Wladimir Klitschko - Mariusz Wach, Nov 10, 2012

FootballDad

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Charles Martel

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True, but can he be any worse than the black "tin cans" that they've been lining up for the Klitschkos?
Exactly.

Wach is 27-0 and has an extensive amateur background. He's strong and durable, never having been knocked down either as a pro or amateur.

He's clearly a better opponent than the likes of Thompson and Mormeck.
 

white is right

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Exactly.

Wach is 27-0 and has an extensive amateur background. He's strong and durable, never having been knocked down either as a pro or amateur.

He's clearly a better opponent than the likes of Thompson and Mormeck.
Thompson and Mormeck were for all intensive purposes there for a pay cheque. Wach is there to try and win. The problem is his management has to gamble on taking on more dangerous opponents for short money or take this fight. They chose to take the low 7 figure cheque.
 

werewolf

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Thompson and Mormeck were for all intensive purposes there for a pay cheque. Wach is there to try and win....



I like Wach, but that remains to be seen. A lot of guys think they're going in there with the Klitschkos to win, but then once they're actually in there they go into survival mode - or just faint dead away in round one, like Solis, or their knees turn to jelly like Haye.
 
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werewolf

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Stupid staring stuff. It looks llike they're playing that game we played when we were kids, staring at each other and the first one who laughs loses.
 

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Stupid staring stuff. It looks llike they're playing that game we played when we were kids, staring at each other and the first one who laughs loses.

It's primal, no doubt. But Vladimir is clearly the more confident fighter. Wach looked shaken. Pretty amazing when you consider there was virtually no chance of violence taking place and that, further, Wach is an elite professional boxer used to being physically assaulted.

It all has to do with pride. And being humiliated as the weaker man. Because the consequences of this are much graver than being physically harmed. In ancient times they are breeding rights to the more desirable and fecund women. In other words, life and continuance itself. This is deep in our genes. Our minds can't reason it away.
 

werewolf

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Personally I don't think that stoopid crap means a damn thing, Gibbon. Some cultures and some people like staring into other mens' eyes and standing close to other men, and some cultures and some people don't, and some kids were good at the staring-laughing game and some weren't. I think it's just some more low show biz junk that the crap that runs boxing is forcing the athletes to do to try to put more asses in seats.
 

Westside

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Wlad is going to play lumberjack. He is going to chop down Wach relatively quick. At the end a loud thump hitting the canvas, sort of like a huge red tree falling into the forest floor.
 

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I tried to watch the whole staredown...but I had to look away...I just couldn't keep watching...I guess that means I'm too weak...I just feel so...so whimpy now...
 

white lightning

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I always hate to see two good white boxers fight each other but I am like usual fully supporting Wlad. Vitali and Wladimir Klitschko are the two greatest heavyweights to ever grace the planet earth. I love seeing them continue to add victories to thier already hall of fame legacy. Sorry but no Ali, your not even close to the greatest. I can't wait to see this fight. Come on Wlad. Get another big k.o.
 

The Hock

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Wach sure has a long jaw and pointy chin. I think one good Vlad left hook that Wach doesn't see coming will do the job. And break his jaw in the process.
 

white is right

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I always hate to see two good white boxers fight each other but I am like usual fully supporting Wlad.

+100

Agree with your point fully. I generally prefer to see white boxers move up the rankings by defeating Negroes. However, its impossible to always be doing that and at times, whites have to be matched against other whites.

I felt a similar discomfort in the Proksa/Golovkin, and recent Bute/Grachev fights. Fights where I support both athletes and the truth is it sucks to see anyone in those fights lose. I felt particularly bad for Proksa because he could have beaten a lot of other guys in the division, and he fought Golovkin who is just a destroyer. Had Proksa been matched better he could have been a lot more successful.

In this fight, I support both athletes, but I will have to support Wlad more due to his title reign, longevity, and the fact Im a huge Wlad fan.

No disrespect to Wach though, hopefully he takes this as a "good loss" similar to Grachev VS Bute.

Wlad should win this fight easily by KO, say around rounds 4-8.

However, I have a strange "gut feeling" that Wach due to his size, strength, may be able to pose some problems and I could see some shaky spots in the fight for Wlad. Ultimately I do think this fight only has one ending though (that is, Wach KO'd).

The best possible solution in this fight is a Wlad KO win, in a fight where Wach gives a brave and fighting account of himself.
 
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whiteathlete33

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Wladimir is going to destroy Wach. I feel it will be similar to the second fight with Tony Thompson. Wach leaves himself open too much and stepping up to fight Klitschko is a few levels above anyone he has ever fought. It's a nice payday for him and a chance to get some recognition.
 

white is right

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Wladimir is going to destroy Wach. I feel it will be similar to the second fight with Tony Thompson. Wach leaves himself open too much and stepping up to fight Klitschko is a few levels above anyone he has ever fought. It's a nice payday for him and a chance to get some recognition.
I actually think it could be worse similar to Wlad's fight with the "Rainman". I don't think Wach is going to be in a shell trying to go the distance in the first round or two, but class and experience should tell.
 

Gibbon

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Personally I don't think that stoopid crap means a damn thing, Gibbon. Some cultures and some people like staring into other mens' eyes and standing close to other men, and some cultures and some people don't, and some kids were good at the staring-laughing game and some weren't. I think it's just some more low show biz junk that the crap that runs boxing is forcing the athletes to do to try to put more asses in seats.

Well, it's easy for me to say it is meaningful in this instance because Vladimir also happens to be the heavily favored fighter. And maybe people can put too much meaning in the posture/body language of an athlete. Nevertheless, I think you can often read whether or not an athlete is poised to succeed or fail based on how they hold themselves. For instance, getting a glimpse of a field goal kicker's face/body language before a critical long kick is often revealing. Confidence is critical to success and its often readable.

In fact, confidence is one of the primary reasons blacks hold an edge in many sports nowadays. Whites, especially American whites, are cowed by blacks by in large. This even relates to their worshipfulness of blacks as fans.

Certainly this ritual is preformed to promote the fight. But this is, in many ways, a barbaric sport, not infrequently leaving its participants with permanent brain damage and considered by many as vulgar (except when it is promoting black civil rights) so it seems to fit the spirit of the sport well, IMHO.
 
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In fact, confidence is one of the primary reasons blacks hold an edge in many sports nowadays. Whites, especially American whites, are cowed by blacks by in large. This even relates to their worshipfulness of blacks as fans.

Yes, I agree that mentality and confidence goes a long way in explaining performance in sports.

Ive been a diehard boxing fan for my entire life (I'm 24), so I'm well versed in boxing from say, year 2000 onwards to today, I know pretty much everything about the sport. And I can tell you with certainty that European boxers are absolutely not intimidated by blacks.

I can recall literally hundreds, probably thousands of occasions Ive seen of Europeans knocking out Negroes from the States. American Negroes getting destroyed and knocked out is actually a regular fixture on many German and Russian boxing cards.

The success of European fighters in the past ten years, I would say is unparalleled by any other racial group in boxing. No one race dominates boxing, but the race with the biggest share, especially from 2006 onwards to today is definitely EUROPEANS.

Unfortunately, the success of European whites is not even close to being met by American whites. No doubt, mentality, confidence, false media portrayal of race and athletic ability can largely explain that.

Another factor to explain nonsuccess of American whites in boxing is mismanagement, and having fewer options than blacks. The very few white Americans who achieve some level of success (ie Kelly Pavlik, Jason Litzau) always take the *hard road*. The truth is that matchmaking and management early in a fighter's career has a monumental impact on his future standing. American whites are greatly disadvantaged there and often have to work much harder to make it in boxing than American blacks or Hispanics.

You build a fighter up to success, it doesn't just happen overnight. That sort of foundation is simply not available to many white boxers in the USA.

Certainly this ritual is preformed to promote the fight. But this is, in many ways, a barbaric sport, not infrequently leaving its participants with permanent brain damage and considered by many as vulgar (except when it is promoting black civil rights) so it seems to fit the spirit of the sport well, IMHO.

Yes, the staredown is a ritual that accompanies all title fights and big fights. Personally I like it as it gives some added entertainment in hyping up a fight. Primitive? Yes. But also entertaining. I mean, if you want something softer someone can always watch another sport.

One more comment to you: Ive been watching boxing for about 15 years religiously. I would say that a staredown usually means NOTHING towards a fight. Its to entertain and hype a fight, that's all. These guys are professionals, and it's not good to read into "body language" of a staredown or weighin.

I remember when Joe Calzaghe dominated hyped up Negro Jeff Lacy. Calzaghe looked horrible at the staredown and weighin, but when it came fight time, he was superb. Ive seen this often times. Similarily, Ive seen guys look super confident at the weighin, only to get destroyed in the fight (Ricky Hatton against Floyd Mayweather comes to mind, Dereck Chisora losing to Vitali also comes to mind).

Dont read a lot into body language at a staredown, it means nothing.
 
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A small comment before today's fight:

LETS GO WLAD!!!

Saw him at the weigh in yesterday and he looked in phenomenal shape. I don't think there's ever been a heavyweight champ who is consistently in as good of shape as Wlad.
 

Liverlips

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Wlad looks like he is carved out of marble. Truly a superior physical specimen.
 
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