Still Dominating

Discussion in 'Soccer' started by McGuffie, Jan 23, 2009.

  1. McGuffie

    McGuffie Newbie

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    Soccer is still a bright spot for us in terms of the racial make up of the top players. Here's a look at the 2008 team of the year as voted by the fans. All are white. This almost brought a tear to my eye.

    uefa.com users' Team of the Year 2008:
    Iker Casillas (Real Madrid CF & Spain); Sergio Ramos (Real Madrid CF & Spain), John Terry (Chelsea FC & England), Carles Puyol (FC Barcelona & Spain), Philipp Lahm (FC Bayern München & Germany); Cristiano Ronaldo (Manchester United FC & Portugal), Xavi Hernández (FC Barcelona & Spain), Cesc Fàbregas (Arsenal FC & Spain), Franck Ribéry (FC Bayern München & France); Lionel Messi (FC Barcelona), Fernando Torres (Liverpool FC & Spain). Sir Alex Ferguson (Manchester United FC)
     
  2. Solomon Kane

    Solomon Kane Mentor

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    great news
     
  3. Karl Baxter

    Karl Baxter Guru

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    What I'd like to see is a match between the best White and the best Black team. I'd sell my house and bet it on the result.
     
  4. Liverlips

    Liverlips Hall of Famer

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    Well, we almost see this anytime we have France (almost all black) play Italy, Germany or Spain (all white).

    Our guys usually win just like in boxing, wrestling, MMA, international basketball ...etc.
     
  5. Europe

    Europe Mentor

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    Unforntunately, Italy may have a black on their team soon. Balotelli may make the team some day.I saw a black player on Germany a few years ago. And Senna on Spain is black. He is a Brazilian that got a Spanish passport


    Somebody mentioned in aother thread how Jewish people seem to like black players. Stephen Cohen on Fox soccer channel is one that does. He loves the African Cup of Nations. He said that the African players have added so much to the English League. He also said the one good thing about the French league is that it is a good training ground for African Players. I thought the French league was supposed to be for FRENCH players? I mean REAL FRENCH players not Senegales or Moroccons living in France.


    I used to be brainwashed and I thought that some foreign players should be allowed to play in leagues. Now I think NONE should. It will never happen , but there should be strict limits.
     
  6. Jimmy Chitwood

    Jimmy Chitwood Hall of Famer

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    i know there are a few footballers with near-world class speed, but not being familiar with enough of what's going on in the football world across the pond i have a question for Europe and Karl Baxter (who i feel are very knowledgable soccer folks):

    who are the footballers with the best pace playing right now?

    (translated for us Yanks, that would read: who are the fastest soccer players in the world? [​IMG] )
     
  7. Europe

    Europe Mentor

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    It's hard to say who the fastest is. They don't have something like 40 times in soccer. I wish they did. From what I have seen I think Christiano Ronaldio could be the fastest. He would be up there. Torres and Rooney seem very fast. Theo Walcott of Arsenal who looks half black and half white is extremely fast. Michael Owen may have lost a step with injury, but he was very fast. There was a journalist who was talking about Owen andhesaw him run right by Sol Campbell, a black English International, who was very fast in his own right. Messi from Argentina and Barcelona fc is very fast with the ball at his feet. which is what counts the most. Giggs of Man United I think was very fast in hisprime. He has some black in him, but looks white.Essien, an African playing for chelsea, is very fast. Aaron Lennon who is mixed race is very quick. Kaka is very fast. One guy might be a guy in a race, but the other guy may be faster with the ball.Ashley Young , a black at Aston Villa, is very fast. Agbonlahor, mixed race, is very fast. Karl may have is own list. I am most familiar with England,


    top 10 in England


    http://www.skysports.com/whoisthefastest/index.html


    Owen


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKg4C0rTWUM


    Walcott


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uAiyAMU9HBM


    giggs


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3GxhYklM_3M


    rooney


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OGunyE63_io
     
  8. Europe

    Europe Mentor

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    In the first link that says top 10 in the above post, you have to click on head to head to get the list..
     
  9. Karl Baxter

    Karl Baxter Guru

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    Thanks for the praise. The ego always needs a bit of that...

    Black pace on the soccer pitch is not as impressive as on the running track, because the flat running track simulates the hard, baked earth of Africa. The soccer pitch doesn't. The softer the going the greater the White advantage over Blacks. This rule also applies to bumpy ground and steep ground.

    It's also true that having a ball at one's feet tends to complicate things for Blacks more than for Whites. Most fast Black strikers depend on crosses or short bursts with the ball. This is also why a lot of fast Black players prefer to play in defense. They do better on speed-to-the-ball than speed-on-the-ball, which I think is the main test of speed in soccer. Then there's also the intermediate skill of kick-and-chase.

    I'd say that the fastest White players are Ronaldo, Torres, Bentley, Andy Johnson, and Owen (now slowing down). Rooney is also surprisingly fast for a big fella.

    I also think a lot of White speed gets hidden by the superior passing and reading skills of White players. What need is there to dash 50 yards across the pitch when you can just pass the ball with pinpoint accuracy or when you've read the other team's attack and are in an ideal position to break it up?

    The fastest non-Whites seem to be Lennon, Agbonlahor, and Walcott (mulattos), and Obafemi Martins, Adebayor, Gael Clichy, and Ashley Young, (Blacks). Although sometimes their speed is put to ludicrous effect when they come steaming through on the occasional open goal only to punt it into the stands, or completely ignore a team mate in an excellent scoring position to selfishly squander the ball.

    If you look at the Euro leagues, then there are a whole bunch of other mainly White players to also consider. Messi, Kaka and Dennis Rommedahl are all very fast to my knowledge.

    In order to sell more shoes, Nike put together a speed test sometime last year. At that time they ranked the top ten fastest Premier league players as follows (race added by me):

    The sprint parade top 10, commissioned by Nike and put together by Opta Sportsdata, is as follows (the first figure is to the ball, the second with it):

    1. Cristiano Ronaldo (White): 20.9mph -- 20.8mph
    2. Andrew Johnson (White): 20.6 -- 20.7
    3. Fernando Torres (White): 20.5 -- 20.6
    4. Kenwyne Jones (Black): 20.7 -- 20.2
    5. Ashley Young (Black): 20.4 -- 20.3
    6. Aaron Lennon (Mulatto): 20.6 -- 19.6
    7. Cameron Jerome (Black): 20.3 -- 20.1
    8. Shaun Wright-Phillips (Black): 18.9 -- 21.2
    9. Jermain Defoe (Black): 20.4 -- 19.2
    10. David Bentley (White): 20.0 -- 19.8

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-514146/Who -fastest-footballer-Premier-League--Ronaldo-Lennon-AJ-Find-h ere.html
    Edited by: Karl Baxter
     
  10. Europe

    Europe Mentor

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    It is interesting that Bentley is in there because the announcers always say he is not that fast. They always say he can't beat people one on one.The white must be blinding them


    It is interesting that the teams don't do any timing like the NFL, unless they keep is private,because there is a lot more running in soccer than football. Look at all the excellent midfieders that are not that fast--Scholes, Carrick, Lampard, Ballack, Alonso,Barry , Fabregasto name a few. These are players with very good ball control and passing ability. They are soccer players not just athletes like some of the black players. Some people consider Gerrard the best midfielder in the world even though he is not the fastest.


    I am surprised Walcott wasn't in the Nike top 10. Did he participate? Or maybe he doesn't wear Nike shoes.
     
  11. Jimmy Chitwood

    Jimmy Chitwood Hall of Famer

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    thanks for dropping the knowledge on me, gentlemen! [​IMG]

    i am surprised, though, that there weren't any lesser-known players to make the lists... does that have any significance at all? or does speed really separate the wheat from the chaff?

    i seem to remember seeing a photo of a young German player who outran German sprinter Christian Blum or Dariusz Kuc (who have both run a 10.2 100-meters i seem to recall) in a head-to-head after a practice, but i didn't see any German's named. any idea who he is?

    also, there was a striker a couple years back (i believe he was from a former Soviet Union satellite nation though that might be WAY off) who reportedly ran a low-10.2 100-meters. i can't recall his name for the life of me now, though. Edited by: Jimmy Chitwood
     
  12. Karl Baxter

    Karl Baxter Guru

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    Like a lot of things, this has to do with perception and presentation. A fast black appears on the scene and immediately everyone starts raving about how fast and athletic he is. An equally fast and athletic White player appears and instead they start talking about how well he reads the game and how he's always in the right place (even if he has to scorch a trail in the grass to get there).

    Also White players tend to be more rounded players, so a particular skill like speed doesn't always stand out so much, even when they are faster than all the Blacks on the field.

    A Black player who does nothing else but run around a lot will end up getting a reputation for speed and athleticism even when he's not as fast as more rounded White players.

    This kind of nonsense will only end when we start seeing White sprinters getting on top in the Olympics or when we start objectively measuring and reporting the speeds of soccer players.
     
  13. waterbed

    waterbed Mentor

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    The players that beated Christian Blum in sprinting match on a soccer field were Bjorn Ziegenbein and Nicky Adler.I also play soccer but when my speed was recorded was when I played tennis we once had a km-h thing that recorded the serve's.then the trainer said run acrros you're fast a want to know you're running speed.the thing recorded 35 km/h/1.609344 is 21.7 mph.I was like 14/15 years old.my brother can even run 22.? I think because i am faster on first meters he faster top speed I know from matches on the street we did.but he prefers playing guitar in Rock band over playing sports.
     
  14. Europe

    Europe Mentor

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    [QUOTE

    i am surprised, though, that there weren't any lesser-known players to make the lists... does that have any significance at all? or does speed really separate the wheat from the chaff?


    [/QUOTE]


    I don't think great speed is a prerequisite to be a great player.As karl said ,you can pass the ball faster than someone can run. I think ball control and quickness over about 15-20 yards is more important that a 50 yard sprint, which doesn't happen very often, even when a Premier league team is playing a League 1 team. I heard a commentator the other day state that the difference between a top class player and a good lower division player is that the top class player scores more often when he gets the chance. That is more skill than speed.


    There probably are fast players that aren't big names, but they may not get much playing time. I don't live over there, so I may be missing some. But many top players are not super fast. You can see some in the list I gave---Gerrard,Lampard, Fabregas.These players are not considered super fast., but they are great players.Players like Berbatov, Drogba, Keane, Ibrahimovic, Del Piero are top strikers, but I wouldn't call them fast. So, many of the top players are not fast..


    Gattuso of AC Milan is considered a great tackling midfielder, but again not super fast.


    I didn't really see Zidane play much. I started watching about when he retired,but from what I have seen I don't think he was super fast. He had great skill and had good speed, but I don't think he was ever the fastest guy on the field. Maybe someone who saw him more would like to agree or disagree on that.


    Great goal--skill not speed


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i3ogMVLShjk


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncFxq8qrOeA
     
  15. Jimmy Chitwood

    Jimmy Chitwood Hall of Famer

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    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    wow! incredible goals!
     
  16. waterbed

    waterbed Mentor

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