2019 NFL Draft

Discussion in 'NFL' started by Extra Point, Jun 18, 2018.

  1. Truthteller

    Truthteller Mentor

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    Shadow, this has been going on for a while now, Caste stooges like McElroy projecting athletic, running white quarterbacks as tight ends. As much as I dislike Greg as an analyst, remember before Taysom MOST athletic white quarterback's moved to tight end. Unfortunately that's how NFL does business -- racial stacking.

    Heck, before (and after) the Jaguars selected Matt Jones in round one as a wide receiver most "draft experts" slotted him at tight end....Tim Tebow never got a shot at tailback, power back. Could he have been a LaGarrett Blount type? I thought so. He only got a brief look at H-Back and punt protector with the Caste Jets.

    Less often smaller quarterbacks are moved to slot receiver (i.e. Julian Edleman). Any one else remember how the Rams tried to move mobile Heisman Trophy winner Eric Crouch to receiver after picking him in round 3? When asked by St. Louis media why he couldn't play tailback, the Rams' black RB coach said he's "too small", which is bizarre, considering several hundred blacks much smaller than Crouch have played tailback in the NFL since the 1970 merger. Crouch refused to move from quarterback and retired. After he decided he needed cash, he tried to come back as a safety with the Packers after a stint with Hamburg (NFL Europe).

    Speaking of quarterbacks moving to safety, I recall vividly from the mid-90's, into the 2000's, many teams were looking for their own, modern day Nolan Cromwell. So we saw goys like Scott Frost drafted as a safety (3rd round Jets)....Rams also picked an Ohio State quarterback (Steve Bellisari?) and moved him to safety. Sure there where others I don't remember. But moving athletic college quarterback's to safety is now unacceptable in the NFL. Edleman was probably the last, and he only dabbled at CB.

    Most quarterback's failed after the move to receiver, particularly at tight end, due to issues you brought up -- size, blocking, never caught a ball, ect. Hopefully the new trend is towards Taysom types going forward -- let them run the ball. It's not rocket science, it's just a man running forward with a ball in his hand trying to advance it as far as he can. Why all the racial machinations?
     
  2. Shadowlight

    Shadowlight Mentor

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    Nice review/historical post on the subject by Truth. Even going back to Nolan Cromwell. I remember all of the above. I was particular irked about Eric Crouch, easily one of my favorite college football players ever. He was drafted in 2002 and Matt Jones was drafted in 2005 both caste heavy eras where their presence helped lessen the overall gloom. Wouldn't Crouch fit the Taysom Hill role now?

    I do remember the annoying Matt Jones TE talk. He was sort of slender like Chris Collinsworth but the caste shadow was bearing down on things full throttle. He really was a light in a tunnel but his sadly cut short career was uneven. He did have some moments. I have always felt he was sabotaged plus he was routinely skulled by black DBs. Back then black DBs always skulled white WRs. They still do today but because of the tougher rules the incidents aren't as prevalent.
     
    Last edited: Nov 23, 2018
  3. Leonardfan

    Leonardfan Hall of Famer

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    Fitzgerald didn't take off as a passer like I thought he would under the new head coach. With that said he still led them to a 7-4 season (he was suspended for game 1). He is a very good athlete and should be considered as a WR or a Taysom Hill like utility player. There are some black WRs that are about the same size as him getting plenty of hype as WRs. Look no further than Terrelle Pryor who was drafted as a QB and flamed out quickly but has been in the league as a supposed number 1 wr. No reason to think he cannot transition to WR at the next level. My only issue with him being a running back is that he is tall - 6-5 is his listed height and I do not think that would help him convert to a full time RB. The truth is that he is white and if he is even drafted it will be to play H-Back or TE. The caste NFL is not going to do anything to let Fitzgerald break the rigid mold set for talented white athletes.
     
  4. Leonardfan

    Leonardfan Hall of Famer

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    East West Shrine Game roster is also trickling out. Some notables so far:

    Kansas LB Joe Dineen
    Wisconsin LB Andrew Van Ginkel
    Toledo WR Cody Thompson
     
  5. Truthteller

    Truthteller Mentor

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    Good news on Thompson. I would assume David Sills, Andy Isabella and Hunter Renfroe will be drafted....As a true slot receiver, Renfroe would likely project as a 5th to 7th rounder, at best. If he's drafted at all.

    Would be nice if Cody and Trent Irwin could join them. But 5 white receivers might be asking a lot, considering the Caste system? We'll have more clues when the Senior Bowl and Combine invites are posted.

    Also, I actually watched Northwestern quite a bit this year. Flynn Nagel was impressive. Perhaps Nagel or some other "overachiever" can beat the odds and be drafted? Again, talent isn't the only issue here, when you consider all the Caste system road blocks for these goys. There might be 10-15 worthy of serious draft consideration, based on talent, but that simply can't happen and wont happen, unless someone builds a time machine and makes it 1976 again.

    Can an ex-quarterback join the group? I've never seen Nick Fitzgerald play, but based on what I've read he has great size and speed. Perhaps he'll be deemed a Drew Bennett type -- former tall UCLA quarterback and 1,000 yard NFL receiver?

    I actually did watch Eric Dungey play today. Wow, what an athlete....Just googled him to find some legit draft info on him -- draft site writer's generally don't know much, but I found some scouts opinions on him. Coming into this season, some were comparing him to pretty good NFL quarterback's; others worry about injuries.

    Also, it looks like he has the aforementioned Eric Crouch mindset which I do not like: Dungey is against switching positions at the next level.

    https://www.syracuse.com/orangefoot...ic_dungey_must_sway_scouts_in_final_year.html
     
  6. Leonardfan

    Leonardfan Hall of Famer

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    Dungey to me isn't an NFL QB. He's been a very good dual threat college QB but I just can't see him at the next level playing the position. He has a reckless style of play which does not lend itself to longevity at the position in the NFL.

    The "experts" are really piling on this draft class and doing their best to tear down some solid SR QB prospects in Drew Lock and Will Grier. I think most of us have caught at least one WVU game and see what Grier is capable of. Lock is really reminiscent of Jay Cutler to me in terms of his physical ability and pure arm strength. I'll admit Finley and Thorson have their warts (when it comes to senior QBs) but Grier and Lock should be sure fire 1st round picks.
     
  7. Bucky

    Bucky Mentor

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    Agreed on the others and Dungey should embrace a position change.

    David Blough is an underrated but intriguing QB prospect. 7 300+yds passing games this season.
     
  8. Shadowlight

    Shadowlight Mentor

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    Below is the updated list which also include DE Zach Allen. Hopefully his ankle injury is not serious.

    Chase Hansen was invited too.

    Excited about McSorley. The Bengals Jeff Driskel will be starting Sunday so I see no need to change McSorley's position other than slot him as a Taysom Hill type with the possibility of starting someday in the NFL as a QB.

    Look for ND LB Tranquill to fly up draft boards--as long as his health status is OK.

    https://www.seniorbowl.com/accepted-invites.php
     
  9. Shadowlight

    Shadowlight Mentor

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    As far as DE Zach Allen I think teams will be stupid to pass on him. He is already pissed off for being named second team ACC---the good news is that will provide him motivation---but Allen represents the antidote to all these fruity offenses putting up video numbers that is all the rage in the NFL these days.

    Allen represents the return of the scary defensive player that used to dot the NFL landscape back when it was played by real tough guys.

    Allen is not only a big moose he is an intelligent and surprisingly nimble disrupter. They say his character is off the charts and he is relentless. I would grab him in a heartbeat. Are you listening Jon Gruden?

    While on the subject of BC there is another player not on draft boards but should be. He also made second team All Acc. I speak of KR/PR/ST/WR Michael Walker.

    I would love to be in charge of draft picks for a team. Even though I would be tempted to choose just white players I would ( grudgingly) diversify. However for defense I would likely only draft white players. I have seen enough of this "black experiment." As for WR I want a smart good hands player that runs proper routes. One that has the ability to connect with the QB.

    Then I would take a flier on a real special teams player like Walker. I am not a big fan of having starting players return kicks. Walker would be a perfect late round draft pick. He has the explosion and speed (took one to the house versus Miami recently) and the experience you want in a return man. I saw a couple of his returns against Syracuse. He looks the part. Dazzling is the word. There is no reason teams should shy away from a talented return specialist like Walker.

    And who knows he could see spot duty at WR and see where that takes him as well. These days teams don't think anymore when they draft. It is all this caste by the numbers crap and then come Sunday people wonder why the NFL is loaded with players that lack fundamentals and look like crap half the time.
     
  10. Leonardfan

    Leonardfan Hall of Famer

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    Shadowlight, have to respectfully disagree on McSorely. Could he be an NFL QB? He probably could carve out a niche as a 2nd/3rd stringer but the arm strength and consistency as a passer just leave something to be desired. I would love to see him be given the opportunity to transition to DB or RB though - those two positions could use depth.

    So far no Senior Bowl invite for Wyoming S Andrew Wingard or North Alabama S Chris Johnson. It seems that the white DB is pretty much on life support right now with many in the league currently hovering around age 30 or older.
     
  11. Red raider

    Red raider Guru

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    I’m hoping Arizona WR Tony Ellison can get his name out there, the guy can play and despite his 5’11” 190lbs frame he is a guy that can go deep and make incredible catches. He led the NCAA with no drops at all in 2017 which just shows how sure handed he is. Former walk-on of course, he has put up 69-1155-11 in his career which is an impressive 16.7 ypc. The guy I’d compare him to is Julian Edelman, very versatile from the slot.

    I’m a big fan of San Diego State SS Parker Baldwin also, he’s a big safety at 6’2” 215lbs and has lots of experience as a 3 year starter. He has flown under the radar but has consistently put up good stats since he arrive at SDSU.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2018
  12. Shadowlight

    Shadowlight Mentor

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    Someone mentioned WR Drew Bennett recently. Jogged my memory. That is who WR David Sills reminds me of most. A tall ( both are 6'5") lanky deep threat with smooth skills as a novice to the position. Like Bennett Sills was a former QB. Eerie similarity.

    Bennett's best season was 2004. Huge numbers--80-1247-11. 2005 was also excellent but he missed a few games so didn't reach 1000 yards.
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2018
  13. Red raider

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  14. Red raider

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    I’ve never seen him play but wow is Timmy Hernandez impressive. The catches he makes are just insane and he makes it look easy. It’s unfortunate he plays for a bad school and will likely get the Ryan Nall treatment. If he makes it to the NFL they will likely relegate him to slot but the video shows that he is a WIDE receiver through and through. He excels near the boundaries, down the field, and in traffic. I hope NFL scouts take a good look at him because he is a legit prospect in my eyes. He has average WR size at 6’0” 195lbs also and is versatile as he was a starting CB in JUCO before arriving at Oregon State. I’ll throw in my comparison for him, he reminds me of Dylan Cantrell in terms of play style. They both have excellent body control and make tough catches from their outside receiver spots. They are not alike in terms of size but I see the same thing when watching their tape. Let me know what y’all think about him, I think even we have overlooked him here.
     
  15. Deceptive Speed

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    I can see that, but I actually thought Sills compared more to Jeff Samardzija if he would've stuck with football! They are the same size at 6'5, and both are elite red-zone targets among the NCAA leaders in receiving TD's, with Samardzija snagging 15 his Jr. year, and Sills producing 15 this year.
     
  16. Leonardfan

    Leonardfan Hall of Famer

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    That's a great comparison - never even occurred to me! I would argue Samardzija was a little more dominant, physical and athletic but overall its a very astute comparison. Those of us who were here when the Shark chose baseball over football now will hopefully get to see a similarly talented player at WR in the NFL after dominating the college ranks for the past two seasons.
     
  17. Leonardfan

    Leonardfan Hall of Famer

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    A few more notable East-West Shrine game invites and all three should be at the Senior Bowl:

    Wisconsin LB Ryan Connelly
    Utah LB Cody Barton
    Wyoming S Andrew Wingard

    QBs Taylor Cornelius and David Blough also invited. Cornelius would be the definition of "upside" - raw, inexperienced, big arm, very athletic and productive in his one year as a starter. He has no melanin though so I guess that term cannot be applied to him.
     
  18. Deceptive Speed

    Deceptive Speed Mentor

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    True Samardzija may have been better, he did have better stats. Let's just say Sills is the next closest thing to Samardzija. Sills is also the closest thing to a white Randy Moss I've seen yet, I don't think his pro career will be as good but I think they play very similar.
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2018
  19. Leonardfan

    Leonardfan Hall of Famer

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    I concur. That ND team was fun to watch - Quinn, the Shark and Zbikowski.
     
  20. chris371

    chris371 Mentor

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    Great point, i forgot about Bennett. I remember his 04 season like it was yesterday. Time flies...
     
  21. Leonardfan

    Leonardfan Hall of Famer

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    Out of the 49 accepted invites to the Senior Bowl - 17 are white.

    Shrine game - 20 of 53 invites so far are white.


    Noticeable players missing from either game include WR David Sills, RB Patrick Laird, S Chris Johnson, WR Trenton Irwin, WR Jesper Horsted, RB Sam McPherson, WR Hunter Renfrow, OT Mitch Hyatt, DE Hunter Snyder, LB Porter Gustin, LB Cameron Smith, LB Ben Burr-Kirven, LB Josh Buss, DT Ryan Bee
     
  22. Shadowlight

    Shadowlight Mentor

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    Every passing year I have become more and more skeptical of the combine process. The over emphasis on these artificial drills (40 yard dash, vertical leap and what have you) I come away thinking the scouts and GMs are more interested in bicep size than actual playing field football skills.

    When I watch TE Zach Ertz or WR Adam Thielen or QB Josh Allen play I see quick graceful athletic natural born football players with no wasted movements. They move like the players from way back. Easy on the eyes. When I watch the majority of black DBs play I see over muscular stiff athletes that have one discernable skill, running the 40 yard dash fully rested in a fast time. Albeit many of the DBs sure play slow.

    The lack of dexterity among the DBs and even many black WRs today is astonishing considering the fact many in the media think they are the greatest athletes in the world.

    You can bet come combine time though that the scouts GMs and media will once again focus on the black athletes "testing off the charts" and the slobbering and drooling and plain ole quasi homo like attraction to these testing wizards will once again make me sick to my stomach.

    I will give you an example of the next "wunderkind" who will likely test off the charts in the 40 yard dash. He will most assuredly bolt up the draft board and some sucker team will take the bite. And regret it.

    WR Marquise Brown from Oklahoma is a smallish but extremely fast prototype of a 'track athlete" type with worrying rudimental football skills. After watching the entire Texas-Oklahoma rematch I am hear to tell you Brown dropped every ball that was contested in the slightest way. One he had as a sure TD but was stripped of the ball by a Texas defender by one hand. One time having secured the ball he dropped it due to the impact of falling. He looked very klutzy hand and body wise for what is supposed to be a top tier WR. Sound familiar Tavon Austin/John Ross fans?

    You can bet your ass come draft time fool teams will be slobbering over this suspect player with the magnificent speed. Many already have him penciled in as a first round pick.

    If it was up to me he would already be off my draft prospect board.
     
  23. Leonardfan

    Leonardfan Hall of Famer

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    It's that time of the year when tons of no name black players thrown their names into the draft pool as early entrants - it's "dat upside" season. The early entry of so many undeveloped/unskilled black players every year does more damage to the NFL's diluted product.

    The Senior Bowl is shaping up to be a pretty big dud at this point - so far it's pretty caste with 73 total players known to either be participating or invited to the senior bowl. Their are about 45 more players that will be invited - half of those will need to be white to give any hope at making a small dent in the draft.

    Auburn QB Jarret Stidham did declare - it's probably best he got out of Auburn after what is to be considered a down year - not as much fault of his as of the Auburn team and offensive scheme. He was smart to leave now. My guess is he will be a 2nd/3rd round pick. We all know the Redskins could use a QB.

    Also with Urban retiring (early Christmas present!) I am sure the media will be clamoring for the OSU quotaback to save this supposedly terrible QB class. I actually wouldn't mind him declaring as Tate Martell will start at OSU.
     
  24. Leonardfan

    Leonardfan Hall of Famer

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    A few more notable Senior Bowl Invites:

    WRs Hunter Renfrow and David Sills

    WVU QB Will Grier invited

    USC LB Cameron Smith


    103 total names that are now known to be attending or invited with 17 more to be invited - it would be nice to see 8 or 9 more white athletes invited with the 17 remaining selections that have yet to be publicized.
     
  25. backrow

    backrow Hall of Famer

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    So, to all our draft experts, who put of caste positions (hb, wr and basically all defense) is likely to get picked in first 5 rounds? @Leonardfan @Shadowlight
     

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