HS Junior runs 10.36

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Brett Blanshan, a high school junior in the state of Washington, ran a 10.36 this past May giving him the #1 ranking in the nation according to "Athletic.net".

With the proper maturation, training, etc. (PEDs?) anyone who runs a 10.36 at that age has the genetic potential to make a run at Olympic gold.




http://www.yakimaherald.com/stories/3926
 
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Actually, he's 19th. Athletic.net doesn't maintain a very comprehensive list. Dyestat.com covers more high school meets than any other site on the net that I know about.

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[url]http://www.dyestat.com/index.php?pg=rankings_dyestat_elite_a ll&l_query=t&l_season_id=10&gender=b&l_event_id=1 [/url]


Also, the wind gauge wasn't working in that 10.36 race. His 2nd fastest race was 10.63 with a 4.1 wind. His others were mostly high 10.8's to 11.6's. That, plus every other guy in the race absolutely crushing their other best times, pretty much tells we the wind was blowing real heavy behind their backs.

Compared to what other elite guys are running, I don't really see him as a prospect at all.Edited by: Osgood Fan
 
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I wasn't aware of that. Athletic.net looked pretty legit to me. At any rate, I still believe that a 17 year old (I'm assuming based on year in school) that can hit 10.36 naturally should be able to, with everything in line, go sub 10 in his prime.


*Sorry about the blank post that came before this. I'm still getting used to the layout of the forum.
 
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Thanks for the heads up, jack.
I'll be interested to see where he goes to school. I think many people wrongly downplay the importance of things like coaching and training in sprinting. It's as if they assume because its a basic test of athleticism that you just go out and do it...that there is no way to improve.

Of course, genetics are key but he's shown he's got great genetics. Proper training could be the difference between realizing his potential or never even improving this time. The difference in quality of coaching (and knowledge of and access to PEDs) between the top track programs and some small unknown school is probably monumental.

Does anyone know if he's being recruited to run?
*BTW, I'm not condoning the use of PEDs but it seems to be the reality of sprint competition.
 

jaxvid

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Osgood Fan said:
Actually, he's 19th. Athletic.net doesn't maintain a very comprehensive list. Dyestat.com covers more high school meets than any other site on the net that I know about.

Also, the wind gauge wasn't working in that 10.36 race. His 2nd fastest race was 10.63 with a 4.1 wind. His others were mostly high 10.8's to 11.6's. That, plus every other guy in the race absolutely crushing their other best times, pretty much tells we the wind was blowing real heavy behind their backs.

Compared to what other elite guys are running, I don't really see him as a prospect at all.

What a surprise! Osgood_fan popping up to find fault with a white athlete. Thanks Osgood! Otherwise we'd think the kid was good and would cheer him on but because of your keen insight we now know he's not a prospect at all, and it was all phony and contrived. Way to keep the spirit of castefooball alive!!!!
 

ToughJ.Riggins

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Some interesting speed info. Jordy Nelson won the Kansas h.s 100 meter finals with a 10.63. Jake Sharp ran a 10.4x during a h.s meet in Kansas and with hype from that was expected to win the finals that year but finished second. Jeffrey Demps broke the previous U.S h.s record of 10.08 with his 10.01 this year. This was a very fast year for sure. Most years I would say the fastest black guy runs a low 10.1x in h.s. Trindon Holliday is the fastest Division IA football player recently and he never broke 10 seconds in the 100 meter the white record. His personal record is 10.01.

I have noticed the gap is narrower racially in h.s before rampant PED use kicks in. Therefore, I still believe that steroids work better on blacks than whites genetically for speed training from looking at how whites were a little more competitive in Olympic short track from the 1960s until the late 1980s. But still; there is a gap in h.s 100 meter results and if that is what Osgood fan wants to convey fine...But the spirit of caste football is to also compliment white athletes and I have seen little of that from Osgoodfan so far.

My point is that there are whites that measure up in football speed for RB, WR and CB and that would be measured in 10, 20 & 30 yard burst in pads. We are behind blacks just a little in the 40 yard dash when you fairly look at positions like Safety where whites have played without bulking up more than blacks. The difference in 40 yard speed between a white and black NFL safety is absolutely less than .1 seconds or 0.9 yards over that distance (within diving distance).. But how often on a play does WR run 40 yards straight down the field. With 11 defenders on the field it is a game of angles.

In other agility drills measuring cutting and change of direction ability, vertical jumping etc. whites are on par with their black peers and most of the top squat lifting results are from whites showing a strength advantage. I have said this many times and I will say it one more time; in our 67% white country; I believe every position except CB should be a white majority position and that the NFL should be 70-75% white and no more than 25% black in our 13% black country.

So Osgood fan tell me the racial demographics of what you think the NFL should be. If you think the status quo is correct than you shouldn't be here.Edited by: ToughJ.Riggins
 

Observer

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Osgood Fan said:
Compared to what other elite guys are running, I don't really see him as a prospect at all.

Making the wrong comparison. Normalizing this to maturation rates, Blanshan's time should instead be compared with the times of black freshman and sophomores.
 

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I think we have to keep in mind that there are over 100 Division 1A track programs in the country. Each program recruits 2 or more sprinters every year. If a kid can run under 10.7 consistently, he would rank in the top 100 sprinters nationwide and should be given the opportunity to run for a D1 program. When you consider the number of top HS sprinters that are also blue chip football recruits, the pool of top HS sprinters is even smaller. There is no reason that this kid shouldn't get a track scholarship with his HS performances.

Once a kid gets into college, it is really difficult to predict what they do. There was a kid, Colt Davis, from Texas a couple of years ago who was a state champion sprinter, went to Arkansas, ran one season, and hasn't been heard from since. Others such as JT Scheuerman, dominated HS track, but haven't improved since.

Edited by: SteveB
 
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To Riggins; I think you're kind of missing the point on PED use "widening the racial gap". I don't think that knowledge of and access to PEDs is common at all schools (even many D1 schools). It seems that there are a few (maybe 10 or less) elite sprinting programs that really dedicate their resources to being the best and have facilities, coaches, etc. that are head and shoulders above the rest. Remember, track isn't the cash cow that football is. I think there are some pretty big schools with questionable commitments to their track programs. Ever notice how many of the country's top sprinters come from Florida State, Baylor, etc.? Of course, they may just be recruiting the top sprinters out of HS but, it seems unlikely that such a small number of schools would have such a monopoly on such a high percentage of elite sprinters if there wasn't something remarkable about their program. I think this could explain the widening gap post-HS rather than a different physiological response to PEDs.

In short, one important truth about steroids is "the rich get richer". Genetically gifted people respond better to steroids than the not so gifted. Those who naturally have a great number of androgen receptors (thus respond favorably even to natural conditions) are able to absorb the exogenous hormones more effeciently and get a greater effect. To suggest that blacks respond better to steroids is to suggest that they have genetic advantages in the first place. I don't believe this, especially in light of what we know about the white man's muscle mass and apparent strength, power, advantages over blacks.
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I also think its wrong to assume that guys like Craig Pickering, Blanshan, etc. are the most gifted whites out there.  I'm convinced that the stereotypes and social conditioning about whites and sprinting has prevented so many whites from even attempting the short sprints that we're not getting an accurate sample of white sprinting ability.  This is similar to, several years ago, assuming that Peter McNeely and Andrew Golota were the creme de la creme of white fighters.  Of course, the reality was that the Klitchko types weren't fighting against the American pros and the potential Pavlik types were so brow-beaten with ideas of inferiority that they never even got in the ring.  Now, we have a better idea about what a great white fighter looks like.  So too, I don't think we've even seen the most gifted sprinters yet.  You just can't compare the best white sprinters to the best black sprinters until we actually know who the best white sprinters are.  The fact that white sprint times haven't even improved in so many years seems to be extremetly strong evidence that the best potential sprinters just aren't pursuing it.  No disrespect to Pickering, Blanshan or the others.  Obvisously they are elite athletes and only the very best of any race can outdo them.  I hope they all realize their potential.  To SteveB; It's curious why some sprinters just seem to peak early.  Maybe they got distracted and never pushed their limits or maybe they just matured unusually early and had already hit their limit.    
Edited by: Latspread
 

Observer

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Latspread said:
Those who naturally have a great number of androgen receptors (thus respond favorably even to natural conditions) are able to absorb the exogenous hormones more effeciently and get a greater effect.  To suggest that blacks respond better to steroids is to suggest that they have genetic advantages in the first place.  I don't believe this, especially in light of what we know about the white man's muscle mass and apparent strength, power, advantages over blacks.

I think both you and Riggins have valid points. Moreover, these points are not necessarily contradictory as may first appear.
I agree with what you say about studies of white muscle mass. However, I also agree that steroids are more effective on blacks IF WE LOOK ONLY AT SHORT-TIME MEASUREMENTS. If we look at an activity that requires great strength over a prolonged time period, then the white athlete clearly has the advantage. The reconciling factor is lung capacity and oxygen utilization.

White people have bigger lungs and a better CO2 sensitivity than blacks. This not only helps in aerobic activities, but also in recovery. PEDs help the black body in recovery, as they also do the white. Whereas without PEDs the black could do, for instance, X minutes of hard training, while the white could do X+10. With PEDs, the black can now recovery from X+20 minutes, while the white can now recover from X+20+10. The net result is that the white person ends up not only building strength, but somewhat inadvertently building endurance. These sayings of "high motor", "big heart", "overachiever" have a basis in physiology.

Here is one reference to the differences in oxygen utilization:


Lungs and Race
 
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jaxvid said:
What a surprise! Osgood_fan popping up to find fault with a white athlete. Thanks Osgood! Otherwise we'd think the kid was good and would cheer him on but because of your keen insight we now know he's not a prospect at all, and it was all phony and contrived. Way to keep the spirit of castefooball alive!!!!

Okay, I think I now understand what this board is about. Groupthink is paramount, and independent reasoning, and objectivity is frowned upon. As the #2 guy and moderator on the board, I assume it's your job to enforce these rules and regulations.

Therefore, I guess I agree with the original poster. Blanshan's a legit 10.36 guy, he's the #1 ranked sprinter in the country, and an Olympic gold is right in his proverbial crosshairs.

Guess I learned my lesson for being a meticulous number-cruncher, and stickler for accuracy! That renders one persona non grata in these neck o' the woods!
 

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Osgood Fan said:
Also, the wind gauge wasn't working in that 10.36 race...That, plus every other guy in the race absolutely crushing their other best times, pretty much tells we the wind was blowing real heavy behind their backs.

What were the other times in that race? I saw mention that the 4th place guy ran something like 11.6, but I did not see any other results.
 
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ToughJ.Riggins said:
I have said this many times and I will say it one more time; in our 67% white country; I believe every position except CB should be a white majority position and that the NFL should be 70-75% white and no more than 25% black in our 13% black country.

So Osgood fan tell me the racial demographics of what you think the NFL should be. If you think the status quo is correct than you shouldn't be here.

I think quota systems deliniated along racial lines are wrong, regardless of the industry. I believe in the 'cream rises to the top' philosphy regardless of the respective races. If that results in a 100% white league, then so be it. If it results in a 100% black league, then so be it. If the percentages fall anywhere in between, so be it. I don't want to see the NHL 13% black and 4% asian simply to fulfill some artificial racial quota.

Living in Detroit, my Red Wing championship team was 100% white. Were local blacks, arabs, and hispanics crestfallen at this dynamic, or were they happy the Cup came home? No one could care less about the racial demographics of the team.

I guess this all goes back to what I said in the McGuffie thread. I just don't have that fanatical attachment to athletes. I just sit back, crack a beer, enjoy game, then hot stove league about it online.. totally bereft of emotion and feeling for the participants.Edited by: Osgood Fan
 

white is right

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I tend to agree with you, but when I see the United States fielding extremely skewed teams or individual athletes for competitions and then having their "best" lose to whites from other countries. It makes me wonder why there are no white participants from the US. Maybe that makes me different..
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jaxvid

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Osgood Fan said:
ToughJ.Riggins said:
I have said this many times and I will say it one more time; in our 67% white country; I believe every position except CB should be a white majority position and that the NFL should be 70-75% white and no more than 25% black in our 13% black country.

So Osgood fan tell me the racial demographics of what you think the NFL should be. If you think the status quo is correct than you shouldn't be here.

I think quota systems deliniated along racial lines are wrong, regardless of the industry. I believe in the 'cream rises to the top' philosphy regardless of the respective races. If that results in a 100% white league, then so be it. If it results in a 100% black league, then so be it. If the percentages fall anywhere in between, so be it. I don't want to see the NHL 13% black and 4% asian simply to fulfill some artificial racial quota.

Living in Detroit, my Red Wing championship team was 100% white. Were local blacks, arabs, and hispanics crestfallen at this dynamic, or were they happy the Cup came home? No one could care less about the racial demographics of the team.

I guess this all goes back to what I said in the McGuffie thread. I just don't have that fanatical attachment to athletes. I just sit back, crack a beer, enjoy game, then hot stove league about it online.. totally bereft of emotion and feeling for the participants.

Well you didn't answer the question.

And you don't have a fanatical attachment to athletes, but this site is all about devotion to a group of athletes--white ones. We are not bereft of emotion and feeling, on the contrary we support with great emotion and feeling those athletes we consider "our people".

Your belief that the "cream rises to the top" is either naive or disingenuous. Each and every decision on a position in professional sports is based on the personal opinions of the people running the team. I suppose the Detroit Lions are an example of the "cream rising to the top"!!! Attitudes and agenda are involved in all player selection. You should know that. If you don't--now you do.

As for blacks, arabs, and hispanics, happy that the Red Wings won the cup I'm sure all 3 of them were.
 
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Observer, interesting find but even if your hypothesis is true I still don't see how white advantage in endurance begets white disadvantage in short sprinting. Are you suggesting that PEDs allow blacks to make up more ground in strength rather than endurance on whites? If so, we get back to what I originally said about how steroids work.

Further, I have doubts about that book generally. I think many, even on this board, accept the idea that blacks have longer limbs but I'd need to see the studies before I bought that assumption. Did these studies that show blacks have longer limbs (if they exist) account for the genetic diversity among the white race (or black race for that matter)? For example, did they measure Brits only or did they measure Slovenians; maybe admixtures of Scandinavians and Slavs or were other "whites" used as a sample. I think its wrong to assume that all "white" ethnicities have the same genetic makeup. I don't believe studies, to this point, that deal with race have addressed this issue. All whites are lumped together as if of identical genetic stock. Same with blacks. Look how different the Kenyans are from other blacks (Sub-Saharan Africa?). I don't think anybody would accuse the bony people of Obama's stock of possessing the physical horse power to sprint at a high level. These are the ones running marathon type events instead.
 

white lightning

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Good post Latspread. I have argued for many years that we haven't seen even the tip of the iceburg when it comes to white sprinters. We agree on the society and it's influence on young white athletes. They are pushed into certain positions. It is also the fact that whites go into a world of multiple sports. From Rugby, to Lacrosse, hockey, baseball, tennis, football, volleyball, etc. Then alot of other whites who might be just as athletic pursue academics or music instead of focusing on individual sports like alot of blacks do. How many sports do blacks dominate, I would say around 2 or 3 at the most. That is also an artificial domination in my opinion with the exception of sprinting.


Imagine if whites fell in love with sprinting like they do with baseball, tennis, or other sports. If we had thousands of white kids live to run like they do in Jamaica. You would see a huge difference in times and results. We can compete with out a doubt in my mind. We just don't have the numbers to do so at the moment. I don't know if we ever will unless track becomes alot more popular and there is more of a chance to make alot of money like football, basketball and baseball.


For the record, I still stand by my assertion that Pickering will go sub 10! He will be the first. Michael LeBlanc could possibly in a few years if he can get healthy. After that my next two high probabilities are Shane Crawford and Christophe Lemaitre. Crawford has already run a 10.33 and Lemaitre has scorched to a 10.26. They are just kids with immense talent and alot of upside!Edited by: white lightning
 

Observer

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I think your criticisms are valid. Generalizations have their purpose, but also their limitations.

I have seen a number of studies differentiating east and west Africans, but I don't recall anything similar differentiating Caucasians (other than that the European-specific gene pool is thought to have originated with about 100 individuals). White people are spread out over a large region historically, and so it would seem reasonable to think there might be significant physical differences.

Latspread said:
I still don't see how white advantage in endurance begets white disadvantage in short sprinting.

The human system cannot optimize both endurance and short sprinting simultaneously. There is a trade-off. Caucasians tend to adapt better to training, while west Africans just don't develop stamina as well. The Caucasian and his many receptors will develop lots of muscle --- but it will be muscle that is adapted to the kind of training he is doing --- and some of this will be endurance muscle rather than sprint muscle. The Caucasian may develop more total muscle, but perhaps less sprint muscle. The west African simply can't develop endurance muscle, and so all of his development goes to what is left by default.

Conventional sprint training requires a fair amount of endurance. My guess is that this kind of training tends to stimulate more endurance muscles in the Caucasian (and he thus ends up as a 400 or 800m guy rather than a 100m), while the west African just does not develop a similar endurance. Adjusting training methods could change the situation so that the Caucasian does not inadvertently become a distance runner with the strength of a gorilla. This would require short very intense activity, like plyometrics. The downside is that injury is more likely.

Black people (whether African or in other locations) have bodies that are made to dissipate heat, and thus tend to have long limbs and non-deep chests. Northern Europeans (or peoples in other cool regions) would tend to be somewhat the opposite. The large lungs tend to be encased in large muscular torsos, and thus make a lot of weight to carry.


Long limbs in themselves are not necessarily advantageous unless there is strength to power them. Even if there is strength, the long limb will make for less quickness, while the proportionately small lungs will make for less endurance. However, somewhere in-between the lack of quickness and lack of endurance, the person with long limbs and good strength (whether via PEDs or otherwise) has a good possibility to be a fast runner.

Some of the very best sprinters were definitely not long-limbed. Michael Johnson and Maurice Greene come to mind. The most important asset of a race horse is its chest/lungs and trunk.

I admit that most of these generalizations are based more on wildlife studies than human populations. But even if human beings follow these physical patterns, then you make a good point in that Caucasians live in many different regions, and thus it would seem reasonable to expect that there are many different body types.Edited by: Observer
 

Observer

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Latspread, I forgot to ask about the receptors: is that also the case for HGH? Or just steroids?
 

white lightning

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One more thing on Christophe Lemaitre. I just read an interview with the kid from a few years ago. He didn't start sprinting until September of 2005! So in only 2 1/2 years time, he has went from the high 11's to a 10.26 with very little training. He also has run a 20.83 in the deuce at only 18 years of age. This kid is long, lean and very raw. If he gets the proper training, and puts on some serious muscle, the sky is the limit. I had no idea has barely run for a couple of years.


What a raw talent. He loves athletics and is committed to get to the top. We need to really keep on eye on this teenager. What a talent for the future!
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white lightning, I don't even think sprinting has to become like the mainstream team sports to get whites participating. The short sprints (at least at the high levels) are very prestigious and someone who can win a gold medal/break a world record will get all of the acclaim and money they could get anywhere else. I think disproving stereotypes will be sufficient in getting whites back out there. Obviously that, in and of itself, is extremely ambitious. Sites like this are a great starting point but I think ultimately somebody (perhaps a group of individuals) may have to start development camps and outreach programs that specifically target whites. I don't think we can rely on the public schools to address the issue of negative white stereotypes.
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Imagine how many potential white athletes are bewildered in some rural Appalachian nowhere without access to coaches or even a track or proper running shoes. Of course, millions more are hardly better off in urban/suburban school systems that pigeonhole them from the start.

Great to hear about Lemaitre!
 
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Observer, HGH is not an androgen so it's effectiveness probably does not depend on the number of androgen receptors available. But there does seem to be a great disparity between the results of different people who take it that favors those who were athletic to begin with. I'm not sure if anybody understands this completely.
 
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