2014 Hall of fame results!

white is right

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The three who made the hall were predictable, even though I feel Thomas is a rather weak first ballot candidate. I was mildly disappointed with Jack Morris falling short and even regressing on his final vote by the writers. It looks like his fate is in the hands of the veterans committee, Jack Morris the X might be representing the late Jack Morris as the veterans committee has been reshaped to be tougher than it was in the past. Here are the results.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baseball_Hall_of_Fame_balloting,_2014
 

NDfootball06

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The three who made the hall were predictable, even though I feel Thomas is a rather weak first ballot candidate. I was mildly disappointed with Jack Morris falling short and even regressing on his final vote by the writers. It looks like his fate is in the hands of the veterans committee, Jack Morris the X might be representing the late Jack Morris as the veterans committee has been reshaped to be tougher than it was in the past. Here are the results.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baseball_Hall_of_Fame_balloting,_2014

If Mike Piazza doesn't get into the hall of fame it's a travesty. He's never failed a drug test, how can you not vote for him out of pure speculation?

Personally, I have no problem with Thomas being a first ballot hall of famer. His numbers speak for themselves. 500+ HRs, .300 BA, 20th all time in OBP.
 

Carolina Speed

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If Mike Piazza doesn't get into the hall of fame it's a travesty. He's never failed a drug test, how can you not vote for him out of pure speculation?

Personally, I have no problem with Thomas being a first ballot hall of famer. His numbers speak for themselves. 500+ HRs, .300 BA, 20th all time in OBP.


When I look to see who's worthy of the Baseball Hall of Fame, not that anyone cares what I think, but I look no further than the first five members elected; Ty Cobb, Babe Ruth, Christy Mathewson, Honus Wagner, and Walter Johnson.

How do they stack up against these members?

Does Frank Thomas deserve to get in? Maybe. It's hard to ignore 500+ HR's and a career.301 BA, however, if you compare all the numbers of Thomas to a Cobb, Ruth, or Wagner, I don't know.

From giving trophies for participation, everybody wins, to rewarding very good players, it seems today's level of greatness has diminished.

To me, it's the "Hall of Greatness," not the hall of the very good.

Frank Thomas was very good, but was he "Great?"
 

Don Wassall

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In fairness, the first five selected covered a period of over 40 years of baseball and were the cream of the cream.

I watched a discussion show on the MLB Network the other night before the results were announced. It was moderated by Bob Costas, who is insufferable when it comes to politics and general pomposity, but he's always been pretty good when it comes to baseball. At any rate, after hearing the panelists discuss the pros and cons of various players, I don't have a major problem with Frank Thomas getting in as his stats are very impressive. From everything I've read about him though, he personified the me-first, totally selfish approach among athletes that has evolved over the past 45 years, partly from glorifying some of the negative aspects of black behavior and partly because of the ever more mercenary nature of pro sports, including the ridiculous amounts of money the players make.

Biggio fell just two votes short in his second try and should get in next year. But what's quite interesting about the vote totals is that outside of Biggio and Piazza, the vote total of every single holdover dropped from last year to this year. That's great in the case of Barry Bonds, Lee Smith, Sammy Sosa and others, but alarming when it comes to Jeff Bagwell, whose natural progression should have been to increase from last year's nearly 60% in his first year of eligibility but instead fell to 54.3% this year.
 

white is right

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In fairness, the first five selected covered a period of over 40 years of baseball and were the cream of the cream.

I watched a discussion show on the MLB Network the other night before the results were announced. It was moderated by Bob Costas, who is insufferable when it comes to politics and general pomposity, but he's always been pretty good when it comes to baseball. At any rate, after hearing the panelists discuss the pros and cons of various players, I don't have a major problem with Frank Thomas getting in as his stats are very impressive. From everything I've read about him though, he personified the me-first, totally selfish approach among athletes that has evolved over the past 45 years, partly from glorifying some of the negative aspects of black behavior and partly because of the ever more mercenary nature of pro sports, including the ridiculous amounts of money the players make.

Biggio fell just two votes short in his second try and should get in next year. But what's quite interesting about the vote totals is that outside of Biggio and Piazza, the vote total of every single holdover dropped from last year to this year. That's great in the case of Barry Bonds, Lee Smith, Sammy Sosa and others, but alarming when it comes to Jeff Bagwell, whose natural progression should have been to increase from last year's nearly 60% in his first year of eligibility but instead fell to 54.3% this year.
This is why I figured Morris would get in. I did hear a discussion on why Blyleven got in an why Morris shouldn't and it was due to Bert pitching on much weaker teams early in his career. Morris was mostly an ace on powerhouse teams that won championships or contended for them for years. I just thought with Jim Rice lowering the bar to what a final ballot hall of famer can be Morris who won championships and didn't burn out young would get the benefit of the doubt.
 

Don Wassall

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Yes, Morris surprisingly dropped from 67.7% to 61.5% in his final appearance. Don't know if something like that has happened before to someone so close on his final chance. We discuss Morris every year at this time and I've always thought he was close but ultimately undeserving. Same with Schilling, who only received 29.2%.

Jeff Kent, with more home runs than any other second baseman, only drew 15.2% his first time on the ballot. Mike Mussina received just 20.3% his first time on.
 

Carolina Speed

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In fairness, the first five selected covered a period of over 40 years of baseball and were the cream of the cream.

I watched a discussion show on the MLB Network the other night before the results were announced. It was moderated by Bob Costas, who is insufferable when it comes to politics and general pomposity, but he's always been pretty good when it comes to baseball. At any rate, after hearing the panelists discuss the pros and cons of various players, I don't have a major problem with Frank Thomas getting in as his stats are very impressive. From everything I've read about him though, he personified the me-first, totally selfish approach among athletes that has evolved over the past 45 years, partly from glorifying some of the negative aspects of black behavior and partly because of the ever more mercenary nature of pro sports, including the ridiculous amounts of money the players make.

Biggio fell just two votes short in his second try and should get in next year. But what's quite interesting about the vote totals is that outside of Biggio and Piazza, the vote total of every single holdover dropped from last year to this year. That's great in the case of Barry Bonds, Lee Smith, Sammy Sosa and others, but alarming when it comes to Jeff Bagwell, whose natural progression should have been to increase from last year's nearly 60% in his first year of eligibility but instead fell to 54.3% this year.


True, but how low are the requirements for election going to go? I mean Tony Perez and Andre Dawson just off the top of my head!

I understand everyone can't be Cobb or Ruth, but others got in in that era, Young, Gehrig, Simmons, Speaker, Lajoie, etc. then DiMaggio, Williams, Mantle, Mays, Aaron, (Rose should be in), etc.. Those are the players that are truly great. Just as Clemens, Bonds, etc. could be there with or without steroids.

A lot of the players there letting now, exception being Thomas, are not even close to these guys.

I'm hoping Trout, Harper, and some of the great young pitchers, Verlander, Kershaw, etc. can achieve some of the past baseball greatness!
 
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When I look to see who's worthy of the Baseball Hall of Fame, not that anyone cares what I think, but I look no further than the first five members elected; Ty Cobb, Babe Ruth, Christy Mathewson, Honus Wagner, and Walter Johnson.

To me, it's the "Hall of Greatness," not the hall of the very good.

Frank Thomas was very good, but was he "Great?"

Good thought.., who is 'great' is a really subjective assessment.
Would CasteFootballers agree, Ruth & Cobb basically sit on a dais above all the rest (?) They are still the gold standard no..
And on that 2nd tier, would be historical greats like Gehrig, Hornsby, Walter Johnson, etc.. Would Maddux join that 2nd tier (?) He was the best on this ballot (?), and has the number of wins, innings pitched, and win % to be peers with guys like W. Johnson & Mathewson.. I didn't watch a lot of baseball in the 90s, so I plead some ignorance.
My other question would be, isn't Maddux' pitching dominance even more impressive bcuz he lacked some of the early pitchers' advantages like a raised mound, inability to spit on & scuff up the ball, or is that reading too much into the handicaps of recent pitching ?
 
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