2. Yes, to a significant degree. Like most other people, Muslims want to be left alone.

3. Muslims are united against Irsa-hell because they know that Izzy has a fraudulent and baseless claim to its territory. Israel uses American technology and weaponry to murder its enemies with impunity, and with the diplomatic and financial support of the USA.

4. Completely rational. Muslims understand what is going on in the world; Americans and Europeans, for the most part, do not.

Consider this question: If Jews hate/fear Muslims so much, then why do Jews support the open-borders policies that bring so many Muslims into the US and Europe?
Answer: Because Jews hate Christians more than they hate Muslims. Jews want to destroy White societies by flooding them with non-Whites. Period.

If you don't know the history of Jews regarding the introduction of Communism, gay rights, black "civil" rights, and feminism, then you need to be spending your time getting educated on these points.

And I'm not interested in what lurker "guest301" has to say on this issue: no jew is capable of objectivity when jewish interests are in question. Just go report this episode of "hate" to the Mossad, the ADL, and the Southern Poverty Law Center and your other subversive fronts, why dontcha.

 

[SteveB]

I was watching the Discover Times Channel last night and they had a special about women in Saudia Arabia. It was pretty interesting. Based on what I saw, there is a big cultural battle in Saudia Arabia. The young people there are becoming very westernized, speaking perfect English, listening to American music, eating American food, etc. The religious clerics have had control of the people for hundreds of years and now they are threatened of losing their control. To them, the enemy is Western culture, so they feel the need to fight back to maintain their relevance in Arab society. We are now fighting an ideological war as well as a shooting war.

 

[guest301]

Hey Southern Knight, guest301 just "lurking" around here. I just wanted to repeat your ridiculous statement that "no jew is capable of objectivity when jewish interests are concerned". I guess that could be said said about any race when their interests are concerned. Are you objective when you interests are concerned? I give you the benefit of the doubt that maybe you can be.
You also stated that I shoud "report this episode of hate to the ADL, MOSSAD and the Southern Poverty Law Center. First of all, I have no regard for the SPLC. Maybe you can give me the phone# for the Mossad and the ADL. Why would I call them with someone as inconsequential to their daily lives such as yourself.

 

[White_Savage]

The Muslim are backward brutal lunatics who none-the-less would probably not have become a threat to the West had not the West intervened in their region during the last 150 years ago-ESPECIALLY with the Balfour agreement.

Also, the Muslims and no other peoples on Earth could conceivably threaten the West had we not also spent the last 150 years giving them our technology.

Israel, OTOH, is filled with Jews, who are on the surface superior to the Muslims in every way, BUT, their religious dogmas are in no way substantively different or less insane than that of the Muslims, and their much higher level of intelligence and much greater hatred for White Christians makes them a bigger threat in the long run. Freudian pschology, Marxism, Boasian anthropology, various socialistic schemes, racial equalitarianism, gun control-you name it, the inventors and main promoters are mostly Semetic. These things are FAR more dangerous to the long term survival of the West than anything primitive Muslims will ever be able to do to us.

The Middle East and the races who lived on it have given rise to the three greatest fits of insanity ever to hit the human race. Protestant Christianity is tolerable though sometimes damaging to the cause of the West only because it has been in the hands of Caucasians and their sense of reason to be warped to fit our values. But of course, the traitorous "elites" Whites seem to be plagued used economic warfare, actual warfare, torture, and murder to get their peoples to convert to it in the first place. If Jorge Bush turns the entire region into atomically fused glass, especially the un-holy city of Jerusalem, I'll take back every bad thing I ever said about him.

Sept 11. was the worst blow terrorists have struck or will ever be able to strike-an amazing confluence of events where everything went horribly horribly right fofr the terrorists. Since statistically speaking your chances of being killed by a bee sting are greater than your chances being killed by a terrorists, Jorge Bush's Orwellian measures are totally unjustified. They have alot more to do with the hidden agenda of Guess-Whos, who just so happen to hold so much power with the neocons.

The worst threat the Muslims pose to Europe and possibly the U.S. is their immigration, outpopulating native Europeans and bringing the disorder and brutality of their home countrys with them. And remember, it's genetic, not religous or cultural-vast ******* and mestizo populations are just as big a threat to the west, whether they be baptist, islamic, or fire-worshipers.

Ironically, if the immigration and the Jewish promotion of racial equalitarianism destroy the West, the Jews will loose the finest home they ever had. In the West, they were treated better than any alien and openly hostile people has ever been treated, especially in America. If the Muslims take over, it will be curtains for them...but obviously their hatred of Gentiles is so strong they will continue the agenda, whatever the consequences.

So there you have it. The single best way to deal with the Muslim threat to the west is to say if your name is Ahkmed or Abdullah, you have to go back to your dusty hellhole and stay there. But that'll be the LAST thing the Neocons and their ilk impliment, because it's really all gaining totalitarian social controls without inciting rebellion, not stopping "terrorists."

 

[White_Savage]

Guest301 (Who has disgustingly tried to adopt the moniker of an obviously Nordic hero in Tolkeins epic of obviously Nordic values), please stuff it. Anyone who thinks the Muslims really hate us enough to blow themselves up because of Coke and Britney Spears, and not Israel, is smoking something. But whether or not the Muslims would currently be agressive towards the Western world with or without Israel, there is zero logical reason for Westerners to give their money and blood to the cause of Israel. Especially as the Jewish have provably done so much to damage Western culture, a point you conveniently sidestep. Understand this: Western culture doesn't have a Muslim problem, it has a "non-Whites in general" problem. You are literally thousands of times more likely to suffer bodily or property damage from the blacks or mestizos government says you have to live near, work with, employ, and send your kids to school with, than from an Islamic terrorists.

So sorry, you are entirely right when you speak about what savages the Islamic peoples are (remember, largely because of GENETICS, not religion), but because you come from a people and espouse a philosophy even more damaging to the West than Islamic extremis, you don't get to march beside be in the Ay-rab bashing parade.

 

[guest301]

White Savage....three points I need to make here. Your advice for me to "stuff it" was kind of immature and childish on your part don't you think. I guess you are one of the ones on this site who brook no disagreement. I guess because I don't think that jews are evil, think patriotism is passe and think all white women who marry outside of their race are race-traitors makes me unwelcome in your eyes. Too bad. Some of us who chose to be members of this site only did so because of the caste system in sports and to support the white athlete. That's why I am here and plan on staying as long as the powers that be let me.
Secondly, you said you were "disgusted by me taking the nordic name of Aragorn" as my moniker. I took on that moniker because of my admiration of tolkein's character and my scotch-irish background. I always loved your moniker "white savage"..too bad you don't like mine and/or my rights to have it.
Thirdly..I don't want to march with you in any parade and certainly not in front of you in any "arab-bashing parade". History is often written by those who hang the heroes.Fortunately in the very near future..the Almighty One will be writing the history books. Sadly, some of you guys will end up being on the wrong side of history in your attitudes towards Christians and Jews.

 

[White_Savage]

White Savage....three points I need to make here. Your advice for me to "stuff it" was kind of immature and childish on your part don't you think. I guess you are one of the ones on this site who brook no disagreement."

I brook no lies about the world situation or slander towards my people. Saying that the Jews have never done any damage to Western culture or that blacks and mestizos are on average the same as us in terms of social desireability or intelligence is slander and provably a lie.



"I guess because I don't think that jews are evil, think patriotism is passe and think all white women who marry outside of their race are race-traitors makes me unwelcome in your eyes."

All Jews are not evil, but then again, all Muslims are not evil. But both groups damage my race and culture. Like most of life, it's a matter of means and averages.

Bringing up patriotism is a red herring. We are all uber-patriots, or did my rather blood-thirsty attitude to those who threaten my country, race, and culture confuse you? But the root word of nation is natio, for birth, as in people of the same birth. It's the only kind of nation that actually works, and ultimately, the most fundamental loyalty I have is to my kind.

And tell me, why aren't women who marry non-whites race traitors? Taking the women of your rival tribes is a most ancient and still effective insult...why shouldn't I consider it so? White numbers are actually shrinking in the world, we're being outnumbered, and their using their wombs to produce more non-whites? And 90% of the time, White women are marrying blacks or mestizos, most such relationships fail, all the while there are plenty of White males who would take better care of them. Why shouldn't I consider such pairings generally bad? Once again, it's a matter of means and averages.


"Too bad. Some of us who chose to be members of this site only did so because of the caste system in sports and to support the white athlete. That's why I am here and plan on staying as long as the powers that be let me."

Supporting the White athlete? Why single him out? Isn't that the sort of racism you castigate us for? And caste system, isn't that just an absurd conspiracy theory?

Scotch-Irish? I thought you were Jewish...are you my new best argument against race-mixing?

"Fortunately in the very near future..the Almighty One will be writing the history books."

The problem with Muslims (as well as many Jews and some White Christians) is that they follow such and such belief out of ancient texts written by backward nomadic herders instead of using reason. Since your only response seems to be "The book says", I must tentatively consider you just as devoid of reason as the average Islamic.

 

[guest301]

The book that you have such disdain for is the beginning and end of all knowledge, reason, wisdom and insight. It's sad that you don't believe it. There is a difference in between thinking dating outside of your race is generally undesirable and thinking such people are race-traitors. I think it generally can be a bad thing but I don't think it is worthy of race-traitor status. The word traitor is such a loaded term anyway and it's a very very serious offence.
I have also never said that blacks and other races were on the average intelligent as the white man. That is obviously not true if you lok at the average test scores. Whether that's genetic or not I really don't care. I think we are all more or less equally valuable in God's eyes and whatever race he gave different abilities too is his thing.
If my Scotch-Irish-Jew background gives you your "best-arguement against race mixing" then have at it!! ...ps..I have also never said in my previous postings that the muslim hatred of the west had nothing to do with Israel..it clearly does to some extent. I just don't care though why they hate us ..I just want to make them largely powerless to do anything with their hatred.

 

[white tornado]

1) Do you believe that the main reason Muslims are against the West is because the West is seen as pro-Israel?

The reason behind the terrorist attacks I believe is a mix of things although I think our support of Israel is the main reason. Remember we had no real enemies in the Muslim world before we created Israel. Islam's desire for world domination during this time was minimal. Once Israel was created Muslim hate for the west exploded. Our politicians say they hate us because of our freedoms, that bullsh*t. They say that to our dumb public to hide the truth that our support for Israel is the reason. Why do they lie to the American Public, because they are controlled by the Zionist. Even though Israel is the main reason for there hate of the West their belief that we are trying to impose western culture on them with its secularism, feminism, ect cannot be discounted. Now that we invaded Iraq we really pissed them off. Terrorism posses no threat to western culture; it has been used as an excuse for our governments to instigate totaliterist measures( you know who's behind it). What poses a threat to the west is a third world takeover provided by immigration ( you know who's behind it). Islam has always been against the West but before the twentieth century and its massive Muslim immigration into Western countries the last time Muslims posed a threat to West was when the ottomans were driven from Europe. The goal of Islam is to convert the world but due to the West being more technologically advanced and gaining imperial control over the mid east those ambitions were put on hold until today. The reason muslims are a threat to Europe today is massive immigration and a much higher birth rate. For almost a thousand years Islam tried to take Europe by force today they are being given Europe without a fight.

2) Were Israel allowed to be overrun and wiped out by its Muslim enemies, would this lessen the anti-Western sympathies of the Muslim world? To what degree, if so?

After Iraq and Afghanistan NO! If Israel were to be overrun I would have a awesome time watching it on T.V.


3) Do you think the Muslims are united against Israel because they support the Palestinians as fellow Muslims? Or are Muslims united against Israel because Israelis are Jews? Or both?

They could care less about the Palestinians they just don't want to see Jews on muslim land.

4) In case 3) above, do you see this particular viewpoint as rational, or irrational, on the part of the Muslims?

Who cares

 

[Colonel_Reb]

People using rationality and reason have done more damage to this world than people have in the name of Christianity. Just because someone has faith does not mean their argument is intellectually inferior. Reason stands on no high horse and can make no claims that are any more accurate than someone who basis his arguments on faith.

 

[guest301]

Well said, Colonel Reb.

 

[hedgehog]

1) Muslims hate us because we are not muslims and we are prosperous, and they all live in peice of turd countries.

2) Israel will never be over-run by the Muslims. (This whole idea that terrorists are going to be really mad because we fight back is completely false) "terrorism posing no threat to western culture" -pre 911 thinking .

3)Muslims support the Palestinians because they hate jews, The palestinians were kicked out of Jordan because they stirred up so much trouble. The country of Palestine never existed, some Brit made it up.

4)Onward-towards the persian capital!

 

[Bart]

1) Do you believe that the main reason Muslims are against the West is because the West is seen as pro-Israel?

Absolutely, that is a major factor.

2) Were Israel allowed to be overrun and wiped out by its Muslim enemies, would this lessen the anti-Western sympathies of the Muslim world? To what degree, if so?

It would certainly ease tensions and hostility, but to what degree, I really don't know. Some would suggest that
if the Palis gained control once again of their own borders and expunged the land of the interlopers all would be well. It's possible I suppose, but I wouldn't
be too sure. Why? You see, the radical Arabs and Jews do not subscribe to the notion of turning the other cheek, and forgiving and forgetting. They believe in vengeance, getting the pound of flesh and then some more for good measure. If the Muzzies get a major victory it may not mollify their passions but spur them on to greater achievemnts for Allah. Arabs don't have an aversion to blood.

3) Do you think the Muslims are united against Israel because they support the Palestinians as fellow Muslims? Or are Muslims united against Israel because Israelis are Jews? Or both?

Both. They may fight among each other on various issues but unite against a common enemy. Don't forget the religious aspects involved. It goes back thosusands of years.

4) In case 3) above, do you see this particular viewpoint as rational, or irrational, on the part of the Muslims?

I guess it depends on ones perspective. They are banding together against a perceived mutual enemy. Aren't White Nationalists doing the same?

Because of the religious component, it is a very real possibillity that both sides will fight until one is vanquished. Unfortunately the rest of the world may go up in flames before this happens.

 

[JD074]

Some of us who chose to be members of this site only did so because of the caste system in sports and to support the white athlete.

Then why get involved in political discussions? Sites like this will always generate more interest among far right wingers than moderates such as yourself. That's just the way it is, and as long as you're pro-Israel, and more or less liberal about issues like miscegenation, you'll always be in the minority. I hope you don't mind.

Sadly, some of you guys will end up being on the wrong side of history in your attitudes towards Christians and Jews.

I've been open-minded about Christianity as of late, but crap like that makes me think twice about that attitude.

The book that you have such disdain for is the beginning and end of all knowledge, reason, wisdom and insight.

That, too.

There is a difference in between thinking dating outside of your race is generally undesirable and thinking such people are race-traitors. I think it generally can be a bad thing but I don't think it is worthy of race-traitor status. The word traitor is such a loaded term anyway and it's a very very serious offence.

Then don't use that term. Look at what the liberals have done to you: you think that the behavior "generally can be a bad thing" but you loathe the word that is used to describe it. "Loaded terms"- that's exactly what they're all about.

The bottom line about miscegenation is that our race is shrinking. The major challenge that we face this century is the combination of low birth rates and massive non-white immigration. Any white person who breeds with non-whites is contributing to the decline of our race. So call it whatever you want, but it's a very serious issue.

I just don't care though why they hate us

There you go.

..I just want to make them largely powerless to do anything with their hatred.

And again. That's exactly what Bush wants to do, on behalf of Israel. Internationalists like Bush don't believe in national sovereignty. They want to dominate and bully any nation that gets in their way. That's obviously what they've done to Iraq, and what they want to do with Iran. The antidote to this insanity is the armed neutrality that Don wrote about. But that ain't happening with this Zionist lapdog in the Oval Office.

Edited by: JD074

 

[Don Wassall]

Before the founding of Israel, America had no enemies in the Middle East and was widely admired among the Arab people. As Bart mentioned, the government of Saudi Arabia has been as good a friend as Washington, D.C. has ever had. They've kept the price of oil down whenever Washington asked, and increased their output when asked. They've saved our oil-addicted butt on many an occasion, but Washington turns on all its allies sooner or later.

Washington (in conjuntion with the media) had to work very, very hard to turn the Arabs and Muslims against us. Allowing us to be led by the nose by the Zionist Lobby and inserting ourselves (in a very one-sided way) in a dispute that is none of our business is going to lead to the destruction of this country. I hope I'm wrong but all you have to do is look at history. Every single empire of the past has met the same fate. And all had the same arrogance and hubris as ours, that we'll somehow be different than all the others.

 

[robcat]

The government and media produce a Hitler of the Month to be feared and most Americans fall for it every time. The people are finally realizing that the Iraq war was planned years before 9/11 and was based on lies but almost the exact same lies are now being said about Iran and its leader as were said about Iraq and Saddam and the same people who fell for it before are falling for it again. They havent learned a thing. The government and big business need to always claim to be fighting a fearsome demonic enemy in order to keep the permanent welfare-warfare state in place and the people fearful and clamoring for safety. Americans never seem to wise up. The white middle class will worship the federal government right up to the time its last member becomes extinct.

 

[guest301]

JDO74..That's the first time in my life anybody has called me a "moderate". I guess compared to you and a few others on this site, that's true. If you only knew how many times I have been called right wing by others, marched and protested in front of abortion clinics and given my money to conservative causes, you might think differently. The world is too complicated now and it's hard to pigeonhole anybody these days and say what you are. Liberals, centrists, moderates, conservatives, right-wingers, nationalists, neo-cons, anarchists...whatever!

 

[JD074]

You're right. It's relative. Many would call Bush conservative, but he's downright liberal by my standards. You may think of yourself as "conservative" for the same reasons that people consider Bush to be conservative: Evangelical, pro-life, pro-Israel, pro-Iraq War, etc. You all are neocons; you pick and choose when you want to be conservative and when you want to be liberal. I agree with the pro-life part, but very little of what Bush has done the last six years has been what I would consider to be truly "conservative." Have you heard about his proposed $2.7 or 2.8 trillion budget for 2007? That's not conservative. Why the hell are you people so forgiving of this guy? It's unreal.

Conservatism is dead. Conservatives/ neocons/ Republicans are not pro-white. They're useless to us.

Actually, it's pretty easy to "pigeonhole" people... they're all against us!

By the way, what do you think about Robcat's post? I thought it was brilliant.

 

[guest301]

I don't really consider myself a full- fledged neo-con(that's a perjorative word in my book) and although I am a Bush supporter, that doesn't mean I am pleased as punch with his domestic policies. I love the tax-cuts but if it was up to me we would all be paying a flat tax on a postcard with no need for the unconstitutional IRS. I also would get rid of all the departments which we don't need. Education, Agriculture, HUD, Energy,EPA,ATF, etc...would all be gone if I was in charge. I would return more power to the states and practice fair trade and not Free trade. So I am not as out to lunch as you might think. I also would close down our borders and engage in more racial profiling because we know who our enemies are domestically and internationally.
As far as your question about "what Robcat thinks"... I agree that the federal goverment gets to much respect and is generally out for it's own interests as oppossed to the interests of the people, I don't agree with anything else he said..but I may have alot to learn.

 

[White_Savage]

People using rationality and reason have done more damage to this world than people have in the name of Christianity. Just because someone has faith does not mean their argument is intellectually inferior. Reason stands on no high horse and can make no claims that are any more accurate than someone who basis his arguments on faith.

Reb:
This is bullsh*t, and the worst part is, you KNOW it's bullsh*t since White Protestant Christians, mostly at least ATTEMPT to use reason to prove the truth of Christianity and your values (Which makes you quite a few notches above other, chiefly non-white, religionists.) I respect a scientific argument when I actually hear one...for instance, the very low chance of life arising spontaneosly by itself indicates there might be some sort of divine creator, though the idea that he picked out one particular tribe of scabrous nomads as his favorites or ever authorized the barbarisms of the Old Testament is laughable. (Well, if you're like me and refuse to believe God is a both a monster and rather dim-witted)

I can give you rather exact statistics on the improbability of a self-replicating carbon-based molecule arising by itself...could you, with your contempt for science make such an effective argument against hard atheism, could you even follow the argument if I made it to you? I must frankly doubt it.

I imagine, in fact, you use reason and rationality in making virtually every choice of your daily life. Guest301 proposes that we reject using our rational minds in regards to such vital choices as our policy towards the Jews (because they are "God's Chosen), the state of Israel (ditto) and other races ("All are valuable to God").

And btw, just where are these cases where reason and rationality have done such damage to mankind, what are you going to throw at me? Let me guess...there will probably be Communism and liberalism, which are in fact all based on profoundly un-reasonable and counter-scientific premises, such as my favorite, racial equality-in fact these things are faiths, albeit faiths in things far more horrendous and unbelievable than any God. Or are you going to throw the Nazis and the Holo-hoax at me, who despite their totalitarian shortcomings, where almost entirely scientifically right in their racial arguments? Really, I just can't wait.