The Case for the williams use of steroids

[Guest]

Many here whine that the Williams sisters must be on Steroids


Yet none of them can prove anything right BART ?


1 Athletic well muscled bodies ? bullsh*t There are other top female tennis players who are more muscled or as muscled then the Williams Sisters are they also on drugs ?.


2 Have the Williams Sisters ever been under investigation for anything ? NO


3 Have they consistently passed their tests YES


4 Do they show classic signs of Steroid abuse NO


So where is the real proof circumstancial or otherwise that the Sisters have used steroids ?


If you dont have proof then just admit that you think they use steroids because they are black and that you are looking for an excuse to downplay their victory (i am talking to you Bart).

 

[White_Savage]

Hah! I'd like to see a picture of any other FEMALE tennis competitor who resembles the Williams. Now with female bodybuilding we could some comparisons...

Steroid use or genetic freakdom, six of one, half dozen of the other IMO, whatever the cause, that match was for all intents and purposes the proto-typical Nordic woman playing the proto-typical ******* male. The he/she has obviously somehow got more testerone flowing through than Bobby Riggs did when he lost-if Maria wins next time, why that beats the pants off of Billie Jean Kings incessantly celebrated coup.

 

[Guest]

Hah! I'd like to see a picture of any other FEMALE tennis competitor who resembles the Williams. Now with female bodybuilding we could some comparisons...

Steroid use or genetic freakdom, six of one, half dozen of the other IMO, whatever the cause, that match was for all intents and purposes the proto-typical Nordic woman playing the proto-typical ******* male. The he/she has obviously somehow got more testerone flowing through than Bobby Riggs did when he lost-if Maria wins next time, why that beats the pants off of Billie Jean Kings incessantly celebrated coup.

Still no real evidence eh ?. Arent you going to claim that there was a ''conspiracy'' to let Venus win .


So a player who has better genetics is a freak right ? Then i guess Maurismo and Capriati are also freaks since they are as musled or in the case of maurismo more muscled then the Williams sisters but htey get a free pass in your eyes because they are white right.

 

[White_Savage]

"htey get a free pass in your eyes because they are white right."

Well, I've known a few bull-dykes, even been friends with a couple, not bad gals to watch the fights with and certainly better than a lout-mouthed *******.

 

[Bart]

Many here whine that the Williams sisters must be on Steroids Yet none of them can prove anything right BART ?

I can't prove thatany athletes in tennis, boxing, baseball, football and track use steroids or drugs. Most won't tell the truth and unless caught will not admit to use. Many athletes are taught various procedures to scotch the TESTS. Some have switched urine samples, used whizzenators (sp) had blood transfusions and even introduced other substances to alter the results. I'm sure we're unaware of all the methods.


You mentioned Capriati and Muresmo as beingmanly or enhanced , whatever the term.Yes, I have agreed they are suspect in my mind... as are the Williams sisters. Do you think their mentor, Richard Williams wouldn't use any advantage possible?


Here is an interestingthree year old article featuring Williams and Capriati.They both object to random tests whichof courseare harder to fudge. They both offer reasons which are self serving.


http://espn.go.com/tennis/wimbledon02/s/2002/0702/1401594.ht ml


WIMBLEDON, England -- Venus Williams won't open her home for surprise drug testers. Jennifer Capriati says random testing is an ''invasion.''





Despite objections from two of the sport's biggest stars, the women's tennis tour said on Tuesday it will introduce out-of-competition testing this year for performance-enhancing substances.





The sport's international body, meanwhile, said it's ready to bring in blood tests for the endurance-boosting hormone EPO if the World Anti-Doping Agency deems them necessary.


Williams, the top-ranked player in the women's game the and two-time defending Wimbledon champion, said she's not against out-of-competition testing in general but is opposed to no-notice testing.





''I don't think that's a good idea,'' she said. ''I think there has to at least be a notice normally. I wouldn't let anyone in my house if I'm not expecting them. Showing up at the door -- you kidding?''





''Actually that happened to me once,'' she added. ''Someone tried to get in the development, doing a drug test. If I wasn't tested in the next two hours, I wouldn't be playing on tour. You know there's always someone at the gates trying to get in. ...





''Normally I tell the gate, 'Tell them Venus moved to Siberia some months ago.''





It was unclear when the episode occurred, whether it was in London or at her residence in Palm Beach Gardens, Fla., or whether those who showed up at her house were legitimate drug testers or impostors.





Asked about drugs in tennis, Williams said, ''I don't think it's a factor at all.'' Capriati said she doesn't think any players use steroids.





Capriati, a three-time Grand Slam title winner, expressed strong opposition to random, offsite testing.





''It's news to me,'' she said. ''I think that's a bit of an invasion. I don't think they have any right to kind of see what's going on inside your body, even if you're not doing anything.





When told some male players have tested positive in recent years, she said, ''Well, the guys are another story.''


Edited by: Bart

 

[Guest]

Many here whine that the Williams sisters must be on Steroids Yet none of them can prove anything right BART ?

I can't prove thatany athletes in tennis, boxing, baseball, football and track use steroids or drugs. Most won't tell the truth and unless caught will not admit to use. Many athletes are taught various procedures to scotch the TESTS. Some have switched urine samples, used whizzenators (sp) had blood transfusions and even introduced other substances to alter the results. I'm sure we're unaware of all the methods.


You mentioned Capriati and Muresmo as beingmanly or enhanced , whatever the term.Yes, I have agreed they are suspect in my mind... as are the Williams sisters. Do you think their mentor, Richard Williams wouldn't use any advantage possible?


Here is an interestingthree year old article featuring Williams and Capriati.They both object to random tests whichof courseare harder to fudge. They both offer reasons which are self serving.


http://espn.go.com/tennis/wimbledon02/s/2002/0702/1401594.ht ml


WIMBLEDON, England -- Venus Williams won't open her home for surprise drug testers. Jennifer Capriati says random testing is an ''invasion.''





Despite objections from two of the sport's biggest stars, the women's tennis tour said on Tuesday it will introduce out-of-competition testing this year for performance-enhancing substances.





The sport's international body, meanwhile, said it's ready to bring in blood tests for the endurance-boosting hormone EPO if the World Anti-Doping Agency deems them necessary.


Williams, the top-ranked player in the women's game the and two-time defending Wimbledon champion, said she's not against out-of-competition testing in general but is opposed to no-notice testing.





''I don't think that's a good idea,'' she said. ''I think there has to at least be a notice normally. I wouldn't let anyone in my house if I'm not expecting them. Showing up at the door -- you kidding?''





''Actually that happened to me once,'' she added. ''Someone tried to get in the development, doing a drug test. If I wasn't tested in the next two hours, I wouldn't be playing on tour. You know there's always someone at the gates trying to get in. ...





''Normally I tell the gate, 'Tell them Venus moved to Siberia some months ago.''





It was unclear when the episode occurred, whether it was in London or at her residence in Palm Beach Gardens, Fla., or whether those who showed up at her house were legitimate drug testers or impostors.





Asked about drugs in tennis, Williams said, ''I don't think it's a factor at all.'' Capriati said she doesn't think any players use steroids.





Capriati, a three-time Grand Slam title winner, expressed strong opposition to random, offsite testing.





''It's news to me,'' she said. ''I think that's a bit of an invasion. I don't think they have any right to kind of see what's going on inside your body, even if you're not doing anything.





When told some male players have tested positive in recent years, she said, ''Well, the guys are another story.''

That is still not a real indictment against the Williams Sisters ort Capriati they have only objected to random tests unless i read the article wrong it did'nt say that they did'nt submit to random testing when it was mandated . And neither the Williams Sisters or Capriati have ever been under serious suspicion of Steroid use .

 

[Bart]

Lyndsay Davenport was quoted earlier this year as saying she supports more out of competition testing. Just like in other sports, athletes can cycle drug usage. I find it interesting that a female player who obviously doesn't look like she's ever used steroids wants more testing while Capriati and Williams do not. Hmmm.... you don't have to be Mr. Monk to figure this out.


http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6846642


MELBOURNE, Australia-In the wake of the drug controversy involving Russian Svetlana Kuznetsova, American Lindsay Davenport has called for more out-of-competition testing.
Davenport, the top seed in the Australian Open, who has shaken off a bout of bronchitis to play here, reached the third round Thursday with a 2-6, 6-2, 6-2 victory over Michaela Pastikova of the Czech Republic.
Asked how often she had been tested out of competition following her first-round victory over Conchita Martinez on Tuesday, Davenport said, "Not enough. In 2002 when I was out injured I wasn't tested at all out of competition. I think that you have the right to be tested anywhere.Edited by: Bart

 

[Guest]

Lyndsay Davenport was quoted earlier this year as saying she supports more out of competition testing. Just like in other sports, athletes can cycle drug usage. I find it interesting that a female player who obviously doesn't look like she's ever used steroids wants more testing while Capriati and Williams do not. Hmmm.... you don't have to be Mr. Monk to figure this out.


http://msnbc.msn.com/id/6846642


MELBOURNE, Australia-In the wake of the drug controversy involving Russian Svetlana Kuznetsova, American Lindsay Davenport has called for more out-of-competition testing.
Davenport, the top seed in the Australian Open, who has shaken off a bout of bronchitis to play here, reached the third round Thursday with a 2-6, 6-2, 6-2 victory over Michaela Pastikova of the Czech Republic.
Asked how often she had been tested out of competition following her first-round victory over Conchita Martinez on Tuesday, Davenport said, "Not enough. In 2002 when I was out injured I wasn't tested at all out of competition. I think that you have the right to be tested anywhere.

Lance Armstrong also does'nt like random testing in cycling he claimedthat someone could falsify a test to discredit him. Does this mean that he uses Steroids ?. For the record i dont believe he has used any steroids .


Because an athlete does'nt like random testing does'nt automaticaly mean they are guilty by suspicion.


Edited by: fistfighter

 

[Bart]

Fistfighter, I know something of human nature, having been around the block a few times. Usually, people who have something to hide will protest the most vigorously. There may be exceptionsof course for varous reasons but generally speaking it is so.


Unfortunately, since so many athletes use performance enhancing drugs, it is almost impossible for someone who is -clean- to compete, especialy at the highest levels.Those who abide by the rules feel they are greatlydisadvantaged , so they demand more testing. The athlete who uses, quite naturally finds a multitude of reasons toavoid detection.


Now, in a sport like Pro. bodybuilding all top performers are without question juiced to the gills but the fans don't care because in a weird sort of way, it's a level playing field. It is a problem however, when juicers compete in so - called NATURAL competitions. From what I've read, it's pretty much the same with the sport of cycling.


Actually, women who don't use are at the greatest disadvantage. Years ago, the female bodybuilders were athletic and trim. yet feminine. Now, their bodies have been chemically altered to such an extent, it is hard to distinguish them from MEN!


I pity the female tennis player who chooses to remain a woman and abide by the rules. It is not fair for them to suffer defeat at the hands of the she - beasts they oppose.


Edited by: Bart

 

[Kaptain]

Why doth yee protest so much?

 

[White Shogun]

I don't care if she's on roids - she's butt ugly. She looks like a man, period. If you took that tennis racket out of her hands and dropped the ear rings, how many of you would even know she was a female tennis player? She has the look and features of a male sprinter.

 

[Guest]

Still no real proof about them using steroids right ?

 

[White Shogun]

fitsfighter writes:

Still no real proof about them using steroids right ?

Does it really matter if there's proof? Who are you arguing with? How many times does a person have to say its irrelevant if they're on steroids?

They're manly women.

She's a man in drag.

I've seen better looking transvestites than those two.

 

[Don Wassall]

It's impossible to obtain proof unless one is around the Williams sisters 24/7. If they're on steroids most likely only a very few people know about it.


What there is though, is a remarkable lack of interest in the subject from the media. Someone like Lance Armstrong, who is lean, has to continually face questions about it though no one has any proof, while two women who are more muscular than the most muscular pre-juice female bodybuilders, don't.


By their own admission, the Williams girls aren't particularly interested in practicing. See Serena's comments in the Wimbledon thread. They're known for not playing many tournaments and pulling out of others at the last minute due to sudden, suspicious "injuries." They have other, non-athletic interests they regularly pursue. Yet they somehow are muscular almost beyond belief, especially Serena. If they're not practicing tennis much, what then are they doing --endless bouts ofhigh-intensity weight lifting? Not likely.


The promoters and enablers of the Caste Systemshowed littleinterest in steroids at all, until mutant sluggers and the Balco scandal forced attention on it in baseball, probably becausemost of the beneficiaries have been black athletes in various sports that the mediacontinually hype as America's new male and female heroes going back to the days of Carl Lewis.


Does tennis even have any testing for juicing? I wonder if golf does. While most golfers now work out, Tiger Woods' physique underwent aquite noticeablechange in the form of increased muscularity from his early days on the PGA tour. Is it the result purely of hard work on his part? Who knows for sure? Certainly the ever-adoring media when it comes to black athletes has a pronounced lack of curiosity about the subject.

 

[Guest]

It's impossible to obtain proof unless one is around the Williams sisters 24/7. If they're on steroids most likely only a very few people know about it.


What there is though, is a remarkable lack of interest in the subject from the media. Someone like Lance Armstrong, who is lean, has to continually face questions about it though no one has any proof, while two women who are more muscular than the most muscular pre-juice female bodybuilders, don't.


By their own admission, the Williams girls aren't particularly interested in practicing. See Serena's comments in the Wimbledon thread. They're known for not playing many tournaments and pulling out of others at the last minute due to sudden, suspicious "injuries." They have other, non-athletic interests they regularly pursue. Yet they somehow are muscular almost beyond belief, especially Serena. If they're not practicing tennis much, what then are they doing --endless bouts ofhigh-intensity weight lifting? Not likely.


The promoters and enablers of the Caste Systemshowed littleinterest in steroids at all, until mutant sluggers and the Balco scandal forced attention on it in baseball, probably becausemost of the beneficiaries have been black athletes in various sports that the mediacontinually hype as America's new male and female heroes going back to the days of Carl Lewis.


Does tennis even have any testing for juicing? I wonder if golf does. While most golfers now work out, Tiger Woods' physique underwent aquite noticeablechange in the form of increased muscularity from his early days on the PGA tour. Is it the result purely of hard work on his part? Who knows for sure? Certainly the ever-adoring media when it comes to black athletes has a pronounced lack of curiosity about the subject.

Wow tiger packed a whole five pound sin a year you are correct theman is obviuously juicing

. Contrary to popular belief it is possible to get muscled without steroids .


But tiger being black its not possible for him to gain five pounds in ayer through working out and a good diet. I mean its possible to get average slobs into great shape with the right exercize plan but Tiger must be juicing

.





And yes Tennis does have tests and guess what Serean and Venus PASSED all their tests Serena And Venus have not even been under suspicion ever.


And other players are as muscled or more muscled then them funny that you dont talk about them.

 

[Don Wassall]

fistfighter wrote: Wow tiger packed a whole five pound sin a year you are correct theman is obviuously juicing

. Contrary to popular belief it is possible to get muscled without steroids .


But tiger being black its not possible for him to gain five pounds in ayer through working out and a good diet. I mean its possible to get average slobs into great shape with the right exercize plan but Tiger must be juicing

.


And yes Tennis does have tests and guess what Serean and Venus PASSED all their tests Serena And Venus have not even been under suspicion ever.


And other players are as muscled or more muscled then them funny that you dont talk about them.





Tiger added just five pounds???

You be funny. Anyway, I didn't say he juiced, not that accurately reading what people write here is one of your strong suits, only that there will never be any questions asked in the media aboutthe possibilityjust as there isn't about Serena and Venus. Given that Serena and Venus aren't much into practicing, what's your opinion on how they became and remain so muscular?


There are other muscled female tennis players, but if you want to know why we're not talking about them take a quick look at title of this thread, which you started!

 

[Bart]

Fistfighter, you may have forgotten why most of the comments about the sisters are being made. Richard Williams :They've struggled, he says, because of criticism from fans and the media, who grew tired of watching them play in Grand Slam finals -- and think they've made tennis ``boring.''


He's wrong about the media. They have bee very supportive and non-critical of the sisters, as evidenced by the article Don posted


Williams: -- but when those two black girls came and beat up everyone, tennis was 'not exciting,''' .


I never heard anyone say tennis became boring or not exciting since the Williams clan showed up. He tries to make it a racial thing.Unless a person is an avid tennis fan, most people just don't enjoy watching ugly, muscular, non-feminine looking -things- play tennis.


One more thing: It drives me nuts to hear women gruntingafter each shot. It can even make a prettygirl seem unattractive. At the Wimbledon, Venus was hard on the eyes to be sure but her constant bellowing made her even more beastly.

 

[Colonel_Reb]

Sounded like a sow pig or a cow I'd say, Bart. Maria drives me crazy when she plays, the sounds she makes!

 

[White Shogun]

I never heard anyone say tennis became boring or not exciting since the Williams clan showed up. He tries to make it a racial thing. Unless a person is an avid tennis fan, most people just don't enjoy watching ugly, muscular, non-feminine looking -things- play tennis.

I might be in the *ahem* minority on this one, but I don't know many people who were all that excited about watching tennis, before, during, or after the Williams' arrival. Not unless Kournakova was on screen, or now Sharapova. Oh tennis is nice to read about - oh, Federer won again? Cool. But I don't know many people who remain glued to the screen for hours on end just to watch tennis.

(I realize there has to be some hard core tennis fan on this board who will read this and flame me, but I think the generalization in this case is true.)

 

[jaxvid]

This being "castefootball" not "castetennis" there will be a lot of members with limited interest in tennis. I like the game and play it once in a while but like most here do not watch a lot of it.

The Williams sisters judging from the pictures are much more muscled then other women athletes even black ones. If it is all natural, and it may be, then they are freaks and it is doubtful that there will be many other black women following in thier footsteps.

Tennis is an interesting subject for castefootball fans as it illustrates the difference in the way the media treats athletes by race. As Don mentioned there is not even a whisper about possible steroid abuse whereas many white athletes face questions all the time.

 

[Bart]

The Williams siaters could have beat the hell out of Arthur Ashe.

 

[jaxvid]

Dude you are crackin' me up!

Put Ashe in a dress with some make-up and he probably would look better too!

 

[Kaptain]

Fistfighter, How does one obtain proof of the highest tech undetectable steroids? More advanced testing maybe and completely random testing to which both Williams sisters are opposed to. Barry Bonds has passed all of his tests too, but his Balco connections basically prove his guilt. You don't have congressional hearings on steriod abuse when there is no proof. Since the high tech steroids that the top american athletes are taking are still impossible to detect under current procedures, we have to use common sense and our own two eyes. Can you honestly look at the pic of Serena and say that you think that she is still clean?

 

[Guest]

Fistfighter, you may have forgotten why most of the comments about the sisters are being made. Richard Williams :They've struggled, he says, because of criticism from fans and the media, who grew tired of watching them play in Grand Slam finals -- and think they've made tennis ``boring.''


He's wrong about the media. They have bee very supportive and non-critical of the sisters, as evidenced by the article Don posted


Williams: -- but when those two black girls came and beat up everyone, tennis was 'not exciting,''' .


I never heard anyone say tennis became boring or not exciting since the Williams clan showed up. He tries to make it a racial thing.Unless a person is an avid tennis fan, most people just don't enjoy watching ugly, muscular, non-feminine looking -things- play tennis.


One more thing: It drives me nuts to hear women gruntingafter each shot. It can even make a prettygirl seem unattractive. At the Wimbledon, Venus was hard on the eyes to be sure but her constant bellowing made her even more beastly.

Seles is the Queen of grunts are you afraid people are gonna think you are watching a sex vid when you are watching womens tennis

.


Richard Williams is an idiot though like a lot of Tennis star fathers.

 

[Guest]

Fistfighter, How does one obtain proof of the highest tech undetectable steroids? More advanced testing maybe and completely random testing to which both Williams sisters are opposed to. Barry Bonds has passed all of his tests too, but his Balco connections basically prove his guilt. You don't have congressional hearings on steriod abuse when there is no proof. Since the high tech steroids that the top american athletes are taking are still impossible to detect under current procedures, we have to use common sense and our own two eyes. Can you honestly look at the pic of Serena and say that you think that she is still clean?

There where no random tests in baseball till a short time ago there have been random tests in Tennis for 2 3 years the williams sisters have passed them. They dont like them true does'nt mean they dont submit to the tests. Armstrong does'nt like random tets either he still takes them does'nt mean he is taking steroids .


And as far as i know The Sisters are not on the list of Balco or any other sports supplements company