60 Years Ago

Discussion in 'Boxing' started by sport historian, Jun 26, 2019.

  1. sport historian

    sport historian Master

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    On the night of June 26, 1959, at Yankee Stadium, Ingemar Johansson KO'd Floyd Patterson in the third round to win the Heavyweight Championship.

    I was 8 years old and heard the news while listening to a little league game on the radio. In 1959 baseball was so popular, little league games were on the local radio. The crowd cheered loudly when informed of Johansson winning.
     
  2. Westside

    Westside Hall of Famer

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    In 1959, the top sports were Boxing, Baseball and football.
     
  3. limitless

    limitless Mentor

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    It took another 24 years after that for a white man to win a heavyweight title, Gerrie Coetzee in 1983. Jerry Quarry and Joe Bugner were somewhat competitive, but it was a long dry spell of black power, a really bad time to grow up.
     
  4. Charles Martel

    Charles Martel Hall of Famer

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    Then came the Klitschkos.





     
  5. limitless

    limitless Mentor

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    As a kid who grew up in the Ali era, the Klitschkos did not even seem possible. Wlad was 64 and 5, Vitali was 45 and 2. Vitali got thumbed by Lennox Lewis (who refused to give V a rematch) and suffered a freak injury in a fight he was winning against Chris Byrd.
     
  6. limitless

    limitless Mentor

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  7. Don Wassall

    Don Wassall Administrator Staff Member

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    I was never a big-time boxing buff, but remember well the complete black domination of the heavyweight division once Ali (Clay) came along. I rooted for Quarry and Cooney and others but they were like the token White sprinter in an eight-man field, good but never quite good enough to triumph over the very best. And those fights were often prime time events before cable became big, watched by tens of millions of White Americans. Those frequent losses fueled the rapid growth of jokes and negative stereotypes about White athletes that the public bought into and still accept hook, line and sinker.

    The Klitschkos indeed didn't seem possible nor did the White comeback in other divisions. Overall, sports has improved over the past roughly 40 years from the perspective of rooting for White athletes. In boxing for sure; golf, tennis and hockey remain White dominated in spite of the Tiger/Williams sisters outlier we've had to suffer through, Wariner, Lemaitre and now Boling in sprinting, noticeable improvements in the NFL at tight end, receiver and even a tiny bit at running back. Basketball remains a desert for White Americans but Euros continue to do well, while baseball is the sport the anti-Whites whine about non-stop because of the lack of American blacks.

    It's the rest of society that has gotten dramatically more non-White, in raw numbers and especially in the fantasy world promoted by the corporate media. Sadly the Caste System has spread rapidly into every nook and cranny of Amerika.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2019
  8. booth

    booth Guru

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    I would have loved to know how boxing would have changed if Henry Cooper had not been robbed against Clay. Knockdown at the end of the fourth round and in bad shape, Angelo Dundee, who admitted doing this cut Clay's glove. Dundee then showed the ref the glove who gave them time to get another glove. I have heard anywhere from 8 to 10 minutes it gave them to refresh Clay. When the fight resumed Clay beat Cooper's face to a bloody pulp and they stop the fight. I know by watching the replay Clay was really hurt.
     
  9. Westside

    Westside Hall of Famer

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    When the Soviet Union fell in the late 80s, is when you saw a fresh supply of elite White athletes. By the late 80s DWF nation had a firm grip on believing the negative stereotypes and the MSM was in full force pushing it. I remember when Ken Norton destroyed the next white hype fighter in Duane Bobick in the mid-70s, SNL made fun of the slow, lack of skill and no chin white heavyweight. Fortunately, slowly but surely boxing and MMA has shown the fruits of elite combat White men dominating in several divisions. Many incorrectly believed that Black Super God Joshua would dominate for the next 10 years. LOL. All it took was for a Mexican who had solid boxing skills, some pop, and a belief in himself to rise off the canvass and crush the black supremacists and DWF dreams. If they rematch I see the same thing happened. Ruiz will have a truth 3-month camp to prepare. Comparing 1960 to 2019 is almost 180.
     
  10. limitless

    limitless Mentor

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    Those were dark times, no pun intended. They even made fun of Rudy Tomjanovich getting punched by Kermit Washington on SNL. It was maybe the most horrendous cold **** of all time. It very much upset me. I went to a majority black high school, I learned the hard away about blacks.
     
  11. white is right

    white is right Hall of Famer

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    Ali should have lost by disqualification in that fight, I'm not sure if that would have altered heavyweight history as the rematch would have big money and Ali would have most likely won, but "Enry" would have had his winning moment and made much more money in the return bout.

    Yes as others have stated very few Whites competed in boxing in all of the divisions but it was most notable in the heavyweight division because casual fans really only pay attention to this division. I vaguely remember that promoters used to take advantage of the lack of White elite contenders by manufacturing guys to feed to Joe Frazier after the Ali fight because he wanted soft touches before the inevitable big money rematches. Maybe the best of these guys was Ron Stander who had a notable win over Ernie Shavers.
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2019
  12. booth

    booth Guru

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    I agree white is right. I would like to mention George Chuvalo and one of my favorite hw. of all time Jerry Quarry. He was undersized even back then. He was a very good boxer & puncher just came along at the wrong decade. I saw on an earlier post with the name Gerrie Coetzee and it made me realize that a country with less than 6 million whites produce more white hw. champions than the U.S.A. Corrie Sanders was champion after beating Wlad Klitschko. Sanders was a great all- around athlete who ran the 100 meters in 11.0 and was a semi-pro golfer. He was killed by 3 negros who robbed and shot him to death.
     
  13. sport historian

    sport historian Master

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    So what? Clay got up by the count of four, and the round ended anyway.
     
  14. sport historian

    sport historian Master

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    In 1982 Cooney was presumed to have a chance of winning, but was beaten handily. By the mid-1980's it was often said there will never be another white heavyweight champion. I followed boxing, heavyweights in particular, in those days, read all the boxing magazines.

    Nobody, absolutely nobody foresaw the effect the fall of the iron curtain and the Soviet Union would have in bringing back the White Heavyweight Champion. No boxing or sportswriter ever speculated on an Eastern European being able to win the heavyweight title.
     
  15. booth

    booth Guru

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    Then why the need to cheat?
     
  16. Flint

    Flint Mentor Staff Member

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    Blacks dominated boxing in the US because the only path in the sport was through inner city gyms. And the only people that would take that path were poor black people. Rocky was a fable.

    White people would not let their kids do anything like that except for a few hard assess like Gerry Cooney's father who had all of his sons doing road work at the crack of dawn.

    When a place opened up where white people were as desperate and poor as US blacks, the former Soviet bloc, there were suddenly a lot of very good white fighters.

    A snack on the head is only a good payday when there is nothing else. Note how the US ghetto doesn't turn out many fighters now that a paycheck is no longer necessary to get by.
     
  17. Flint

    Flint Mentor Staff Member

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    Aside from blatant racial favoritism, Johansson was probably liked more because Patterson was an ex-con with a nasty disposition. For example white people would have not cheered against Joe Louis like that. People liked Joe.

    Actually I confused Patterson with Sonny Liston. Patterson was in trouble in his youth but turned his life around and won a gold medal at Helsinki. So yeah sports historians friends were practicing blatant racial favoritism. And good for them!
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2019
  18. Don Wassall

    Don Wassall Administrator Staff Member

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    Bingo! That's why I've been maintaining for years that the black athletic talent pool is shrinking, and the phenomenal number of black busts each year in the NFL attests to it. There's a certain amount of black ghetto boys who will shoot anyone they feel has "disrespected" them, but that doesn't equate to athletic talent. Black kids more and more are into video games and recreational drugs, the same as White suburban kids, not long hours of arduous training. They're getting softer, the same process that happened in White working class neighborhoods and of course the suburbs.

    So the present now belongs to extremely determined and dedicated athletes, no matter their background. Christian McCaffrey is tough as nails yet was brought up in wealth. No, he's not going to punch out or shoot anyone, but he's as determined as any athlete you can name to succeed. And he and other White football players and kids like Matt Boling have opened the door and showed the way for other White athletes -- if they're willing to pay the price.

    I'm actually more optimistic about Whites in sports than just about any other area of this virulently anti-White society that is determined to replace us as soon as possible. Things have tilted on their head since this site began 15 years ago, and to any young White kids out there reading this, you have more opportunity now in "taboo" sports and "taboo" positions than you've had for a long time, yet it's still a very, very difficult road.
     
  19. white is right

    white is right Hall of Famer

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    One of the few Whites who won a world belt in this era had a dad who beat him and forced him to do roadwork too(Bobby Czyz). Czyz's dad was a true maniac who had mental health issues who later committed suicide.

    Previously we have talked about in various threads the "better athlete" isn't always the better boxer. Half of being an elite boxer is having the stomach to fight through pain, fatigue and being slightly concussed. As we saw 3 weeks ago Joshua couldn't do this against a guy who was on that night all about doing that when his back was against the wall.
     
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2019
  20. sport historian

    sport historian Master

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    Standard operating procedure. Clay cut Cooper up in the next round to end it.
     
  21. sport historian

    sport historian Master

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    I see you realized you had confused Floyd Patterson with Sonny Liston. Patterson was articulate and well spoken, but was not considered an outstanding heavyweight champion.
     
  22. booth

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    So you agree Clay's corner cheated and there were several other fights which were dubious at best that Clay later called Ali won. Both Liston fights, all of Norton's fights and the Jimmy Young fight. I really feel like both Spink's fights was fix even if Ali lost one. This was so Ali could regain the title and Howard Cossell could once again call Ali The Greatest.
     
  23. Flint

    Flint Mentor Staff Member

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    I don't think it's a stretch to assume there were some fixes in Ali's career. Boxing is just that way. Anyway other than the myth does anyone really consider him the actual "greatest"?

    He lost several fights badly, even in his prime barely won some. Fought far too long. And in the end had his brain pounded into mush. Contrast that to Dr. Klitscho who dominated all comers for years and only had a couple of bad fights. And still seems to be in good health.
     
  24. booth

    booth Guru

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    By ever boxing magazine and 99% of every living boxing expert Ali is the greatest heavyweight champion of all time.
     
  25. FootballDad

    FootballDad Hall of Famer

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    It depends on how they define "great". If they mean by elevating HW boxing and black hero worship to unprecedented levels with his braggadocio and showmanship, then yes, he was "the greatest". Purely as a boxer, probably not, but he was also no slouch. In my opinion there have been many more skilled, better boxers than Ali both before and after, black and white. But he brought the spotlight like never before.
     

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