Bitter Pele

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Porthos

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Yet another episode in the Pele-Maradona saga, this time Maradona called Pele outright "stupid" for stating that Neymar is better than Messi:
http://www.espn.co.uk/football/sport/story/145861.html
Excerpts:
Argentina legend Diego Maradona has called Brazilian counterpart Pele "stupid" for suggesting that Barcelona star Lionel Messi is not as good as Santos starlet Neymar... "My God, that is just stupid," Maradona said as he backed fellow Argentinian Messi."Maybe Neymar is the best player in the world, but only if you say that Messi is from a different planet," Maradona said.


Now I remembered something - does anybody remember that dumb movie the Hollywood-Juden made with Pele, Sylvester Stallone, Michael Caine and Max von Sydow where they are a bunch of American/British POWs playing football/soccer against a team of evil blue-eyed heel-clicking Nazi supermen, while the French resistance is frantically digging a tunnel under their locker room to make them escape? Then Pele scores the winning goal with the inevitable bicycle kick, and they run away, while the nazis are running around like headless chicken? It must be one of the dumbest movies I've ever seen. It tells it all on how he was/is venerated by the Jewish media... The movie was called "Escape to victory" or something similar. The idiocy and moral obtuseness of this movie reach stratospheric levels. Think Hogan Heroes with cleats...
Wait - I found a clip - I bet they counted this movie goal in Pele's scoring total.
[video=youtube;mCJBXfKtOiM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCJBXfKtOiM[/video]
 
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DixieDestroyer

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Rebajlo, LOL...I recall that mid/late 70's "fantasy" fight type of dialog. They could've picked who ever they wanted between Clay & Lee...Andre would stomped 'em both back then. :grin:

Muhammad-Ali-and-Andre-The-Giant.jpg


andre-the-giant-ali.jpg
 
frederic38

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i never saw that movie
i think there are other kown players in the film, white players, if i remember well
but ofcourse only pele could score the more important goal :icon_rolleyes:

i checked the list of his goals, and the last goal he scored was in 1990 :undecided:
 
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Most of the White players (especially the German ones) were real players from Ipswich Town. There are also others - Osvaldo Ardilles, Bobby Moore, Kazimierz Deyna (Rebajlo's will love this) and some other dudes.
The plot is beyond ridiculous. A bunch of allied prisoners of war take on the German national team, no less. And this already gives you an idea where the movie is going... It gets worse when the match is held in nazi occupied Pairs in a stadium with both allied and German supporters. During the match (I'm not kidding) the French resistance is digging a tunnel under the locker room. Even more ridiculous, but no matter... At half time, our Hogan's Heroes could excape as the tunnel is ready, but wait - they decide to go back and play the second half to teach the Germans a lesson... Then you have the actors that don't know how to play football and the footbalers who don't know how to act, it's a mess... Even if it's from the Hollywood-Juden (who consider their audience to be complete idiots, with good reason), it's too much.
 
frederic38

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i just noticed that there are new answers posted on rebajlo's article about the pele myth: http://www.castefootball.us/archives/exploding-the-myth-of-pele/

there is a very argumentated answer and he brings something that wasn't addressed here, the fact that pele beat the top european clubs in friendly matches in europe with santos (this ofcourse is not important because a friendly club match is nothing) but also during intercontinental matches, for the intercontinental cup:

This statement assumes that European clubs were stronger than their South American counterparts, but when if one looks at the results of the Intercontinental cup during the Pelé era (1960 to 1973) the South Americans won 8 of these tournaments to the supposedly superior Europeans 6!
Its Interesting that you fail to mention these competitive victories by the South Americans, especially as Pelé’s club Santos won twice in 1962 & 1963. Now in 1962 against Benfica, Pelé, who Wabbit would have us believe couldn’t hack it against top European clubs scored five times in an 8-4 aggregate win.
A year later he scored twice as they beat AC Milan.
Don’t assume that these games were light-hearted ‘Harlem Globetrotters’ style entertainment either – they were hard fought matches with the clash between Manchester United & Estudiantes notorious for its violence. Also take into account the extensive tours that Santos played in and the number of goals he racked up against top European sides. Incidentally, Pelé was never transferred to European side because his own federation considered him too important to be sold abroad and at the time Brazilian clubs were able to match the kind of wages the European clubs like Real Madrid were offering.
Click to expand...

an important thing that he doesn't seems to know is that the south american champions league was created by the south american part of FIFA to name the best south american club, only to organise a world cup for clubs (in which europeans have no interest because they know that european clubs are the bests and champions league has always been the biggest competition) which explains why these intercontinental matches always were much more important to south americans

here is my answer:
eebroo, i saw that you mentionned the intercontinental matches, and you said that they weren’t friendlies
but you need to realise the difference between south america and europe
in south america they consider intercontinental matches to be like a world cup
they compare the clubs, and they say for example “this brazilian club is better than this one, because he is X times world champâ€
the europeans just don’t care, they know that european football is where it’s at
pele didn’t went to europe
why?
because, as you said, his country didn’t let him go, otherwise he would have gone there, because in europe there are the best clubs
european stars never thought about going to south american clubs, because they just don’t care as they are the bests clubs
you mention that some of these intercontinental matches were violent, yes, they were too violent for the europeans because at one point they stopped playing these matches
that’s because for the europeans these matches were friendlies, and they didn’t want to be hurt in friendly matches
what you have to realise is that the south american champions league, known as the “copa libertadoresâ€, was created for one and only one reason: to know which was the best south american club, the club that would play against the winner of the european champions league in the “mundialito de clubes†that FIFA was trying to create
a quote from wikipedia suporting this: “Europa ya tenía como designar a su campeón, ya que se disputaba la Copa de Campeones de Europa, pero América del Sur no tenía un sistema comparable. Es por eso que la Conmebol creó una competición similar, y la llamó Copa Libertadores de América.â€
that’s a HUGE difference there, and may it help you understand why for south americans these intercontinental matches mean a lot, while in europe nobody cares about it
Click to expand...
 
frederic38

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pele did it again:

"Maradona was a great player but he only had a left foot and wasn't a renowned header of the ball," said Pele. "Messi is almost a copy of him. That's why I think Neymar has the capacity to be better."
Click to expand...

http://www.givemefootball.com/european-news/pele-neymar-can-be-better-than-lionel-messi

i'm pretty sure that neymar will never be a good header either
messi still scored that goal against manchester when he jumped higher than ferdinand in the champions league final

and i read that there will be a movie about pele's life, from his youth to the 1958 world cup in sweden
i can't wait to see pele seducing some swedish girls between his matches at the 1958 world cup :mad2:

the movie should be ready for the 2014 world cup

now i officially will root for a maracanazo in 2014

2012-08-21-pele-neymar.jpg
 
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Given that Brazil hosts both the next World Cup and the next Olympics just think of the Pele propaganda that is ahead of us in the next few years. It might even rival the Cassius Clay worshipping we've already been subjected to.
 
Rebajlo

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Matra2 said:
Given that Brazil hosts both the next World Cup and the next Olympics just think of the Pele propaganda that is ahead of us in the next few years. It might even rival the Cassius Clay worshipping we've already been subjected to.
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I shudder to even contemplate the inevitably Pele-drenched 2014 World Cup. It shall be a pantomime in which Brazil will receive every possible assistance from officials in order to achieve a "fairytale, record-breaking" win on home soil.

I'd love to see a 100% White European team win the trophy but - failing that - it would be pure poetry if Argentina did the business, with Lionel Messi scoring a hat-trick in the final (including a Maradona-like "Goal of the Century") to finish with both the Golden Ball and Golden Boot awards.

Pele would most likely piss and crap himself simultaneously before collapsing in a shivering heap to suck his thumb in a foetal position. Mind You, once the black ponce was revived and cleaned up he'd proceed to tell everyone that Messi still has to score a lot more goals and win several additional World Cups to even begin to approach Pele's "level"...
 
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Matra2

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I see Pele has also claimed the Brazil of 1970 was better than today's Spanish team.

"Each generation has its preferences but without doubt, if we are comparing, the 1970 generation was better," Pele said."The 1970 Brazil team had many more (great) individual players than Spain, which has two or three excellent players," said Pele who was part of the squad that trounced Italy 4-1 in the 1970 World Cup final.
Pele however had high praise for the free-flowing, attacking football style that enabled Spain to trounce Italy 4-0
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http://www.thescore.com/home/articles/299209-1970-brazil-better-than-spain-pele

I liked the below article from a Turkish source that's not in grammatical English: "Shut up Pele"

http://www.nationalturk.com/en/shut...football-hero-like-you-and-neymar-video-24728
 
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frederic38

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Europe said:
Did Rebajlo or Frederic38 write that? It said the Brazilian league was weak in Pele's time.
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ahah, the turkish article? i'm pretty sure that it's not rebajlo, it doesn't look like him very much :smile:
the brazilian league was probably weak, especially the defences, but the regional league (sao paulo league) in which pele played was even weaker than the brazilian league

i counted his goal scoring ratios (just from before 1970 because the idiots at bigsoccer were mad that someone could include stats of pele when he was "no longer at his prime" )
in national scale competitions he had a goalscoring ratio of 0.8 goals per match before 1970
and in the regional league 1.3

0.8 goals per match in a national league at that time is not that impressive

this past year, messi had a goal scoring ration of 1.38 goals per match in his national league (one of the best leagues in the world)
and 1.27 in champions league
cristiano ronaldo has similar ratios

by the way many french players from 1958 said that the 1958 brazilian team was better than the 1970 team
so a team whithout pele was better than the 1970 team with pele (because pele was too young in 1958, althought he played in the last matches and scored against a french team down to 10 men and against sweden, hardly the best team in the world at that time)

a quote from piantoni (french player from the 1958 world cup) that the guy commenting on rebajlo's article translated for me:
“Brazil introduced Pelé.
Did you immediately see in him the great player who would make history?

Not at that time. There were players in the Brazil team called Vava, Garrincha, Didi, Djalma Santos, Bellini."
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Rebajlo

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Matra2 said:
Ha! They even did a commercial together because everyone was sure he'd be the "American Pele".

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LopRlGJ_fek
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Well, at least Adu has "played" in Europe :icon_wink:, showing his "skills" off to advantage at massive clubs like Belenenses and Aris. He's even played in the Turkish second division with the juggernaut that is Caykur Rizespor... :icon_lol:
 
frederic38

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few people have seen both messi and pele play in their own leagues (not on video)
on a radio show, i heard a french journalist say that he saw pele play for santos because he spent a lot of time there
he said that messi is currently 10 times better, pele wasn't as decisive as messi is, in every match
the name of the journalist is charles bietry

Did you know Pakistan had its own Pele?:icon_rolleyes:
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in france we are always ahead when it comes to everything non-white, so we had our own pelé before brazil, pele actually took his nickname from a "french" player

"Pele took the name of the "Black Pearl" after he made a famous statement about Larbi: "If I am the King of Soccer, then Larbi Ben Barek is the God of it"."

Alfredo Di Stefano thinks Pele was better than Messi and Ronaldo:
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he's not going to say that a barcelona player is the best player of all times since he's involved in real madrid :icon_wink:
cristiano ronaldo is playing for real madrid so he's not going to say that messi is the best in history ( so better than ronaldo)
it's better to pick a player from the past, so he won't have any problems for that
for example, sergio ramos said that del bosque was the best coach in the world, so it created a controversy with mourinho (his coach at real madrid)
so if he's smart, the next time one will ask him who's the best between mourinho and del bosque, ramos will say that they are both very different, and that a random coach from the past was the best in history

here's the original interview:

"¿Quién es el mejor del mundo, Messi o Ronaldo?
“Ninguno, Pelé era lo mejor. Ellos, grandes jugadores con características especiales”."

http://www.elcolombiano.com/BancoCo...no/pele_es_el_mejor_del_futbol_di_stefano.asp

so he was asked "who is the best in the world, messi or ronaldo?"
obviously he can't pick one of them, so he said pelé was better (while nobody asked him who was the best in history)
 
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frederic38

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more talk about messi and pele, because messi scored more goals during a year than pele
i can't wait to hear pele's reaction
 
Bk21

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There no single doubt that the title of best player ever is torn between Messi and Maradonna. No serious consultant and football specialist will put Pele in the equation. Pele is considered as a great player who initiated the modern football player in the way he managed his career (transfer and image) and his trophies; but when talking raw football skills, Messi and Maradonna are ahead.
 
frederic38

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a few weeks ago i was "debating" with a pele fan and he was saying how pele was named second best player of the 1958 world cup at 17 years old
that sounded strange to me because i knew about the french players who faced brazil in 1958 and none of them was impressed by pele, who was too young

so after a little search i found out that the best player of the 1958 tournament was the french raymond kopa, and there was no mention of a 2nd best player of the tournament

i found out that FIFA created the "golden ball" and "silver ball" (2nd best player of the world cup) awards in 1982, and they gave those awards for all the past world cups retrospectively

this explains why in 1982 pele was named 2nd best player of the 1958 tournament (because the pele myth had already been created by the FIFA and media) while in 1958 he was relatively unnoticed

more lies from the FIFA

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FIFA_World_Cup_awards#Golden_Ball

here you can see that on their fake award in 1958 (which was actually awarded in 1982) raymond kopa is not even in the top 3 while he was considered the best player in 1958 (and he won the golden ball, the real golden ball, the one awarded by "france football")
 
frederic38

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ThePhilosopher said:
Great Work^^,Frederic.
Wondering how many more scams like these exist.
Click to expand...

his 1970 world cup was inflated too
so his first one was a scam (1958) the next 2 ones he was injuried, and the last one (1970) was inflated too

here's a magazine from juste after the 1970 world cup:


phototag.php


it was the best magazine about soccer, probably the best in the world

immediatly after the world cup, they questionned pelé's influence in brazil's victory
as the title says, they "do not agree" about what was said at the time about pelé, and they say that pelé was not the "king" but he was a regular player in that brazilian team

since the magazine "france football" are the ones who awarded the "ballon d'or" back then, the saying that "pelé would have won many "ballon d'or" awards had he been european" (the award was only open to europeans back then) is proven wrong
 
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