America's Game, 66-67 Packers

[sport historian]

Because of the Packer-Steeler Super Bowl, the NFL Network is showing programs on the two teams. On Monday morning, the America's Game episodes on the 1966 and 1967 Green Bay Packers are on at 7am ET and 8am ET respectively. Later in the day, episodes on the Steelers will be shown.

 

[sport historian]

Tonight (Saturday), the NFL Network is showing the 1967 Packers episode at 9pm ET. The 1982 Redskins precedes it at 8pm ET, with the 1978 Steelers at 10pm ET. They will be repeated twice.

 

[bigunreal]

The '67 Packers show was interesting, and I found out something I didn't know. Chuck Mercein was another example, imho, of an early day white RB who was never given a proper chance to shine.

In the Ice Bowl game, Mercein really stood out, especially on the game winning drive. It was illuminating to watch him on this program, describe how even a Vince Lombardi could inexpicably screw over a white player. For unknown reasons, Lombardi told Mercein he was starting black journeyman Ben Wilson over him right before game time.

Mercein still felt the slight, all those years later, as he recounted how he had a bunch of family members in the stands expecting to see him star, and he only touched the ball a few times. I can't fathom a black RB having the kind of game Mercein had against Dallas, and then being snubbed for a white nonentity in the Super Bowl.

I remember liking Mercein a lot as a little kid, and was surprised to see he'd perhaps been a very early victim of the Caste System.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

Good post, bigunreal. I'm watching the show on youtube right now. Interesting angle on Mercein.

 

[Don Wassall]

I watched a lot of it the other night. Even for that era the Packers seemed to be one of the Whitest teams in the league.

Vince Lombardi was a social conservative; in his last years he began speaking out against the moral degeneration taking place in the country. Who knows how his life would have gone if he hadn't died at the age of 57 from cancer. Would he have been a leading spokesman on behalf of the Silent Majority as it was called at the time, or would he have capitulated to the homosexual, feminist, deviant Cultural Marxist swine that took over the popular culture beginning in the late 1960s, as everyone else eventually did?

 

[sport historian]

The '67 Packers show was interesting, and I found out something I didn't know. Chuck Mercein was another example, imho, of an early day white RB who was never given a proper chance to shine.

In the Ice Bowl game, Mercein really stood out, especially on the game winning drive. It was illuminating to watch him on this program, describe how even a Vince Lombardi could inexpicably screw over a white player. For unknown reasons, Lombardi told Mercein he was starting black journeyman Ben Wilson over him right before game time.

Mercein still felt the slight, all those years later, as he recounted how he had a bunch of family members in the stands expecting to see him star, and he only touched the ball a few times. I can't fathom a black RB having the kind of game Mercein had against Dallas, and then being snubbed for a white nonentity in the Super Bowl.

I remember liking Mercein a lot as a little kid, and was surprised to see he'd perhaps been a very early victim of the Caste System.

Totally false. As the program shows, Mercein had plenty of chances. He made the Giants team in 1965 along with several other white running backs, Tucker Fredrickson, Steve Thurlow, Ted Koy, and Mercein. They were called the "Baby Bulls."

Mercein was playing a lot in 1966 before being injured. He was cut (Fredrickson was back from a knee injury) at the end of training camp in 1967 and was in semi-pro when Lombardi called him. Mercein also had an offer from the Redskins. Naturally he chose to go to Green Bay.

If Lombardi wanted to screw over a white player, please explain why he started Mercein and Donny Anderson in the Ice Bowl over Ben Wilson and Travis Williams, who had a big day in the playoff win over the Rams.

In Jerry Kramer's book, "Instant Replay," he indicates some Packers thought Travis Williams should start over Donny Anderson but Lombardi felt "he owed it to Anderson."

Does this sound like a coach who "wants to "screw over white players?"

Lombardi did not start Ben Wilson in Super Bowl II for "unknown reasons." In the program, Mercein tells how Lombardi told him before the game that he was starting Wilson because it was his kind of weather (Wilson was from USC) and he was rested.

Lombardi was playing a hunch, just as he played a hunch by starting Mercein in the Ice Bowl. Wilson did have a fairly good day. He led both teams in rushing.

Did you pay attention to the program?

 

[sport historian]

I watched a lot of it the other night. Even for that era the Packers seemed to be one of the Whitest teams in the league.

Vince Lombardi was a social conservative; in his last years he began speaking out against the moral degeneration taking place in the country. Who knows how his life would have gone if he hadn't died at the age of 57 from cancer. Would he have been a leading spokesman on behalf of the Silent Majority as it was called at the time, or would he have capitulated to the homosexual, feminist, deviant Cultural Marxist swine that took over the popular culture beginning in the late 1960s, as everyone else eventually did?

Yes, the Packers were "Whiter" than most teams. Even by 1966, Lombardi payed big money for two white running backs (Anderson and Grabowski) to replace Hornung and Taylor.

Vince Lombardi was a Roman Catholic and I can't tell you how happy Catholics were to see JFK run for and win the Presidency in 1960. Lombardi endorsed JFK during the Wisconsin primary and was told by the new president to call him if he needed anything.

During the 1961 Berlin crisis, Paul Hornung was called up by his reserve unit. He was able to play most of the season (he was 1961 NFL MVP), but was on military duty at the time of the NFL Title game. Lombardi called President Kennedy and asked if Hornung could be excused from duty to play. JFK issued orders allowing Hornung to play for the Packers. He had a big day and was MVP of the 1961 NFL Championship game, winning a new car.


You have to remember that many people who were for JFK and even RFK were somewhat socially conservative. Lombardi was one of these.


In 1968, Richard Nixon even considered Vince Lombardi as his running mate until his aides told him Lombardi was a Kennedy Democrat.

I once saw Lombardi's main biographer, David Maraniss, interviewed by Robert Novak on Paul Weyrich's network. Maraniss said that Lombardi was growing more conservative in the last year of his life, even being friendly with Nixon.

I recall a newspaper article about a Lombardi speech in the spring of 1970. He sounded like Spiro Agnew.

Maraniss felt that if he had lived, Lombardi might have been supporting Ronald Reagan in 1980.

Quite a few Democrats who supported JFK in 1960, made that move in 1980.

 

[bigunreal]

Yes, I did watch the show. I first saw it, in fact, months ago when it was initially aired. You could still sense the disappointment in Mercein's voice. I don't blame him.

Mercein was playing extremely well in '66 before being injured. Cutting him at the end of training camp in '67 wasn't justified, and the fact no team picked him up on waivers shows that there was a budding Caste System even then.

Travis Williams was never a true RB. He shone as a kick returner (although that was primarily in one spectacular season). Anderson and Grabowski were college stars, and true every down backs. Wilson shouldn't have seen time at the expense of any of them, including Mercein.

I used to worship Lombardi, and still enjoy watching old clips of him and his teams. However, while his offense was nearly all white (only black starter TE Fleming), his defense had more black starters (6) than white, which was a real rarity then. Even in the early '70s, the Dolphins still only had one black starter on defense, by contrast.

I believe that Travis Williams and Lionel Aldridge both had "character" issues when Lombardi signed them. Later, I think Dave Hampton had them, too. I wish I were wrong, but I have a hunch that he was trending towards the "new" look in the NFL at the end of his career. He had nothing but black RBs in his season at Washington (his training camp was so grueling that Bob Brunet quit the team).

I think most unbiased observers will watch that program and come away from the Mercein comments feeling the same way I do.

 

[sport historian]

Yes, I did watch the show. I first saw it, in fact, months ago when it was initially aired. You could still sense the disappointment in Mercein's voice. I don't blame him.

Mercein was playing extremely well in '66 before being injured. Cutting him at the end of training camp in '67 wasn't justified, and the fact no team picked him up on waivers shows that there was a budding Caste System even then.

Travis Williams was never a true RB. He shone as a kick returner (although that was primarily in one spectacular season). Anderson and Grabowski were college stars, and true every down backs. Wilson shouldn't have seen time at the expense of any of them, including Mercein.

I used to worship Lombardi, and still enjoy watching old clips of him and his teams. However, while his offense was nearly all white (only black starter TE Fleming), his defense had more black starters (6) than white, which was a real rarity then. Even in the early '70s, the Dolphins still only had one black starter on defense, by contrast.

I believe that Travis Williams and Lionel Aldridge both had "character" issues when Lombardi signed them. Later, I think Dave Hampton had them, too. I wish I were wrong, but I have a hunch that he was trending towards the "new" look in the NFL at the end of his career. He had nothing but black RBs in his season at Washington (his training camp was so grueling that Bob Brunet quit the team).

I think most unbiased observers will watch that program and come away from the Mercein comments feeling the same way I do.

"His training camp was so grueling that Bob Brunet quit the team."

Do you think Lombardi's championship teams in Green Bay didn't have grueling training camps? Did a tough training camp not have anything to do with the Redskins having a winning season in 1969 for the first time since 1955?

 

[bigunreal]

I think you missed my point about Brunet, SH. I wasn't disparaging Lombardi's training style. I mentioned it in conjunction with the lack of white skill position players on offense under Lombardi during his single season with the Redskins.

 

[sport historian]

I think you missed my point about Brunet, SH. I wasn't disparaging Lombardi's training style. I mentioned it in conjunction with the lack of white skill position players on offense under Lombardi during his single season with the Redskins.

And just what is your point about Bob Brunet? He came back in 1970 and played through the George Allen era to 1977. Brunet was a good special teamer but no more.

Lombardi didn't inherit any good running backs from Otto Graham's 1968 team. Graham drafted Larry Brown in the 1969 draft before being fired.

Lombardi made Brown the starting halfback and picked up Charley Harraway from Cleveland (don't recall if he was cut or traded) to play fullback. They started for 5 years and made a Super Bowl in 1972 under George Allen. Brown led the NFL in rushing in 1970 and the NFC in 1972.

Where was Lombardi supposed to find starting level white RBs in 1969? He didn't inherit any from Graham. Was San Diego going to give him Dickie Post?

Speaking of white skill position players, Jerry Smith caught 54 passes for Washington in 1969.

 

[bigunreal]

My point was that the only white RB on the Redskins, Bob Brunet, left Lombardi's camp. This point was made in the context that Lombardi wasn't naturally enamored with white skill position players. As you noted, he drafted Brown and signed Harraway.

I think Lombardi was the greatest coach in NFL history. I only wanted to point out that his white offense in Green Bay was not due to his consciously favoring white skill position players.

I was a huge fan of Bob Brunet. Every preseason, he would be given a heavy workload at RB, and would show a great deal of potential. Come regular season, George Allen would run the smallish Larry Brown into the ground (thereby shortening his career), and refused to let Brunet get even a handful of carries.

I think Brunet should have been given a chance to show what he could do. Even in those days, no team in the NFL was interested in making him their running back.

 

[sport historian]

My point was that the only white RB on the Redskins, Bob Brunet, left Lombardi's camp. This point was made in the context that Lombardi wasn't naturally enamored with white skill position players. As you noted, he drafted Brown and signed Harraway.

I think Lombardi was the greatest coach in NFL history. I only wanted to point out that his white offense in Green Bay was not due to his consciously favoring white skill position players.

I was a huge fan of Bob Brunet. Every preseason, he would be given a heavy workload at RB, and would show a great deal of potential. Come regular season, George Allen would run the smallish Larry Brown into the ground (thereby shortening his career), and refused to let Brunet get even a handful of carries.

I think Brunet should have been given a chance to show what he could do. Even in those days, no team in the NFL was interested in making him their running back.

Brunet left camp? Did Lombardi threaten him with a gun?

Lombardi wasn't "naturally enamored with white skill position players?" In 1959 he made Hornung and Taylor his RBs and let Timmy Brown (who made several Pro Bowls) go to the Eagles.

As I previously wrote, Otto Graham drafted Larry Brown, not Lombardi, who was still the Packer GM at the time of the 1969 draft.

Jerry Smith caught more passes for Lombardi in 1969 than he had in 1968. Lombardi dealt for a white WR, Bob Long, who was a former Packer. Long caught 48 passes for Washington in 1969.