2010 NBA Playoffs

Discussion in 'NBA' started by white lightning, Apr 18, 2010.

  1. icsept

    icsept Master

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    Great game, but a brutal way to lose. It seems like the Lakers are always winning in that manner. It was interesting to see the Slovenians Dragic and Vujacic go head to head. Apparently they don't like each other. I think both players have the talent to be starters in the league.Edited by: icsept
     
  2. j41181

    j41181 Master

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    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/sports/basketball/steve-nash-and-vince-carter-on-different-paths/article1583762/

    Steve Nash and Vince Carter on different paths </font>

    Victoria guard's halo hasn't slipped a bit from its usual place while former Raptor star remains as one of the sports world's greatest underachievers

    Two athletes in the same place, the bulk of their careers behind them, neither likely to have an NBA championship ring to hold up as proof to the simple-minded that their careers meant something.

    But even as Vince Carter and Steve Nash make their way through their respective conference final series, their legacies, already formed and shaped by more than a decade of NBA service each, are close to being set in stone.

    Nash's Phoenix Suns may yet get to the NBA final, given they've surprisingly pulled even with the Los Angeles Lakers (2-2 in the best-of-seven series, with Game 5 in L.A. on Thursday night). But if they don't, it will be a case of a good team falling short against a potentially great one.

    Regardless, Phoenix's playoff run has delivered yet more evidence that Nash gives everything he has when the ball goes up, the Victoria native's quick handiwork â€" trying to set his broken nose on the fly â€" as powerful a message as his joyous celebration of the play of the Suns' bench brigade.

    Former Canadian Olympic teammate Todd MacCulloch was saying the other day that he hoped Nash, a two-time NBA most valuable player, got a ring, "just so no one can say anything bad about his career."Â

    He needn't worry.

    But Vince Carter? You'd like to say he should worry, but it's hard to make the case he does.

    Even as the Orlando Magic have rallied in their series with the Boston Celtics â€" winning twice in a row to trail 3-2 before Friday's game â€" Carter's reputation as one of the sport's great underachievers won't require revision. Impossibly, at least in the eyes of Toronto Raptors fans, he's made Magic followers lament the departure of Hedo Turkoglu, as Carter has turned into a $16-million (U.S.) spectator when the stakes are highest.

    There are bad games at the wrong times, and then there's Carter's Game 4 bed-soiling: Three points, two rebounds, three turnovers and 1-for-9 shooting in 30-plus minutes of a game the Magic won despite him, not because of him.

    The local media begged him to deliver in Game 5, and all Carter could muster was eight points (3-for-11).

    Magic head coach Stan Van Gundy has taken to playing journeyman Matt Barnes ahead of Carter late in games. (The coach's brother, Jeff, commentating for ESPN, shrugged and explained: "He wants to get his best competitors on the floor."Â)

    Those who know Nash say the only surprise is he is bringing his particular brand of competitive commitment to the highest levels of basketball â€" something that was hard to predict when he was growing up playing soccer and hockey on Vancouver Island. But the way he plays â€" all out â€" has never changed.

    Sadly for those who've followed Carter throughout his career, the same is true â€" he's never changed. And any last-gasp, face-saving efforts either Wednesday in Orlando in Game 5 or later on in the series (should it go that far) will alter the fundamental truth about one of the sport's great talents: The doubters were right â€" he never cared enough and still doesn't.

    Nearly a decade ago, with his team's playoff fate in the balance, Carter had a choice: Leave the Raptors the morning of their Game 7 showdown with the Philadelphia 76ers, attend his graduation ceremony at the University of North Carolina and fly back for the game that night, or put the graduation off and focus at the task at hand.

    He chose to get his diploma.

    Carter's intentions were good. Here was an emerging NBA star willing to pay more than lip service to the significance of education and family (he had, of course, promised his mother, Michelle, herself a teacher, that he would graduate from UNC after leaving early for the NBA draft). Things could be worse, and he was young. His story was still being written.

    But that initial pen stroke set the stage. He could never quite figure out that as a professional basketball player, it's what happens on the floor that really matters.

    Now that the final chapter is in progress, his days as ESPN's next big thing long gone, his shoe deals a memory, it's becoming obvious Carter will never have a championship ring to wave in the face of detractors. And now that he's gone silent in the spotlight, he won't have the honour that comes with failing valiantly in the attempt.

    Nash? He may or may not get the Suns to the NBA final. The ring may or may not come. But you know he tried.
     
  3. Westside

    Westside Hall of Famer

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    I caught bits and pieces of last nights game and read the stories on various sports webs sites. Steve Nash is a tough as nails PLAYER. A man who refuses to give up and makes a statement by "playing hard with skill and ruthlessness. Never surrender and I have supreme skills, just watch, and attempt to stop me attitude."

    He is a joy to watch. Game 6 is obvious do or die. I think the Suns will push a game 7. But when when up against the wall, it seems Kobe always rises to the occasion and with Gasol on the floor, it will take an epic effort for the Suns to overcome it. It they do, it will be a game for the ages.
     
  4. TwentyTwo

    TwentyTwo Master

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    WOW! Impressed with the Suns comeback after being down 18 (74-56) in the 3rd qtr..not an easy hole to get out of...Nash willed them to that comeback...the Lakers bench (Powell) was in awe of this relentless skill! The refs actually seemed to do a fair job..technical-foul on constantly complaining Kobe + poor Coach Gentry's techwhile hurling in the trash can in 1st qtr.

    Shooting only 20 of 29 from the free throw line did not help the Suns....if they had just gone 23 of 29 that could have been the difference; too many turnovers...hope the Suns can WIN this series...but 2 in a row is a TALL order!

    Go Magic! Half-way to history!!
     
  5. bigunreal

    bigunreal Mentor

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    Can somebody tell me how a technical foul can be "rescinded" AFTER a game? Kendrick Perkins, one half of Boston's roly poly affletic duo (along with magnificent specimen Glen "Big Baby" Davis), received two techinals in the last game and, by NBA rules, would therefore have to miss the next game.

    The jock sniffers on ESPN were acting as if this was a normal thing. Uh, it isn't- it's unprecedented. This simply can't be a part of the rules- I've been following sports since the mid-1960s and have never heard of anything like this before.
     
  6. Kaptain

    Kaptain Master

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    I haven't watched a whole lot of the NBA, but I have caught a bit of the playoffs. Just wanted to see if anyone else can verify my observations: Vince Carter and Amoure Stotlemeyer are severely over-rated. I know Amoure has offensive moments, but without Nash gifting him lay-ups how effective would he really be? On defense he also seems to be lazy and often out of position (weak). The same with Vince Carter. Carter seems to even be a more obvious wuss. That's it for now.
     
  7. Westside

    Westside Hall of Famer

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    KP that article posted by j41181 pretty much justifies your point about Vince "invisible man during big games" Carter.
     
  8. white lightning

    white lightning Hall of Famer Staff Member

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    Well I was very close in my predicitons thus far so the Swami is back for another look into the crystal ball. I was only off by 1 point in the last game although I thought the Suns would pull it out. I didn't think Ron "Arrest" Artest would bully his way into getting the winning put back. What a joke!

    So my call for tonight is another close game until the closing minute or two. I see the Suns winning 121-117. I thing the Lakers are going to push them the whold game. I do see the Suns going toe to toe with them and pulling it out.

    Just think how exciting it will be if game 7 is on memorial day prime time tv! Let's go Suns!
     
  9. Kaptain

    Kaptain Master

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    It's a joke that Dravic is not on the floor more and why not let him play with Steve Nash? Oh yah, two white scorers on the court at the same time is not allowed.
     
  10. white lightning

    white lightning Hall of Famer Staff Member

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    I agree Kaptain Poop but it's too late now. The series is over. Dragic is a future all star. This kid has Nash's toughness to go with superior athletecism. I have to give credit to the Lakers. They did what they had to do. Congrats to j41181. I am happy for Gasol but I just can't stand the Lakers. I guess I will have to root for them most likely though as the Celtics are far worse Caste Wise.
     
  11. j41181

    j41181 Master

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    I agree with both KP, and WL, Dragic should've stayed on the floor till the end, and Richardson is now the goat. Nash and Amare played supreb, but it was Dragic who nearly brought the Suns to a possible win.

    Gasol played terrible and should serve as a wake-up call for him against KG & the Celtics (Zulus). I never liked Kobe, but some of those shots he made were jaw-dropping (unfair in fact). That's 3 straight Finals appearances for Gasol, validating his trade as one of the best ever in NBA history.

    As much as I admire Nash for his remarkable toughness, dedication, and work ethic, one thing can't be overlooked, his WEAK DEFENSE.

    Nash can't be compared to Stockton, because Stock is light-years ahead of Nash in defense. Nash's inability to make significant stops and steals is one of the reasons for his shortcomings in the playoffs. No matter how tough and determined a player Nash is, his defense will ALWAYS be his ACHILLES HEEL. The same is quite true for Nowitzki.

    I pray Dragic will gain some of Nash's basketball IQ, while being a better defensive player.
     
  12. Westside

    Westside Hall of Famer

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    Well its the Los Angeles Lakers vs The Boston Africains. Hopefully Luke Walton will get into the groove and get more playing time. Now Pau will have a chance to reverse the rep he had against the Africains back in 2008.
     
  13. Deadlift

    Deadlift Hall of Famer

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    In my view, the Celtics' bigs are overrated.

    I think the Lakers' will be able to grab rebounds and such. I think the guard play will determine the outcome of these Finals. I'll be pulling for Pau and LA, but I'm not scared of any of the possible outcomes.

    Sure, Doc Rivers is a race-traitor, but the damage is already done, and the blackification of NBA coaching staffs is nearly complete. That's exactly what "they" desire with NFL coaching staffs...
     
  14. j41181

    j41181 Master

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    Normally, I don't watch post-game interviews. But Nash's was a exception and a joy to see. He was quite emotional (who wouldn't), and he had his 2 very beautiful daughters by his side. They are his 2 MVP's (Most Valuable Persons). Stand tall and be proud, Nash!! [​IMG]

    The girls are obviously white![​IMG] Edited by: j41181
     
  15. foobar75

    foobar75 Master

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    I think that buzzer beater in game 5 clearly took a lot out of the Suns. It was very deflating and despite the fact that they launched a similar comeback in the 4th quarter again in game 6, their tanks (mentally and physically) just didn't have enough. If only Steve Nash had kept this mouth shut and the whole Los Suns thing never happened, I would have easily rooted for the Suns in this series. I'm sorry, but I just could not let that one go.

    Pau has been playing great all playoffs, so I guess he was going to have a mulligan eventually. Better to have it now than later. He has to play much better against the Celtics and I think he will step up to the plate. As for Kobe, what can you say, he just would not let the Lakers lose tonight. Some of those shots in the 4th quarter were beyond unbelivable. The only other player who can possibly make those kinds of baskets would have been Jordan in his prime. Kobe is clearly the best player in the NBA.

    I'm now hoping the Lakers can dispatch Africa's team in the finals. I truly despise that thug Kevin Garnett, Rondo (a very good but dirty player) and the rest of the Celtics. Pau is the ultimate caste-buster, an athletic big white man who can do it all, and he now gets a chance to show his skills at the biggest stage and redeem himself from what happened in 2008. Looks like some of the other whites (Vujacic, Walton) are slowly working their way back into the rotation as well. It's very easy to root for the Lakers in this series, IMO, for no other reason than the fact that Boston is the opponent. I would root for anyone playing Boston at this point.
     
  16. whiteathlete33

    whiteathlete33 Hall of Famer

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    Has Dragic been given credit by the announcers for his athleticism? My favorite one of all is when sites such as Nbadraft.net refer to a white European player as "European player with American atleticism." What is that supposed to mean?
     
  17. bigunreal

    bigunreal Mentor

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    I don't see how anyone here can find a single positive from these playoffs, or this league for that matter. I could never root for the Lakers, simply because of what they've done to Adam Morrison. It's similar to the way NFL teams bury the few high profile white college RBs. Think about it; this team traded for a young, high draft pick and then has absolutely refused to play him for over a whole season.

    Boston is the new, cutting edge NBA team; they have at least three affletes who receive significant playing time, despite flubbery or pudgy bodies (Davis, Perkins and the truly ridiculous Nate Robinson). Someone please find the white NBA players (especially tiny guards like Robinson) who have ever been in such pitiful physical condition. Looking at them, and then realizing true potential stars like Morrison and Joe Alexander, are being virtually frozen out of the league, reminds one of a scene from Reconstruction days, when illiterate ex- slaves were installed as U.S. Congressman.

    I knew once Nash had the audacity to declare a Suns' victory that there was no chance of it happening. The jock sniffers were clearly miffed at this, much as they are when ANY white player mimics something that ANY black player does on a consistent basis.

    NBA whistleblower Tim Donaghy issued a statement before the Celtics' game six win over the Magic. He said that there was a better chance of David Stern losing 50 lbs before Sunday than there was of either the Magic or Suns making the finals. This one was very predictable, once again, those who run the NBA have the matchup they seemingly always love- Celtics- Lakers.
     
  18. whiteathlete33

    whiteathlete33 Hall of Famer

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    I haven't watched any playoff games. No teams to really cheer for. What is wrong with Nate Robinson though? I'm going to be fair here and say he's in great physical shape and muscular. I can't understand where you get that from.
     
  19. pistol pete

    pistol pete Guru

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    Dragic should have played more. Amundson should have also played more.
    The Suns' strenghts were their two point guards and Robin Lopez at center. They didn't exploit the point guard and center position enough.

    Phil Jackson has found the formula for winning championships: a superstar, a superstar 1a, an enforcer who is slightly crazy, a bunch of big men, tough point guards who can hit threes, a versatile sixth man, and several white players who can get it done. I can't really hate a coach who has had Paxon, Will Perdue, Toni Kukoc, Steve Kerr, Luc Longley, Bill Wennington, Luke Walton, and Pau Gasol play integral parts of his championship teams. He also treats his super stars
    like adults and gets the most out of un-P.C. guys like Rodman and Artest.

    Come to think of it, is John Paxon the last starting white point guard to win a championship? Or did J-Will start for the Heat?

    I think Phil Jackson could have won this series if he had coache the Suns. Nash's coach failed him. Nash was on the break many times and had no one to pass to. Grant Hill is broken down and Channing Frye was a joke. Starting Dragic and Nash at the guards and bringing Amundson as the first or second person of the bench could have won them the game. Any smart person would tell you that a starting line up of Nash-Dragic, Richardson at the small forward slot to guard Kobe and the only guy on the Suns who can post up Artest and take him to the hoop, with Amare at the four and Robin Lopez at center with Amundson as the sixth man would have had the best chance of winning. But then the Suns would be "too white."
     
  20. foobar75

    foobar75 Master

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    Regarding Adam Morrison being "shut-out", I just don't see it. As Pistol Pete has correctly pointed out, Phil Jackson has a long and proven track record of playing white players, and not simply in token roles, either. His Chicago and LA teams have always featured a combination of white players in various roles (starters, 6th men, regular part of the rotation), so he doesn't have a reason to keep Morrison out. It's not part of some grand conspiracy, either. My guess is, Morrison is either just not that good, or, his skills are not suited to Phil's system, in an already crowded roster. Morrison has never been known for this defense, and Phil Jackson always puts a premium on that.

    If Morrison had ended up with a white-unfriendly coach like Doc Rivers or George Karl, we could easily question the situation. Sadly, if he cannot make it with a team like LA, which has been relatively white friendly the last 4-5 seasons, then I'm not sure what his chances are going forward.
     
  21. whiteathlete33

    whiteathlete33 Hall of Famer

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    Morrison had an opportunity. He started his first season and shot a dismal 37% from the field while averaging only 11 points per game and 2.9 rebounds per game. 2.9 boards a game isn't that bad if you are a 6 foot point guard. For a 6'8 guy it's atrocious. I still support this kid and hope he can make something of his NBA career. I followed his college career closely and hoped he would become a star but so far he's been a huge disappointment.
     
  22. James

    James Newbie

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    "NBA whistleblower Tim Donaghy?"

    Tim Donaghy is no "whistleblower" he's an NBA "criminal" and he served the prison time to prove it.
    Since Orlando was in the finals last year, obviously their team can get to a finals.
    How did the NBA arrange for Ron Artest to be in the right spot at the right time in game 5? How did they arrange for Kobe Bryant to make some of the most amazing shots over double teams that I've ever seen in game six?
     
  23. Westside

    Westside Hall of Famer

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    I thought the consiparcy theorists were relagated to the Happy Hour forum??
     
  24. bigunreal

    bigunreal Mentor

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    Tim Donaghy was indeed a whistleblower. And, like all whistleblowers, the company he blew the whistle on tried to demonize him and make it appear that he was an isolated case. Okay, believe what you want.

    As for Morrison, you think giving him halfway decent minutes for ONE season was a fair chance? Do you think most black players that are drafted that high are given that little time to produce? My point was, why did the Lakers trade for him and then NEVER give him a fair chance to play? Right, he doesn't understand their "complex" defense, the one that Mensa member Ron Artest does. What chance has Morrison had to play for the Lakers? He almost never dressed out all year. What kind of joke is that- to trade for a college superstar and then not even dress him out? He is not Brian Scalabrini.

    Anyhow, enjoy the finals. You can root for Gasol, and maybe "white friendly" Jackson will sprinkle another white in for a few minutes a game. Hey, maybe Scalabrini will dress out for the Celtics, and get you really fired up.

    I think we need to set our expectations a little higher than that.
     
  25. GiovaniMarcon

    GiovaniMarcon Mentor

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    Gasol is accepted in LA as a legitimate star, and not one of those players random DWFs say, "he's good for a white guy". Gasol is good, the end. Even the typical uneducated masses don't try to say he's pushed by the media so that there will be a white star, as is sometimes said (unfairly) about Dirk.

    Gasol is at least one white guy featured -- and celebrated -- very prominently in a sport where whites are unfairly relegated to also-ran benchwarmer status as of late, and that's a good thing.

    Having said all that, it's also sickening the way people punk on Vujacic and blame him for "almost losing" yesterday's game. How quickly people forget that crucial, 4th quarter 3-point bomb he nailed the game before to help save the game (the same game Artest nearly helped lose for LA).

    It's nice the way people are giving mad respect to both Nash and Dragic, but also sad that American-born Redick is blamed heavily for Orlando's losses, to an equal or even greater degree than Carter or Howard. It's like dude! He came off the bench...
     

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