Athletic Inheritance

ToughJ.Riggins

Hall of Famer
Joined
Nov 19, 2006
Messages
5,063
Location
Ontario Canada
I love relating genetics to sports because I'm Biology major. I hope I don't aggravate anyone by using this site for academic theories. This is politically incorrect to say, but it is my belief that Caucasians as a group have a more diversified gene pool than African Americans.

In my opinion West Africans, this is what the slaves were, had and still have a higher percentage of people in their numerous tribes that are fast than whites. If I remember correctly, much of the slave population came from a small area in West Africa. Most American slaves had originally been captured by other rival West African tribes and than sold to the Europeans.

I personally although I don't like to harp on it, believe somewhat in the Jimmy the Geek theory. I think that there was some selective breeding of slaves, maybe even slaves that were closely related. Slaves that had physical endurance and other athletic advantages like speed were much more likely to spread their genetic code to new offspring. This may have caused yet another ever so slight increase in the percentage of blacks in America that were fleet of foot compared to whites even though it went on for the most part for 200 years or so.

You may ask where I am going with this and how I am going to relate this to track. It's simple I believe that there are a higher percentage of African Americans that are athletic, but that the most athletic whites (and we have a much larger pool in America of whites to pick from) are just as athletic as blacks.

Unfortunately, there have been many evil deeds done over the issue of genetics, so it is a very touchy subject. There is still genocide that has taken place in the recent world (Kosovo and currently the disgusting crimes taking place in Sudan because of racism.)

In sports it is in my opinion simply a problem of stereotypes and stigmatism and as we've discussed cohesiveness of blacks as a group. You get a random group of blacks and a random group of whites together in the United States and race them there are going to be more black guys in the group that are fast than whites. However, in my studying of the issue you can see that the top whites are on par with blacks. Don Bebee is tied for being the fastest man in the history of the NFL with Deion. Apparently whites swept the high jump in the 2004 Olympics and took Gold and Bronze in 2000, so you can't say that the top white high jumpers are less talented than blacks. Jeremy Wariner in my opinion is the best 400 meter sprinter of all time because he is so dominant and I believe he is clean of performance enhancing drugs unlike so many other runners from our country's dominant past in Track and Field.

My analysis is based on spending time studying athletic data. Sure if you take one event like the 100 meters sure it's possible the top blacks are a little faster than the top whites. However, as has been discussed on this site there's a good chance that even most of them were on the juice. The recent Balco scandal was damaging to America's reputation in track and field. However, it leads me to believe it is nothing new to the history of American Track and Field. Why? Because if with all the resources being expended to stop cheating in track Americas top athletes were still able to go undetected through designer steroids, than it must have been even easier in the past. In the past less resources were being spent because there had been less scandals.

So going on I have looked at different athletic data and there are some differences in performance based on Nationalities and events. However, it is my belief that the differences are smaller than people would like to make you believe. And last but not least, I return to the issue of selective breeding. There have been different Caucasian groups that have attempted this also. Some of them were infamous like the Nazis and more recently the Russians, East Germany and other communist Eastern Europeans during the Cold War. If I recall correctly, from a documentary I saw on the history channel about sports during the Cold War, the Russians wanted to selectively breed superhumans to dominate the Olympics at the time, but their plans failed.

There are also many instances with whites just as much as black where two athletes meet through a mutual interest in sports. This is not done as a plotted method to build superhuman athletes but as Psycho-sexual selection. I would be willing to bet the farm that Andrei Agassi and Stephi Graf's kid if he takes up tennis would at least be good enough to play tennis at the Div. 1 college level. That is unless as a good friend of mine coined the expression there's "a gene skip." That's the excuse a friend of mine had for why both his parents, as while as five other closely related family members, either have a doctorate in science or are MD's. And him, he graduated with a 2.5 GPA in communications from an average college, go figure it's quite an anomaly!
 

white lightning

Hall of Famer
Joined
Oct 16, 2004
Messages
20,799
I for one agree with you.I am one of the few on this site and just about any other that believes that on a level playing field,whites can be just as fast or faster than blacks.We have so many more people in just this country alone.If we had hundreds of thousnds or even millions trying out for track,the results would be huge.Wariner & Rock are just two guys that support our case.Another factor is the mental one.Sprinting is as much mental as physical.Whites are beat down over and over.We are told that we cannot run as fast or jump as high & nowhere is it as bad as in America.Whites need to start believing in themselves like they did in the past.Anyone and any race can be beat!
 

ToughJ.Riggins

Hall of Famer
Joined
Nov 19, 2006
Messages
5,063
Location
Ontario Canada
Well, I certainly think that whites have shown that in the 60mtr, 200 mtr, 400mtr, 800mtr, highjump, triple jump and Decathalon they can be the best in the world. I do concede though that West African blacks may have a "slight" advantage in the Long Jump and 100 mtr. I also believe that Kenyans have a "slight" advantage in the mile and beyond. I'd be willing to bet though that if the United States had been beating the message through the heads of whites that they are faster (as we have with blacks) and juicing them up with the roids that the world would have seen a sub 10 white man by now. Alot of the problem is mental like you're saying. Edited by: ToughJ.Riggins
 

white is right

Hall of Famer
Joined
Feb 16, 2006
Messages
10,035
The white vertical myth is worse than the slow myth. The majority of the world class high jumpers are white. Yet if you go and play on any playground that stereotype holds fast. I truly think "roiding" works better on people of predominately West African ancestry for the century. Before steroids white sprinters were able to win major competitions. Now a white sprinter(in the century) hasn't finaled since 87'
smiley5.gif
 

white lightning

Hall of Famer
Joined
Oct 16, 2004
Messages
20,799
You must be talking over 100 meters because whites have won gold over 200 meters(Kenteris)and 400 meters(Wariner).
 

ToughJ.Riggins

Hall of Famer
Joined
Nov 19, 2006
Messages
5,063
Location
Ontario Canada
white is right said:
I truly think "roiding" works better on people of predominately West African ancestry for the century. Before steroids white sprinters were able to win major competitions. Now a white sprinter(in the century) hasn't finaled since 87'
smiley5.gif

Interesting theory: Drugs affect different groups differently. There are definite differences in different ethnic groups genetically. You can see it in different medical studies, like why whites don't get Sickle Cell Anemia or why alchohol has a much worse effect on Native Americans. Or in gender why Lupus is more common in women or Autism in men or Bipolar in Irish. Good post, I'd like you to tell me more about how whites were competitive in the 100mtr in the 1960's and earlier, because I don't want to look it up...I'm lazy.
 

white is right

Hall of Famer
Joined
Feb 16, 2006
Messages
10,035
white lightning said:
You must be talking over 100 meters because whites have won gold over 200 meters(Kenteris)and 400 meters(Wariner).
Century is another term for 100 meters.
 

nhl411

Guru
Joined
Dec 18, 2005
Messages
166
this is touched on a bit by the article iposted in media racism and stereotyping sincei didnt know where to put it. the guy points out that stupid test where some scientist compared muscle samples from kenyan runners and some country in europe's runners and found that kenya's runners had more mitochondria or something leading the scientist to believe that blacks were genetically inclined for runnning. the author of the article then refutes this by pointing out that another scientist tested kenyan runners again but this time versus the people who would be training in the same altitudes as kenyans: skiers from that same european country. surprise surprise, this time the results were the same leading to the conclusion that genetics wasn't it, it was kenya (or the mountains in general really)
 

Alpha Male

Mentor
Joined
May 22, 2005
Messages
775
Location
California
Whites just aren't as enthusiastic as blacks in track. Black parents also push their kids into sports at a rate of 7 times that of white parents (Northwestern University). When I run track, I see the black parents there with their children timing them in sprint and hurdles; where are the white parents?

However, I do see a resurgence in white interest in sprints there! Could Craig Pickering be having an effect on the psyche?
smiley32.gif
Edited by: Alpha Male
 

Maple Leaf

Mentor
Joined
Mar 19, 2006
Messages
883
Location
Ontario
I would say conclusively that whites have the most varied gene pool. This is so simple to prove a child can see it. Whites come in so many different sizes and body types, have many different colours of hair and eyes and noses and ears and all the appendages for that matter. Whites simply cannot be stereotyped like orientals, like indians, and yes, like africans. Africans have 1 hair colour and that is it. Enough on genes.

How many times does it have to be said, just what part of english do you not understand? Genes give a person an opportunity and the rest is up to what that person can and does make out of it. Obviously certain body types are better for certain activities: 7 foot tall makes a man a good potentially basketballer; a 5 foot tall man makes him a potentially good jockey or weight lifter.

My impression of the purpose of this site is to show that whites can do and are good at any sporting activity
they so chose. The beige intellectualizing that some people do with regard to race seems counterproductive to that goal.
 

Alpha Male

Mentor
Joined
May 22, 2005
Messages
775
Location
California
"Genes give a person an opportunity and the rest is up to what that person can and does make out of it."

And whites right now are not making the most out of it to say the least here in America's NFL and NBA...
Brainwashed whites combined with a fierce castesystem reinforced with media stereotypes and you have the demographics of the two major sports.
 

ToughJ.Riggins

Hall of Famer
Joined
Nov 19, 2006
Messages
5,063
Location
Ontario Canada
Maple Leaf said:
I would say conclusively that whites have the most varied gene pool. This is so simple to prove a child can see it. Whites come in so many different sizes and body types, have many different colours of hair and eyes and noses and ears and all the appendages for that matter. Whites simply cannot be stereotyped like orientals, like indians, and yes, like africans. Africans have 1 hair colour and that is it. Enough on genes.

I think genetics is an important argument. You can't only argue the nurture argument w/o arguing nature. And you're wrong that just b/c blacks all have brown eyes and black hair that it proves anything about overall genetic diversity; it is an issue of pigment. You can be alike in certain areas and very different in others. A South African Bushman, a Australian Aborigine, and a Kenyan, although all very dark, are very different b/c they haven't shared a common ancestor in recent history.

Skin color is often used to define race but is nothing to attach stigmas to. Skin color, eye color, and hair color evolved through Natural and Sexual selection and as a response to levels of absorption of Vitamin D. Dark skin blocks the sun better, but this will lead to a vitamin D deficiency if you aren't near the equator. Light skin does not block the sun as well and leads to increased production of vitamin D3, necessary for calcium absorption and bone growth which is beneficial in places with less sun.

I won't be starting any more genetics topics, but I get aggravated b/c I find that some on this site base their interpretation of nature based almost entirely on skin color. How similar we are does have to do with location and common ancestry, but different groups have been migrating and mixing and mingling forever. There are Sicilians with Arab ancestry from the Arab conquests, Irish with Spanish ancestry (dark Irish), cases of Ancient Egyptians mating with Nubians and Israelites. Different Native American tribes arranged political marriages. I have read about recent scientific studies that believe skin color changes much faster than people realize based on migration. It is always a case of nature and nurture. From now on I'm sticking solely to sports; I've already pissed too many people off, including fellow Ontarians. Lets keep the fighting to sports!
smiley18.gif
 

Maple Leaf

Mentor
Joined
Mar 19, 2006
Messages
883
Location
Ontario
The basic message is this: whatever your origin or race you are never going to make it to the top in ANY athletic endeavor unless you work extremely hard, period. Nobody, and I mean NO BODY, can get up off the couch at the age of 20 and sprint a 10 flat, or jump a 48" vertical, or bench press 500 pounds, or swim a 50m in 20. It just does not work like that. Everyone has to start young and work hard and practice all the time. And it should go without saying that one must be realistic and choose a persuit that best suits their body and use some common sense in doing so.

OPEN MESSAGE TO DARWINIAN LAPDOGS (Whomever, Wherever)

When was the last time anyone was able to document black offspring becoming lighter than their parents without the mixing with a lighter skinned person. Black people can reproduce what they already are and the same holds true for whites. Even if it happened once in a million, how could that one person out of one million start another race?
 

white is right

Hall of Famer
Joined
Feb 16, 2006
Messages
10,035
Maple Leaf said:
The basic message is this: whatever your origin or race you are never going to make it to the top in ANY athletic endeavor unless you work extremely hard, period. Nobody, and I mean NO BODY, can get up off the couch at the age of 20 and sprint a 10 flat, or jump a 48" vertical, or bench press 500 pounds, or swim a 50m in 20. It just does not work like that. Everyone has to start young and work hard and practice all the time. And it should go without saying that one must be realistic and choose a persuit that best suits their body and use some common sense in doing so.

OPEN MESSAGE TO DARWINIAN LAPDOGS (Whomever, Wherever)

When was the last time anyone was able to document black offspring becoming lighter than their parents without the mixing with a lighter skinned person. Black people can reproduce what they already are and the same holds true for whites. Even if it happened once in a million, how could that one person out of one million start another race?
You can't reproduce something different but your features can be attributed to a distant ancestor who maybe of a different ethnic or even racial group. There are many instances of white parents having a dark caucasian child, yet both parents are pale. You will see that in areas that were conquered by other ethnic groups and way back these people have traces of the foreigners blood.
 

jaxvid

Hall of Famer
Joined
Oct 15, 2004
Messages
7,247
Location
Michigan
white is right said:
You can't reproduce something different but your features can be attributed to a distant ancestor who maybe of a different ethnic or even racial group. There are many instances of white parents having a dark caucasian child, yet both parents are pale. You will see that in areas that were conquered by other ethnic groups and way back these people have traces of the foreigners blood.

Ah the distant non-white multi generational recessive gene! Favorite excuse of the white woman who brings a black kid home from the hospital to her white husband.

And white people CAN be made by black people according the great profit Elijah Muhammad, he taught that blacks were the first people of the Earth but had been tricked out of their power and oppressed by whites, who were a created by a scientist called Yakub.

And don't tell me that the story is BS, his "religion" just attracted 20 thousand devotees to fill up a stadium in Detroit.

Black skin may not be a "for certain" indicator of "nature" but it's a pretty good frickin' start.
 

white is right

Hall of Famer
Joined
Feb 16, 2006
Messages
10,035
jaxvid said:
white is right said:
You can't reproduce something different but your features can be attributed to a distant ancestor who maybe of a different ethnic or even racial group. There are many instances of white parents having a dark caucasian child, yet both parents are pale. You will see that in areas that were conquered by other ethnic groups and way back these people have traces of the foreigners blood.

Ah the distant non-white multi generational recessive gene! Favorite excuse of the white woman who brings a black kid home from the hospital to her white husband.

And white people CAN be made by black people according the great profit Elijah Muhammad, he taught that blacks were the first people of the Earth but had been tricked out of their power and oppressed by whites, who were a created by a scientist called Yakub.

And don't tell me that the story is BS, his "religion" just attracted 20 thousand devotees to fill up a stadium in Detroit.

Black skin may not be a "for certain" indicator of "nature" but it's a pretty good frickin' start.
Hey in My name is Earl she pulled that one off. I guess Earl must have had some Cartheginian blood in him.....
smiley36.gif
 

Bart

Hall of Famer
Joined
Feb 6, 2005
Messages
4,329
jaxvid said:
Black skin may not be a "for certain" indicator of "nature" but it's a pretty good frickin' start.


Well said, Jaxvid.
smiley32.gif
 
Joined
May 1, 2006
Messages
461
There was a stdy done in which people were shown a bare skull and asked to tell thr race of the skull. TEveyone in the study including the children could id the race over 90% in over 90% of the trials. zRace is definately more the skin deep.
 
G

Guest

Guest
ToughJ.Riggins said:
However, in my studying of the issue you can see that the top whites are on par with blacks. Don Bebee is tied for being the fastest man in the history of the NFL with Deion.


I think we like to believe that the top whites are equal to the top blacks where speed is concerned,but to be fair, that's just not the case. Don Bebee wasn'teven in the top 15. Bob Hayes was the fastest of all time, and Darrell Green and Bo Jackson were thefastest during Don Bebee's era.





Jeremy Wariner in my opinion is the best 400 meter sprinter of all time because he is so dominant and I believe he is clean of performance enhancing drugs unlike so many other runners from our country's dominant past in Track and Field.


Again, I think castefootball wants to believe Jeremy Wariner's better than Michael Johnson, but to actually say it is almost disrespectful. Michael has 16 of the fastest 25 times in history. Wariner has 1. Let's be fair.
 
G

Guest

Guest
ToughJ.Riggins said:
Well, I certainly think that whites have shown that in the 60mtr, 200 mtr, 400mtr, 800mtr, highjump, triple jump and Decathalon they can be the best in the world. I do concede though that West African blacks may have a "slight" advantage in the Long Jump and 100 mtr. I also believe that Kenyans have a "slight" advantage in the mile and beyond. I'd be willing to bet though that if the United States had been beating the message through the heads of whites that they are faster (as we have with blacks) and juicing them up with the roids that the world would have seen a sub 10 white man by now. Alot of the problem is mental like you're saying.


I thinkfor Castepurposes, people here want to believeblacks are "juicing", when there's not one shred of proof. Secondly, there are about 20 black guys in the past 3 years with multiple sub 6.60 races in the 60m. There's only 3 whites. I hardly call that a "slight" advantage.


In the 200, the numbers are at about thesame20 black guys to3 white guy ratio of sprinters under the20.32 threshhold in the 3post BALCO years.The top guys are a half second faster than the top white guys. I think that disparity is just too large to not conclude that, until proven otherwise, blacks are more genetically giftedsprinters.
 

PitBull

Guru
Joined
Oct 20, 2006
Messages
448
No drug use? Tim Montgomery, steroid cheat, hubby of Marion Jones,
steroid cheat, Justin Gatlin, Carl Lewis, Ben Johnson, Kelli White, Dwain
Chambers, etc. But no fire, White Hot, where there's so much smoke?
Whose chain do you think you're pulling? You're a clown. Go home. The
circus is leaving town, going back to Orlando. We all know now the sports
world has been drug crazy for the last 20-30 years, if not longer. Blacks are
the biggest group of cheaters and felons on the planet. Sports is no
different from real life. Stop living in a dream world. The word about the
Caste System is getting out. Thank God for the Internet.
 

robcat

Guru
Joined
Feb 18, 2005
Messages
239
Location
Indiana
White Hot should have been honest and picked the name Black Hot or maybe Black Hottentot. But trolls are never honest.
 

Maple Leaf

Mentor
Joined
Mar 19, 2006
Messages
883
Location
Ontario
White Hot (aka: walking dead):

You forgot to mention PARTICIPATION rates. Who do you think runs track anyway? Do we even need dopey statistics to repeat the obvious? Blacks flock to track, whites don't. In sports where whites do participate in large numbers (and where the playing field is not ARTIFICIALLY controlled) whites always excell. Surprised? Maybe you will understand it in your next life.

As for Warriner not having as many world record times as Johnson, it takes a fast field to make record times. But you know that already.
 
G

Guest

Guest
Maple Leaf said:
White Hot (aka: walking dead):

You forgot to mention PARTICIPATION rates. Who do you think runs track anyway? Do we even need dopey statistics to repeat the obvious? Blacks flock to track, whites don't. In sports where whites do participate in large numbers (and where the playing field is not ARTIFICIALLY controlled) whites always excell. Surprised? Maybe you will understand it in your next life.

As for Warriner not having as many world record times as Johnson, it takes a fast field to make record times. But you know that already.


I addressed that, and a lot of other things in my last post but it was deleted.Being new to the board, I guess I didn't realize we were censored if wedidn't agree with everything everyone else says. We outnumber blacks 6 to 1 in this country, and have MUCH more young athletes in EVERY sport than they do on the high school level across the country.. including track.They just get weeded out at each level. They get weeded out for a reason. If you want to sit there and play ignorant, by my guest. I don't need to pump myself up with nonsense to feel better about myself.


Do you even remember the Michael Johnson era? Do you rememberhow dominant he was, and how he used to eviscerate hiscompetition? Wariner's a great runner, but comparing him to Johnsonat this point in their respective careers isn't even worth the keystrokes.


This post will probably be deleted to, so it'll be my last.
 
Top