Steroids and Black Athletes

StarWars

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Blacks look more ripped because they have darker skin. Even DWF's know that. Bodybuiilders will tan so they look more defined along with oils and stuff. I am 8% bodyfat but don't look super wripped because I am sorta pale. The good thing about being white/tan is that your veins show alot, the bad part is the stupid sunscrean before swimming.
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The bodyfat argument is stupid because the elite athletes we aare talking about are probably all at like 5% to 6% bodyfat; black or white or Asian or whatever anyway. Whites are the strongest race, period. Speed is a different story, but we are equal or very close, and much quicker.
 

StarWars

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Bolt Car Crash

Very suspicious with the amount of Jamaicans that have tested positive for steroids in the last couple weeks has been getting close to double digits.

Probably just like Konstantinos kenteris, but who will question the black speedster? Not white people that's for sure.
 
G

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StarWars said:
Very suspicious with the amount of
Jamaicans that have tested positive for steroids in the
last couple weeks has been getting close to double
digits.

Who tested dirty? I haven't read anything about it.Edited by: Gehrig
 

white lightning

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Steroids, weed, alcohol and dancing are all very common. Anyone that has traveled there on vacation can tell you that. Along with poverty and a high crime rate. Alot of people turn their heads the other way when it comes to making money. It is the only way out that some of them can even imagine. WADA needs to really crack down on them. It is not fair to the rest of the world. They rarely test down there. Why would they?
 

StarWars

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Here is a Jamaican athlete who outright denied testing positive:

Jamaican 100m sprinter tests positive

He could either be a scapegoat by the Jamaicans to make it look like they test, or it could be the IAFF. I think the former, and that maybe why he knows nothing of the drug he took, either that or he is a good liar, or both.
 

white is right

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Not a black athlete. But still a big fish got caught. Also Nick Willis was bumped to silver and Mehdi Bala was bumped to bronze. Here is the wire story..

* Sport
* Drugs in sport

1500m gold-medal winner Ramzi named after failing Beijing drug test

- Moroccan-born athlete among six to fail tests for Cera
- Cyclist Rebellin says 'I have nothing to hide'

* Digg it

* guardian.co.uk, Wednesday 29 April 2009 09.15 BST
* Article history

Rashid Ramzi, Bahrain 1500m runner

Bahrain's Rashid Ramzi celebrates as he wins the men's 1500m final at the Beijing Olympics. Photograph: Fabrice Coffrini/AFP/Getty Images

The 1500m gold medallist at the Beijing Olympic Games, Rashid Ramzi, was named by the Bahrain Olympic Committee as having failed a drugs test, along with five other athletes. The committee said Ramzi's "A" sample was opened on 19 February and tested positive, adding that the runner's "B" sample will be tested in France on 8 June and that he will face an IOC hearing the same day.

"The Bahrain Olympic Committee apologises for receiving such news from the International Olympic Committee since it ensured Ramzi went through all the necessary doping tests before the games and they were all negative," the national committee said in a statement.

Ramzi, who used to compete for his native Morocco and still trains there, won Bahrain's first-ever track and field gold medal in Beijing last August. He also won the 800m and 1500m races at the 2005 World Championships in Helsinki.

The Moroccan-born runner won in Beijing with Kenya's Asbel Kiprop, the only runner who could stay with him, taking silver and New Zealand's Nicholas Willis winning bronze. Ramzi, who was 28 at the time, was born in Safi, home of 5,000m Olympic medallist Khalid Boulami and former 3,000m steeplechase world record holder Brahim Boulami. He moved to Bahrain in 2001.

He left his first big mark on the international scene in 2004 when he shaved nine seconds off his personal best and snapped the four-year winning streak of world record holder Hicham El Guerrouj.

The cycling road race silver medallist Davide Rebellin, meanwhile, has denied any wrongdoing after also being named. The International Olympic Committee said yesterday it had discovered seven positive results from re-testing samples taken at last year's Games, stemming from six athletes. The retests produced positive readings for Cera, the new generation of the banned blood-booster erythropoietin (EPO).

After speculation in the Italian media, the Italian Olympic Committee today announced that one of the six was Rebellin, but the cyclist has rejected all allegations against him. "I don't know what may have happened. It is certainly a mistake," said Rebellin. "It is impossible that I tested positive ... I have nothing to hide."

The 37-year-old Rebellin won silver in the Olympic road race in Beijing, and last week won the Walloon Arrow cycling classic in Belgium for the third time. A specialist at long single-day races, Rebellin won the Amstel Gold Race, Walloon Arrow and Liège-Bastogne-Liège in 2004.

Another cyclist, the German Stefan Schumacher, has also tested positive. The German cycling federation said it had passed on the documents of a positive retest to Schumacher, adding: "He can now request the testing of the B sample."

Schumacher was suspended in March by the International Cycling Union (UCI) for two years from all cycling after failing a drugs test for Cera during the 2008 Tour de France. Schumacher, who won the 2008 Tour's two time trials and wore the overall leader's yellow jersey for two days, has repeatedly denied any wrongdoing.

The cyclist claimed the ban had been imposed without any negotiations and without him being able to give his testimony. Schumacher was banned from competing in France for two years by the French Anti-Doping agency (AFLD) in February.

Another athlete to have tested positive for Cera is the Croatian 800m runner Vanja Perisic who finished sixth in her heat in Beijing, according to sources close to the investigation.

Meanwhile, Associated Press reported that it had been informed that the Greek race walker Athanasia Tsoumeleka was the fifth athlete and that the sixth was the Dominican women's weightlifter Yudelkis Contreras, who competed in the 53kg category in Beijing as Yudelkis Maridalin, finishing fifth.

Race walker Tsoumeleka, in fact, announced in January that she had tested positive in the new Beijing checks. Tsoumeleka, who finished ninth in Beijing in the 20k walk, was charged by a Greek prosecutor this month with using banned drugs.

The IOC re-analysed a total of 948 samples from Beijing after new lab tests for Cera and insulin became available following the Olympics. The testing began in January and focused mainly on endurance events in cycling, rowing, swimming and athletics. "The further analysis of the Beijing samples that we conducted should send a clear message that cheats can never assume that they have avoided detection," said Arne Ljungqvist, chairman of the IOC medical commission.

Coaches, athletes and anti-doping organisations welcomed the announcement, saying it helps restore credibility to Olympic sports. "I'm in favour of anything they're doing to clean up the sport," said Glen Mills, coach of the Jamaican sprinter Usain Bolt, who won three gold medals in the 100 metres, 200m and 4x100m relay all in world-record times. Bolt "has not heard anything and he will not hear anything", he added.

The IOC will wait for word from the national Olympic bodies before holding any disciplinary hearings. Athletes found guilty of doping face being disqualified from the Olympics and stripped of any medals they won. The positive findings were based on "A'' sample test results. Athletes will be allowed to ask for a testing of their back-up "B'' samples.

In the meantime, national and international bodies are free to impose provisional suspensions of athletes, the IOC said. It previously disqualified nine athletes for doping at the Olympics. In addition, there were six doping cases involving horses in the equestrian competition, and four athletes have already have medals taken away: the Ukrainian heptathlete Lyudmila Blonska (silver), the Belarusian hammer throwers Vadim Devyatovskiy (silver) and Ivan Tsikhan (bronze) and the North Korean shooter Kim Jong-Su (silver and bronze).

The IOC is storing doping samples for eight years so they can be tested retroactively when new detection methods are developed. The World Anti-Doping Agency (Wada) welcomed the IOC findings. Under the Wada code, athletes can be disciplined up to eight years from the date of a doping violation. "We suggest that athletes who may be tempted to cheat keep this reality in mind," the Wada president, John Fahey, said. "We believe that retrospective testing serves as a strong deterrent."

Lauryn Williams, a member of the US track and field team in Beijing and a 2004 silver medallist in the 100m, also backed the testing system. "To go ahead and weed out the cheaters is a good thing," she said. "To find out there are additional cheaters is not a great thing."
 

StarWars

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I always wondered how genetic mid distance was. White people typically always get medals in the 800 meter or the mile/1500m (Seb Coe!). After 3000 meter we taper off again.

For distance the drug they use is usually EPO which helps transport oxygen to blood more efficiently just like how whales can hold breath longer because of myoglobin instead of hemoglobin. Because long distance is so isolated a sport I don't know much about the drug use but the time frame whites stopped dominating in is close to sprinting I guess. The thing is they train high altitude so even if they aren't that much better they should be winning.
 

ToughJ.Riggins

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Starwars, good article by the way- for the site. But personally I think most of the Americans who are in the Pilot program now, are clean (it's a solid program and America was disgraced by Balco). But the Carribean testing standards are weak and most from those nations are likely cheating. I think American Walter Dix's 9.91 was likely clean in Beijing and you saw Tyson Gay's recent struggles. Dix was in a good lane chasing that Bolt of lightning.

I think the main issue is that elite blacks have a tendency for a "SLIGHT" hamstring muscle advantage IMO. This helps for leg lift and steroids exceed this even more. Also elite blacks- may tend to have slightly less lung capacity, but steroids helps them take on Herculean type training regiments regardless of this.

The other point you make about any fast white guy getting suspected of steroids by many people- where the black is often above suspicion is spot on though, which may make blacks slightly more likely to use-even if they aren't from the Carribean. I don't think blacks are more likely to be cheaters BY NATURE.
 

StarWars

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ToughJ.Riggins said:
I don't think blacks are more likely to be cheaters BY NATURE.

I agree but they are more inclined to only play professional sports where money and media attention is involved. They usually always play for fame or for money, aand the media is more than happy to help them get there.

Tyson Gay is friends with veronica Campbell-Brown by the way. Not to mention without the pulled hamstring he probably would have been in the low 9.6's because at the trials he ran 9.72 before pulling it. So I doubt the legitamacy of the program there. If there were no steroids in the U.S. you would see the same amount of white talent you see at high school doing pro track, or a similar ratio. Tyson Gay only ran a 10.6 in highschool. I guess that is good but compare that to Pickering's 10.2 and you wonder what happens from point A to point B.
 

jaxvid

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StarWars said:
ToughJ.Riggins said:
I don't think blacks are more likely to be cheaters BY NATURE.

I agree but they are more inclined to only play professional sports where money and media attention is involved.

Hmmmm, I don't know if blacks are more inclined to cheat, and I don't really care but I do know that in locations as diverse as Haiti, Detroit, and the jungles of africa, blacks are more likely then any other group of people (not just whites) to kill, rape, and assault. That is undisputable statistical truth.

Why, if this is true, (and it is) would any one assume that blacks would be less likely to cheat "by nature" when "by nature" they are far more likely to commit much more heinious crimes?

Please explain to me the path of logic that procedes one to make that conclusion. I am unable to puzzle out your reasoning and as you both seem to be intelligent people I am worried that there is something I am missing.
 

StarWars

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jaxvid said:
StarWars said:
ToughJ.Riggins said:
I don't think blacks are more likely to be cheaters BY NATURE.

I agree but they are more inclined to only play professional sports where money and media attention is involved.

Hmmmm, I don't know if blacks are more inclined to cheat, and I don't really care but I do know that in locations as diverse as Haiti, Detroit, and the jungles of africa, blacks are more likely then any other group of people (not just whites) to kill, rape, and assault. That is undisputable statistical truth.

Why, if this is true, (and it is) would any one assume that blacks would be less likely to cheat "by nature" when "by nature" they are far more likely to commit much more heinious crimes?

Please explain to me the path of logic that procedes one to make that conclusion. I am unable to puzzle out your reasoning and as you both seem to be intelligent people I am worried that there is something I am missing.

I will admit I have never given much thought to crime rate. I guess I feel that all humans are pragmatic and will steal, rape and kill if they can. For instance in Switzerland the crime rate is low but money crimes are common because there is so much money. Where there is less government and usually blacks humans will rape and kill more on average. This is just my guess though, again, I am 18 and live in a suburb so I have absolutely no clue what I'm talking about for once.

All I know is white values and governments are a good thing taken for granted by most wiggers.
 

ToughJ.Riggins

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jaxvid said:
StarWars said:
ToughJ.Riggins said:
I don't think blacks are more likely to be cheaters BY NATURE.

I agree but they are more inclined to only play professional sports where money and media attention is involved.

Hmmmm, I don't know if blacks are more inclined to cheat, and I don't really care but I do know that in locations as diverse as Haiti, Detroit, and the jungles of africa, blacks are more likely then any other group of people (not just whites) to kill, rape, and assault. That is undisputable statistical truth.

Why, if this is true, (and it is) would any one assume that blacks would be less likely to cheat "by nature" when "by nature" they are far more likely to commit much more heinious crimes?

Please explain to me the path of logic that procedes one to make that conclusion. I am unable to puzzle out your reasoning and as you both seem to be intelligent people I am worried that there is something I am missing.

I won't rehash all my multiple cultural/ vicious cycle arguments since you've heard them. But since you asked, I will say, No ethnic group IMO has BAD NATURE if raised right and given the love and support they need. Blacks may have quick tempers/ have less impulse control on average, but you could say the same for the Irish, especially when they drink. Overall the Irish are my favorite people on earth. We all have our own experiences with groups so I can't fault you or anyone else. Personally, I have encountered lots of black people in my life and NONE did anything vicious to me as individuals.

Sicilians are also stereotyped to have quick tempers and I've heard the stereotype they hold grudges when wronged (don't know if it's true). Native Americans have an alcoholism genetic tendency and many still haven't forgiven the past history with the English settlers. Every group has TENDENCIES for strengths and weaknesses. Reggie White, even said this, but took heat for it.
 

white is right

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jaxvid said:
StarWars said:
ToughJ.Riggins said:
I don't think blacks are more likely to be cheaters BY NATURE.

I agree but they are more inclined to only play professional sports where money and media attention is involved.

Hmmmm, I don't know if blacks are more inclined to cheat, and I don't really care but I do know that in locations as diverse as Haiti, Detroit, and the jungles of africa, blacks are more likely then any other group of people (not just whites) to kill, rape, and assault. That is undisputable statistical truth.

Why, if this is true, (and it is) would any one assume that blacks would be less likely to cheat "by nature" when "by nature" they are far more likely to commit much more heinious crimes?

Please explain to me the path of logic that procedes one to make that conclusion. I am unable to puzzle out your reasoning and as you both seem to be intelligent people I am worried that there is something I am missing.
The Bunko squad is more likely to investigate a Black suspect than a white one(statistically speaking). Even though the stereotype is a Jew or another ethnic group committing these crimes. "Burning down the House" might as well have been wrapped by Biggie Smalls.....
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Edited by: white is right
 

StarWars

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All I know is most of the people that say they don't mind blacks are either hippies who are infatuated by them or whites who moved to the suburbs, or anywhere else colder to get away from them. Very tough issue.
 

jaxvid

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ToughJ.Riggins said:
I won't rehash all my multiple cultural/ vicious cycle arguments since you've heard them. But since you asked, I will say, No ethnic group IMO has BAD NATURE if raised right and given the love and support they need. Blacks may have quick tempers/ have less impulse control on average, but you could say the same for the Irish, especially when they drink. Overall the Irish are my favorite people on earth. We all have our own experiences with groups so I can't fault you or anyone else. Personally, I have encountered lots of black people in my life and NONE did anything vicious to me as individuals.

As I understand "by nature" it is all of the factors that lead to a group behavior. That includes genetic factors and cultural factors. if blacks are a victim of a "vicious cycle" then that is part of their "nature".

When talking about a tendency to cheat on drug tests we were NOT talking about "would blacks and whites be equally likely to cheat if they were raised in an environment of love and care" what we were discussing is what is the likelihood of cheating right now in the real world as it is.

You also brought up the Irish, your favorite people on earth (we thank you) in comparison. However this seems a poor point to make to support your argument. The people and country of Ireland are among the most peaceful and prosporpus on the planet. For example, last year the quick tempered, drinking, Irish had 38 murders in their country which is the same amount as an average month in any US inner city and a weekend's worth in South Africa.

You also mentioned that you have encountered "lots" of black people in your life and none of them did anything vicious. I have also encountered lots of black people in my life and NONE of them have murdered me but that does not change the fact that they are 10 times more likely to do so. Arguing from personal experience is generally not considered an accurate way to make a point.
 

Colonel_Reb

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Experience may not be the most accurate way of making a point, but I've been lied to, stolen from, and treated bad by more blacks than I care to remember. Those experiences have shaped my opinions and behavior. If I ignored them, I'd be a dang fool.

I take exception to the idea that we are all "good natured." We are all of a fallen nature, and when the need arises, we do whatever it takes to take care of no.1. Lying, cheating, stealing, all come natural to man. You have to teach morality, not immorality. A baby throws a fit because he/she wants something, that is natural. Our selfish desires must be tempered in some way, and I don't see much tempering going on in the black community, and not much more seems to be going on in the white community thanks in large part to cultural Marxism.

Jaxvid makes a great point in saying that we need to be aware of the huge differences in the chance of being robbed or killed by blacks over whites. If we don't consider those facts, we are doing ourselves a huge dis-service and taking some big risks.
 

StarWars

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Those are good points, guys. I think we kept that objective and civilized, something the average liberal could not do due to propoganda by the media and schools.

I agree it's not like whites were never on the low end of the food chain at one point, and same with Asians. Blacks are the only ones who have had as much of a crime rate as they have.

Good point we are fallen, as the bible tells us. It is up to us to act with love and respect when it is deserved. I guess being poor reveals who are the better and who are the worse natured people. So tack one more reason to the board of why blacks play pro sports and take steroids...
 

ToughJ.Riggins

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Jaxvid: I do keep in mind to stay away from black neighborhoods here in Jersey. Most of these are poor neighborhoods with gangs and I do agree with you, people should educate themselves to stay away from certain neighborhoods-that is a good point.

However, we should keep in mind that in Canada there is a GROWING number of blacks/ Mulattoes (2.5% of the population is now black in Canada and that doesn't count every mixed race person). 594 murders were committed in 2007 in Canada. This is a significantly lower murder rate per 100,000 people than the U.S- 1.8 per 100,000. Only 31.7 percent of these were committed with guns compared to 68% in the U.S committed with a gun. The murder rate in the U.S was 2.7 times higher in 2007 than Canada- and some recent years this has eclipsed 3 times higher in the U.S. I have read before that the black and also the white Canadian murder rate is significantly lower in Canada than the U.S.

In Ireland 1.1% of the population out of the 4.203 million people is black and 1.1% mixed race and they had a mere 38 murders total according to your statistics. The murder rate was slightly less than 1 per 100,000 people.

Basically my point is this shows that a countries culture/numbers of gangs/drug policies and upbringing/poverty is at least PART of what effects violent crime rates.

On that note-I believe in treating users as addicts for ANY drug for first offense (it should be no more than a misdemeanor for 1st offense). I also believe that Marijuana should be decriminalized. It is also a bad idea to try to get addicts to rat out dealers in plea bargains b/c it can endanger them. According to my cousin- the police tried to get him to do this, but he wouldn't.

In the U.S- I heard that blacks are 6 times more likely to go to prison (so to me that says they must be about 6 times more likely to commit crimes). However, my cousin who briefly was in jail- told me he met a few blacks that had been in jail for a quite a while for repeat drug possession offenses. One black man he met was sentenced to 2 years in jail-if I recall what he told me- for simple possession of Marijuana (b/c it was in a school zone while picking up his daughter from high school). It was his 3rd arrest for possession of Marijuana. If he hadn't had a court appointed lawyer, I doubt he would have gone to jail nearly as long.

I also have heard of some retaliation gang murders here in Jersey against rival gangs. I've read of murders before against former gang members for helping the police. One particular one was for cutting a plea bargain deal by giving the police information.

Sorry for the rant- this is just my take on this- I could be wrong on certain aspects.



Edited by: ToughJ.Riggins
 

ToughJ.Riggins

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StarWars said:
I always wondered how genetic mid distance was. White people typically always get medals in the 800 meter or the mile/1500m (Seb Coe!). After 3000 meter we taper off again.

For distance the drug they use is usually EPO which helps transport oxygen to blood more efficiently just like how whales can hold breath longer because of myoglobin instead of hemoglobin. Because long distance is so isolated a sport I don't know much about the drug use but the time frame whites stopped dominating in is close to sprinting I guess. The thing is they train high altitude so even if they aren't that much better they should be winning.

Whites are coming on very strong now at 400 meters with all the current talent. We should be able to get the WR at 400 meters and 800 meters. Whites are the best in the world at these events IMO.
 

StarWars

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One thing I don't do often is give support to the black athletes who i think are doing it clean. In my opinion those we know for sure are Wallace Spearmon and David Neville. I unsure about Gay and Dix, and am skeptical of Merritt. I like Spearmon. Also i hear Bob Hayes was one of the fastest men to live, and I believe that. I think Bobby Morrow was probably close or equal, and better at running the 200 than Hayes.

Thought Id throw that out there. But the list of Greene, Montgomery, Ben Johnson, annd MANY others is far longer.
 

white lightning

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I agree that Neville and Spearmon are likely clean.

I disagree strongly on both Gay and Dix! Gay shows all of the signs of a juicer. Look at him. Especially when he is running. His eyeballs are popping out of his head. He is juiced to the gills.

Dix just like Gatlin started early on. He just ran a 10.00 a few weeks ago into a negative wind like it was a jog in the park. This was in April and he is not even in shape yet. I told people Gatlin was guilty since college. He got nailed early on but they slapped him on the wrist. Eventually they caught him.

They will get both of these guys in time. Except for one thing. The US has to protect them because these two juicers are the only ones in the world capable of beating the other two Jamaican Roiders. Oh well. That is track these days.

Wake up gentlemen. This is just like Baseball. Almost everyone is doing it. Hell even Spearmon might be as well. Let's see how the testing goes over the next few years. As for myself, I don't need to see guys test positive to know what they are doing. I can see it with my eyes and that is all the evidence I need!
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Edited by: white lightning
 

StarWars

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white lightning said:
I disagree strongly on both Gay and Dix! Gay shows all of the signs of a juicer. Look at him. Especially when he is running. His eyeballs are popping out of his head. He is juiced to the gills.

??? I thought I said I was unsure about them. By unsure i mean pretty postive they both juice. Gay is friends with veronica campbell brown and dix like you said has peaked far too early in the season.
 

white lightning

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I probably read it wrong bro. I know TJR swears that Gay is clean. That is his opinion. I respect TJR but I disagree with him on this. It is still far too easy to beat the system. Even in the US. While it has gotten tougher, the athletes, trainers, and coaches are almost always at least 1 step ahead!

Tyson Gay was an average high school sprinter like so many others. Then one day he magically starts running times out of this world. Gatlin swore he was clean. Gay says the same. I highly, sincrerely doubt it! I would bet that he is as guilty as Barry Bonds!
 

white lightning

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The new commercial. Steroids, the breakfast of champions! Maybe the breakfast of cheaters who win medals that they don't deserve. I would rather finish last or never medal than to shoot needles into my ass. What a joke sports has become these days.

W.A.D.A. needs to do a better job of catching the cheats faster. It may be difficult, but it is not impossible. Let's clean up the sport please. Is that asking too much? We need to clean up all sports for the kids sake. What kind of message are we sending to the children of the world. I HATE CHEATERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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