Wariner - 200 Meters

[Poacher]

This is not concerning Wariner but Alan Webb won the 1500m title. It is significant to me because he beat Bernard Legat, a Kenyan immigrant who has been here a year or two.

I remember when I heard that Legat was planning on immigrating to the U.S., I thought "great, there goes Alan Webb's chance at being a household name."

He came over just as Webb's star was (and is) rising. When Legat got here the first thing he did was break Steve Scott's national record in the mile. I don't know about the rest of you but to me there is something unseemly about a talented athlete hop-scotching around the globe wiping out others records. I mean really, it's ridiculous. What if he decides to become a Canadian citizen tomorrow? Will he be credited with their records as well? You should have to be at least born in and have done the majority of your training in the country whose records you are credited with setting. I don't think that is unfair.

Anyway, I'm really glad Webb beat him.

 

[Colonel Callan]

Wariner could go sub 20 IF he ran the 200 often enough. He simply doesn't run it that often. Two races this season, spaced well apart, before running the Nationals is not enough. By the way, Wariner finished 4th at the Nationals after this lack of racing. Carter had run so poorly 4 - 6 weeks ago AND lost so much weight during that time that it is a bit suspicious. Drugs or no drugs that puts your body out of whack. It's a little off the beam, but have any of you ever heard Carter interviewed? He makes James Toney sound like an English professor. Yeah, blacks must be held to the same standards as whites when it comes to college. He is the most ignorant sounding athlete I have ever heard. Anyway, the rash of very fast improvement among 4 or 5 guys in the 200 has raised a red flag among those who aren't brainwashed and don't toe the PC line. Like others said, with whites doing well in the 400 and making remarks about dropping down to the deuce you'll see "sudden improvement" in that event to maybe give some people second thoughts. Wish I'd been the one who said it first, I know I was thinking that. It is true that these guys are so yoked, have so much muscle definition, all of a sudden, that it's eyebrow raising to say the least.

That said, Wariner's prime event is the 400, and he's going to have to keep on Angelo Taylor who has had massive drops to his PR, all of a sudden. If this guy were white he'd be in prison as he's been caught at least twice having sex with minors. However, a guy with his personal integrity would surely never use drugs. Neither would LaShawn Merrit who is also threatening to break 44 with his newly found muscularity. Although Merrit's various coaches have been connected with drug use and other crimes, he himself would never resort to such tactics. Wariner should run every race with a target on his back.

I need to check on Andrew Rock's story. I'd heard he was out of shape due to injury but I don't know if that's true.

 

[white lightning]

On a message board over at bbc.uk.com, they were discussing how alot of Brits believe that T.Gay is on a serious juice diet.They have a pic of him that is kind of incredible hulk like.It is just very hard if not impossible to believe that guys like A.Powell,T.Gay,X.Carter,L.Merritt,and W.Spearmon are all clean.They are just so much faster than everyone and have been since college.Gatlin was the same way in college.He got busted.Same with Tim Montgomery.Time will tell if the US will continue to cover for these guys.

Under the circumstances,I thought that Wariner looked very solid.He made the finals against very tough competition and finished 4th.Not bad at all.He could go sub 20 if he races more but he is the best in the world over 400.Like Col.Callen said however,he needs to watch out for alot of the up and comers who are dropping their times quicker than gravity.Out of nowhere.Man that must be some good Flinstones!

 

[Guest]

Of course those geeks across the pond are gonna fantisize about US sprinters beingjuiced. When they couldn't beatLance Armstrong, they cried about him being "juiced" too.Craig Pickering is bigger,fuller, and3 or 4 years youngerthan all 5 of those 200m guys. They're jealous because they're not on our level. We've been destroying them in the sprints for decades. Every country's jealous of the US. Euro runners pretty much run the same speed for the first 60 or so yards, but don't have the stamina to keep up during the last 40.


Rynell Parson is a 16 year old string bean whojust ran a 10.23 this weekend.I suppose they think he's beenjuicing for years too.How dumb.Edited by: rj413

 

[Guest]

Of course those geeks across the pond are gonna fantisize about US sprinters beingjuiced.

Yeah, well, some of them are. It's not really a matter of whether any sprinters are using drugs, it's only a matter of which ones are. Some europeans use drugs too, so they would be familiar with spotting users.

Remember Kenteris from Greece? He got all the way down to 19.8 on drugs. He won the 00 games with a 20.0 and no americans even placed that year.

 

[Guest]

Yeah, well, some of them are.

Like who? And what's the proof?People can assume all they want, but until someone tests dirty, they don't know.It's a fallacious argument to assume:


A. Runner X isreally fast


B. Runner Y is just as fast


C. Runner X is dirty


D. Therefore, Runner Y is dirty too.





That's flawed logic.

 

[Guest]

He won the 00 games with a 20.0 and no americans even placed that year.

That's because Maurice Greene and Michael Johnson were injured during the Olympic trials. 20 seconds would have been a leisurely jog in the park for those two.Edited by: rj413

 

[jaxvid]

He won the 00 games with a 20.0 and no americans even placed that year.

That's because Maurice Greene and Michael Johnson were injured during the Olympic trials.  20 seconds would have been a leisurely jog in the park for those two.

Injured? that's "troll-speak" for "not being able to pass a drug test."

Greene and Johnson (and Armstrong too BTW) were juiced to the gills. It's what many top athletes needed to do to stay at the top, many still do it. What proof do you need?

You didn't need proof to know that Bobby Cutts was guilty. It's just commonsense.

Look troll, I don't know what you are trying to sell but we're not buying it here.

 

[Guest]

He won the 00 games with a 20.0 and no americans even placed that year.

That's because Maurice Greene and Michael Johnson were injured during the Olympic trials. 20 seconds would have been a leisurely jog in the park for those two.

Injured? that's "troll-speak" for "not being able to pass a drug test."

Greene and Johnson (and Armstrong too BTW) were juiced to the gills. It's what many top athletes needed to do to stay at the top, many still do it. What proof do you need?

You didn't need proof to know that Bobby Cutts was guilty. It's just commonsense.

Look troll, I don't know what you are trying to sell but we're not buying it here.

I take it you don't follow track and field that closely. Maurice Greene and Michael Johnsonbothstarted the 200 meter final at the Olympic Trials, but wereinjured during the race. They won 100m and 400m, respectively, at those same trials. They also won the 100 and 400 at those same Olympics.

 

[Guest]

That's because Maurice Greene and Michael Johnson were injured during the Olympic trials.

Yeah right. It's because Coby Miller and John Capel went 20.3 and 20.4 in the final. They did not perform when it counted. Capel was the fastest guy in the world at the 200 for a few years.

 

[jaxvid]

I take it you don't follow track and field that closely. 

No I don't. But I follow trolls closely. This is a site that supports and cheers for white athletes. This is not a debating forum. You can believe what you want but we have no interest in hearing the same tired myths about black athletes that we hear on every other sports forum in the universe. Take it elsewhere.

 

[Guest]

And before you make your next post, let's remember the point here is that a drugged up european won the olympic 200 meters and was never caught, never stripped of his medal, never penalized, and never stopped running while on drugs until 4 whole years later when he ducked out of the 04 games because it looked like he was finally going to get caught.

As far as I know Kenteris never even tested positive for any drugs, he simply dropped out of world level competition to avoid it.

 

[Guest]

That's because Maurice Greene and Michael Johnson were injured during the Olympic trials.

Yeah right. It's because Coby Miller and John Capel went 20.3 and 20.4 in the final. They did not perform when it counted. Capel was the fastest guy in the world at the 200 for a few years.

Are you for real? Maurice Greene was the reigning 1999 US and World 200m champion. Michael was the world record holder. They got injured DURING the highly anticipated 200m Olympic Trial. EVERY track fan knows that.


http://youtube.com/watch?v=kN0xJoNvcyAhttp://youtube.com/watch?v=kN0xJonvcyA

 

[white lightning]

Michael Johnson went from an average high school and college guy to a double world record holder.Look at logic here.It is almost a given that he took drugs.Countless sprinters and coaches have admitted how wide spread the steroid use is in track and especially the US. Dwain Chambers of England even said he used because he felt he couldn't compete with the other guys using as in the Americans.Tim Montgomery,Justin Gatlin,K.White,Marion Jones to just name a few.Go find another board to love your athletes.

 

[Guest]

No I don't. But I follow trolls closely. This is a site that supports and cheers for white athletes. This is not a debating forum. You can believe what you want but we have no interest in hearing the same tired myths about black athletes that we hear on every other sports forum in the universe. Take it elsewhere.

What are you talking about? I was supporting US athletes, Lance Armstrong included. You're telling me every poster isrequired to side with the european press againstLance Armstrongand the current US sprinters,and support theirignorant machinations of drug use despite not a shredof proof whatsoever?

 

[Guest]

Michael Johnson went from an average high school and college guy to a double world record holder.Look at logic here.It is almost a given that he took drugs.Countless sprinters and coaches have admitted how wide spread the steroid use is in track and especially the US. Dwain Chambers of England even said he used because he felt he couldn't compete with the other guys using as in the Americans.Tim Montgomery,Justin Gatlin,K.White,Marion Jones to just name a few.Go find another board to love your athletes.

It's a "given" when you WANT to believe he's juicing. Again. Until a specific persontests dirty, there's no proof he's juicing.They are all different people..do you understand that? If 10 straight cyclers test dirty, that doesn't mean the 11th cycler isdirty. If Barry Bonds is juicing, that doesn't mean every outfielder is juicing. If Jason Giambi is juicing, that doesn't mean every first baseman is juicing.


We can all hope, pray, and assume all we want, but that simply doesn't make it so. They're all different people.Edited by: rj413

 

[white lightning]

That is fine.We are talking about apples and oranges here.Who really cares.The bottome line is that this is a site to discuss white athletes period.There are countless other track sites and sports sites also like blackathlete.com,etc. Most here give the honest black athletes there due,but we are not here to talk about them.Every other site does that already.If you want to stay here,we welcome you but we are here to talk about guys like Pickering,Wariner,etc. Not the other guys.So make up your mind if you want to be here.Thanks.

 

[Don Wassall]

I just checked -- he's a persistent troll who's been deleted multiple times before.

 

[PitBull]

Its just faulty logic to say that somebody is not doing PED's until they are
caught. People commit crimes and misdeeds all the time and are not
caught, and they do so because it advantages them to do so. Whether or
not somebody actually has broken the law is independent of whether or
not they have been dragged into court and proven guilty. Actually, if we
are to believe the black point of view, a lot of proven crooks are really
innocent. What does having been proven guilty prove? For some people,
THAT'S not even enough!

In fact, in order to catch a crook, you have to suspect them of doing
something wrong and then go about the process of getting the evidence
to prove it. Suspicion is a necessary precedent for investigating
wrongdoing by anyone anyway. And going from ordinary to
extraordinary rather quickly makes people suspicious. We can speculate
all we want here about PED's and who's using them in sports, and we are
probably right most of the time, because so many athletes ARE on dope.

In my mind its a big problem, and it taints a lot of what goes on. Having
said that, if a white athlete has to take the junk to beat the black guys ont
he junk, I'm all for it. But if they can beat them clean, I'm even happier.

P.S. Any sprinter that looks like a bodybuilder is on steroids, period, end
of story. Large leg muscles sure, but large upper body, why? Gives you
more power? How about now you weigh 10-15 pounds more? I think the
two cancel out with an average, unjuiced body. On steroids, well,
obviouly the extra weight doesn't matter. Wariner looked a bit more
muscular to me in his early race this year. I hope it doesn't slow him
down. Edited by: PitBull

 

[SteveB]

It is interesting to look at the career of Shawn Crawford in relation to this discussion of PEDs. Crawford best time in high school for the 200m was 21.57 (a full second behind Wariner's best high school time). He has a good college career, but never was close to sub 20 sec. Then in 2003-2004 he balloons up to close to 200 lbs and starts dropping sub 20 sec in every race and wins the Olympics. All of the sudden, he has "injury problems" loses 35 lbs and hasn't run under 20.2 since the Olympics.

Sure Crawford has never tested positive for PEDs, but what else can explain his extraordinary 2004 season? Why did he lose 35 lbs in 2005 if it wasn't because he got off of the juice? The same thing goes for all of these guys that burst on the scene with unbelievable performances. Some people can believe what they want, but the anecdotal evidence is too hard to ignore.

 

[white is right]

It is interesting to look at the career of Shawn Crawford in relation to this discussion of PEDs. Crawford best time in high school for the 200m was 21.57 (a full second behind Wariner's best high school time). He has a good college career, but never was close to sub 20 sec. Then in 2003-2004 he balloons up to close to 200 lbs and starts dropping sub 20 sec in every race and wins the Olympics. All of the sudden, he has "injury problems" loses 35 lbs and hasn't run under 20.2 since the Olympics.

Sure Crawford has never tested positive for PEDs, but what else can explain his extraordinary 2004 season? Why did he lose 35 lbs in 2005 if it wasn't because he got off of the juice? The same thing goes for all of these guys that burst on the scene with unbelievable performances. Some people can believe what they want, but the anecdotal evidence is too hard to ignore.

What about the fact that he and Gatlin were training partners. I will never forget when Crawford like a donkey wore a baseball cap backwards and mocked the third world sprinters who lined up with him. Or in the quarters he and Gatlin having another gear and doing cheers for each other as the other runners couldn't keep up. Yes they were both clean at the time.....

 

[white lightning]

Wariner races tommorow.Maybe we can get some good weather and he can finally improve his 200 meters personal best time.He is in a world class field so maybe they can help to pull him a little faster.

 

[jacknyc]

Supposed to be rainy and cold tomorrow in Lausanne.
Not good for a fast time - unfortunately.

 

[white lightning]

That sucks.Almost all of his 200 meter races have been in bad conditions.Looks like another slow time probably.I was really anxious to also see how Johan Wissman would also do in the 200 against a great field of sprinters.Oh well.Let's hope for the best.

 

[Colonel Callan]

Wariner finished 5th in bad conditions - from lane 2. However, for not
running the 200 much he was within .1 of his main competitors at the
400 - of course 'drug free' Tyson Gay ran away from everyone, clocking
19.78. Unbelievable time under the weather circumstances. However, the
other sub 20 sec Americans (Spearmon, Martin, Merrit) were barely ahead
of Wariner and they had center lanes. They're all supposed to be much
faster at 200. With a few more 200's and some good weather he'll run sub
20. I don't know if he any more 200's left for the season. Gay is on
another planet right now. Clean?

1 GAY, Tyson USA 19.78
2 BOLT, Usain JAM 20.11
3 SPEARMON, Wallace USA20.42
4 MARTIN, Rodney USA20.42
5 MERRITT, Lashawn USA20.44
6 WARINER, Jeremy USA20.52
7 WISSMAN, Johan SWE20.57
8 ALERTE, David FRA20.58