NFL Combine

RB LeSean McCoy of Pitt runs "in the 4.5 second range" at his pro day whatever that means, along with pathetic results of 8-11 in the broad jump and a 29 inch vertical, but of course still will "likely remain on the bubble of the first and second rounds" thanks to his black skin privilege.


http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/colleg e/s_616580.html

An 8-11 Broad Jump for a tailback is terrible. The broad jump is often used by guys like Tom Luginbill to claim that whites only have agility in the X-Y plane (indicated by the Vertical Jump and quasi-indicated by the short shuttle for one cut and burst ahead style running).

These ESPN vermin claim whites don't have the agility in the X-Z plane (for swivelness in tight spaces) and that loose hips allow for an explosive leg lift on the broad jump.

First of all I don't think this makes much sense anyway (the 3-cone is also a good indicator of hip-flexibility) and we already know Luginbill is a Marxist pathological liar.

Secondly although black prospects usually slightly outperform whites in the broad-jump "on average", there are always guys like McCoy who do terrible, but excuses are made for them.Edited by: ToughJ.Riggins

BTW: Listed at DE Connor Barwin and Chris Long (last year) and FB Brannan Southerland as well made 10 feet in the Broad Jump. I guess Large white men aren't all big oafs like the ESPN vermin try to say. These guys way outdid McCoy and all have at least 35 pounds or more on him.Edited by: ToughJ.Riggins

there are quite a few players coming out of oklahoma that are way overrated. Robinson, Loadholt, pettigrew, the list goes on.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/09078/956765-143.stm

This article about A.Q. Shipley, Penn State's standout center, says it all about how the NFL discriminates against white players. Shipley has done everything right-from his workouts to the impressive "body of work" his career comprises, yet there are still many questions in the minds of scouts; ones we don't see from them concerning the black sumos-whose main advantages are being black and fat.

"Shipley might be the toughest, most fundamentally sound football player Penn State is offering to the NFL this year," said Rob Rang, senior analyst for NFLDraftScout.com.

Shipley had an impressive showing on the bench press at the combine, putting up 33 reps on the 225-pound bar. He also scored a well-above-average 40 out of 50 on the Wonderlic intelligence test.

"His film speaks for itself," said Metz, a graduate of Gateway High School and Penn State. "Every NFL line coach that you talk to says, 'Gosh, I wish this kid was a couple of inches taller. I wish his arm length were an inch longer.'

"But they also say, `You know what, there's no one better on tape.' At the end of the day, that's all that matters."

Yes, the tape of his on-field performance should be all that matters, and not the measuring tape put around parts of his body by the scouts.

yeah alot of fans are insisting he wont be good because his arms need to be two inches longer. quotes like "i dont know why, but history shows that shorter arms allows the defensive tackles to get free quicker"

yeah kind of like that guy Jeff Saturday who was said to have too short of arms....Edited by: dwid

03/17/09 - Boise State Pro day: The other player that merits a second look at Boise is WR Vinny Perretta. The diminutive receiver (5-9 1/4, 186 pounds) had an exceptional workout and showed that he deserves a chance, despite his lack of size. He ran a 4.48 and 4.43 in the 40, had a 36-inch vertical jump, a 10-foot, 6-inch broad jump, a 4.09 short shuttle, a 6.63 three-cone drill and put up 14 bench press reps. - Gil Brandt, NFL.com

My take: Vinny Perretta shows that NFLdraftscout.com under-ranks him as their 77th best WR with a brilliant workout at his Pro day. Will the DWFs ask: "why are all these fast white men not considered worthy by the draft "gurus"?"

Perretta put up good enough numbers for Boise State to get a look as a 7th round pick or priority FA, if he were black IMO with his great measurables.

Perretta had 578 receiving yards with a long of 73 yards. And this was his first year getting significant playing time for the Broncos, so he has "upside". Vinny Perretta can blaze the field!

Vinny Perretta is White?
man thats a player i missed then, i have to get some Boise State footage

Knowshon Moreno runs a 4.62 average at Georgia's Pro Day.
With that kind of speed, he should be Peyton Hillis's backup at fullback for the Broncos.

"It's not too slow," ESPN draft analyst Todd McShay said. "There have been great backs before him that have been in that ball park. Emmitt Smith didn't run exceptionally well and he turned out to have a pretty good career."

DD.comment: Very strange 40 times for Moreno, considering Georgia is noted for having a fast track. Our source (N.F.C. team) had the tailback running in the 4.59 to 4.61 area at the N.F.L. combine, which is considered a slower track? For example, our data has Asher Allen in 4.54 to 4.56 range in Indy, but he blazed the track in Athens today? Our guess is Moreno is so highly regarded by scouts, that he will slip no farther than the early part of two, even with workout results (on a noted fast track) that would get some prospects shifted to fullback... Also, just for the record, Mohamed Massaquoi ran 4.56 & 4.62 in Indy, so it will be interesting to see how much faster he ran on the Bulldogs' swift track?
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My Take: Again, ESPN turds will make the excuses, but Draftdaddy again tells it like it is. If Knowshon were white he likely wouldn't have started at Georgia and even if he did he would drop down to at least the end of the 2nd round. This is even with his great numbers in college.

Jacob Hester was close in performance to Knowshon in the SEC when you consider the entire picture, but Hester wasn't picked till the 3rd round after running a 4.6 flat. Hester currently is being made a battering blocker for the Chargers.

Julian Edelman shined for Kent State during last week's "Pro Day" at Kent State, as he tried to show NFL scouts he can make the transition from quarterback to wide receiver.

Edelman's times of 3.91 seconds in the short shuttle and 10.74 in the long-shuttle would have been the fastest times recorded at the NFL combine in February, regardless of position.

Edelman's 40-yard dash time of 4.51 seconds was comparable to the time Josh Cribbs recorded in Las Vegas following his senior season. Cribbs, who went from quarterback at Kent State to wide receiver and Pro Bowl return specialist with the Cleveland Browns, is the standard to follow for a former college quarterback trying to earn an undrafted free-agent contract to compete for a job at another position with an NFL team.

Edelman has been working out with former University of Akron quarterback Charlie Frye at the Zips' indoor practice facility.

My take: I see Edelman as a potential RB if things were fair or even a Michael Vick type QB (without the hatred of dogs of course). Edelman isn't the best thrower, but can make magic happen with his legs. Edelman would probably be "a little" more accurate than Vick IMO in the Pros, but I believe Draftdaddy and other sources have questioned his arm strength. Vick's arm strength was never in question, but scouts should have questioned his accuracy.

This guy should be on every team's radar as a late round pick and possible RB candidate if QB doesn't work out. I think Edelman certainly would be on the NFL radar if he were black.

TJR: The Steelers have used high draft choices in recent years on converted QBS like Hines Ward and Antwaan Randle-El with success.

So I wonder if the team would have interest in Julian Edelman after your write-up about him. I'm sure they would with different skin pigmentation.

The short shuttle and long shuttle times for Edelman that you posted speak volumes about his athletic ability. Here's hoping that someone gives him a legitimate chance in a few months.

Dwid, you seem to have access to many videos, could you make a highlight of Edelman? I'd be much interested in seeing him in action, thanks

Gi-15 said:

Dwid, you seem to have access to many videos, could you make a highlight of Edelman? I'd be much interested in seeing him in action, thanks

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i can try, but it might be hard to find kent state footage. but i will do my best to when i get a chance

see if you guys notice the commonthread in this piece on Pro Day "risers."


With the NFL draft fast approaching we turn our attention away from the combine and squarely to the series of team sponsored ¡°Pro Days¡± held around the country. While not holding the same weight or even objectivity as a that of the combine, a successful pro day can factor in significantly in improving the draft status of a prospect, especially in cases of players who find themselves ¡°on the bubble¡± in terms of whether or not they¡¯ll be drafted. The following players have distinguished themselves during the past month or so of pro day activities, and should more than benefit from the numbers they¡¯ve put up in front of NFL Scouts. Video highlights (where applicable) can be found by clicking on the prospect names.

RB LaRod Stephens Howling, Pittsburgh: It¡¯s become clich¨¦ to describe any shortish running back with above average strength and great speed as ¡°reminding me of Maurice-Jones Drew,¡± but we¡¯re going to save the more obscure references for another day and say that Stephens Howling (henceforth know as LSH) reminds us of the former De La Salle prep star. Howling, who has been overshadowed the past two years at Pittsburgh with the ascendance of LeSean McCoy, may have even outdone his Panther teammate at Pitt¡¯s recent pro day, running a 4.41 40-yard dash and putting up 18 reps at the bench press despite ¡°tweaking¡± a hamstring during an earlier workout. While he¡¯s by no means going to overtake McCoy in terms of draft stock, the performance should solidify his status as an NFL ready utility back who brings not only versatility to the position, but some serious athletic measurables.


TE Zach Miller, Nebraska-Omaha: Our friends at DraftDaddy.com have long been touting Miller as one of the biggest sleeper tight ends in this year¡¯s class, and after a successful pro day it finally looks like the rest of the country is starting to catch on. Miller, who at 6-4, 233-lbs already has the body of an NFL ready tight end, ran a 4.53 40-yard dash in front of several NFL scouts and coaches to include Jaguars position coach Mike Tice. Not only did Miller impress in the 40-yard dash, but the former Maverick posted an impressive 37.5-inch vertical leap, 4.22 short shuttle, and 7.06 second three-cone drill time. Not too shabby for a guy who played quarterback for a Division II program.


QB/WR Julian Edelman, Kent State: It¡¯s not often that a major college football team asks their starting quarterback to also return punts, but that was exactly the case this past season for the California native and former Golden Flashes quarterback, who worked out this week as a wide receiver for NFL scouts. At 6¡ä0, 198 pounds Edelman has prototypical size for an NFL flanker receiver, and showed off an above average 4.51 40-yard dash at the Kent state pro day. What was most impressive about his performance however was his quickness, as the former option-style quarterback posted an insane 3.91 second short shuttle time and 10.71 second long shuttle run. If eight 100 yard plus rushing performances as a senior at Kent State hadn¡¯t convinced scouts of his athletic ability, Edelman¡¯s pro day performance surely did.


RB Devin Moore, Wyoming: No player has capitalized more from being a combine snub than Moore (childish pun obviously intended, by the way) who has now featured his explosive speed and quickness at both a ¡°personal¡± pro day and a team sponsored event. At Wyoming¡¯s Pro Day this past week Moore clocked in between 4.3 and 4.35 in the 40-yard dash, while at the same time putting up a ridiculous 28 bench press reps and a 4.06 second short shuttle. While it¡¯s tough the view these numbers as canon law considering the venue, our friends at DraftDaddy.com remind us that the performance is consistent with what scouts have on file from Moore, who¡¯ll likely be one of the hottest ¡°sleeper¡± picks going into draft day.


DT Ty Steinkuhler, Nebraska: Known to many only by relation to his famous Husker father, Steinkuhler broke through as a senior in Lincoln last year under the direction of Bo Pelini and his aggressive defensive scheme. While overshadowed by fellow Husker tackle Ndamukong Suh, the younger Steinkuhler posted impressive physical numbers at Nebraska¡¯s pro day for his 6-4, 283-lb frame. Steinkuhler ran the 40 in 4.9 seconds while also displaying a 4.56 second short shuttle run and 23 reps on the bench press. Still somewhat of a ¡°raw¡± prospect, NFL teams will likely be attracted to Steinkuhler¡¯s athleticism as draft day nears.


DE/OLB Nick Reed, Oregon: Despite fantastic production during his career at Oregon, the Pac-10¡¯s all-time sack leader was a noticeable combine snub this past February in Indianapolis, and was being heavily dogged by questions of how he would project onto the next level. For many scouts, it seemed as though the 6-1, 245-lb Reed just wouldn¡¯t be athletic enough to fit into an NFL scheme. Yet Reed answered questions about his athletic ability at Oregon¡¯s pro day, running the 40-yard dash in 4.71 seconds while also recording a 4.27 short shuttle time and a very impressive 24 bench press reps. Expect his performance to increase his stock dramatically.

LB Brian Toal, Boston College: The former high school tailback was one of the hottest names at outside linebacker just a few short years ago, but two years of nearly constant injuries derailed what would have otherwise been a stellar career for the Eagles. While he lacks ideal size by NFL standards, Toal showed off enough athleticism (coming off of a broken fibula, no less) to potentially earn his way onto an NFL team. At BC¡¯s recent pro day, Toal ran the 40-yard dash in the mid 4.6 range, showed off a 37.5-inch vertical, and managed a very impressive 7.03 second three cone drill time. With that kind of athleticism and an already established work ethic, Toal¡¯s versatility as an athlete will be a major plus for NFL teams moving forward.


Eric Peterman, Northwestern: Partially due to the system in which he played in at Northwestern, the former Wildcat speedster has always been misdiagnosed as a ¡°possession" type target who had little, if any, NFL future. Yet Peterman stole the show at Northwester¡¯s recent pro day, clocking in an impressive 4.45 in the 40-yard dash to prove the skeptics wrong. While he¡¯s not likely to be confused with Jeremy Maclin anytime soon, Peterman¡¯s show of speed was enough to convince one at least one NFL scout that Peterman had ¡°run himself into the draft.¡±

once again, DraftDaddy points out the obvious.

Yesterday, Gil Brandt of NFL.com briefly mentioned the outstanding Pro Day numbers posted by ex-Indiana wide receiver Andrew Means, who is also a major league baseball prospect. A few days ago we got some of his Pro Day numbers from a scout (N.F.C. team):


Height- 6.10


Weight - 215


Bench - 18 reps


40 YD - 4.33 was fastest / 4.37 was slowest. No one in attendance had him higher than a 4.37.


LCone - 6.73


DD.comment: Means' next door neighbor growing up was Indianapolis wide receiver Anthony Gonzalez. The two are still very good friends, so we'd assume Andrew would love to play for the Colts. We have sources close to Means and have been told many <A id=AdBriteInlineAd_times style="BACKGROUND: url(http://s.adbrite.com/mb/images/green-double-underline-006600.gif) repeat-x 50% bottom; MARGIN-BOTTOM: -2px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 2px; CURSOR: pointer; COLOR: #006600; TEXT-DECORATION: none" target=_top keyword="times" display="inline">times</A> that he wants to play pro football first, so any team that picks him next month won't have to compete with the Cincinnati Reds to sign him.

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if you've not picked it up, almost every single "surprise" that has jumped off the table at various Pro Days have been white athletes we've been pointing out. white athletes are as good, if not better, than their black peers. period. and the numerous results we've documented illustrate that fact, over and over.


all white athletes need is a chance. and only something asinsidious as the Caste System prevents them from getting it.

So is Means completely white? Has anyone been able to determine?

does it really matters?

Means looked to me at the Combine like a light skinned black. He reminds me a bit of Billy Miller the very light skinned black TE. It does matter because if he makes the NFL he'll be considered a black receiver, like Lance Moore, James Thrash, Eric Parker, etc. But he might be white; some people thought Babe Ruth was part black because of his broad nose. Guess we'll find out if he makes the NFL because there's not a lot of info on him out there right now.





Edited by: Don Wassall

he looks white to me...







additional circumstantial evidence is that he grew up in the same neighborhood with Anthony Gonzalez and is best friends with the Colts' wideout, he played college baseball in Indiana, and the lack of "buzz" from the NFL toward this athlete despite his obvious speed.

but the crowning point of evidence is that the above photo wasn't accompanied by a single reference to a "room-brightening smile." therefore, it's obvious he's a white man. Edited by: Jimmy Chitwood

I'm seeing Alex Mack and Eben Britton appearing in the first round in more and more mock drafts. Although this year's Draft has looked like a disaster from a demographic perspective,the first roundmay turn out to be better than most in recent years. Usually five or six whites get drafted in the first round, max. Stafford and Sanchez, the three white LBs, Mack and Britton, and Connor Barwin all could go in the first round next month.

Sleeper: Nebraska-Omaha TE Zach Miller

No player has come farther on the 2009 draft board -- or has greater upside -- than Nebraska-Omaha tight end Zach Miller.

Miller was recruited by Nebraska as an option quarterback in 2003 but when coach Frank Solich was fired after that season, Miller also left. He enrolled at Nebraska-Omaha in 2005 and wound up starting three seasons at quarterback. He rushed for 1,000 yards in 2006, passed for 1,000 yards in 2007, and passed and rushed for 1,000 yards apiece in 2008. He scored 18 touchdowns last season and finished up as UNO's all-time leading scorer with 50 TDs and 306 points.

Miller was invited to play in the Cactus Bowl -- the post-season Division II all-star game -- but there was a catch. He was invited as a tight end, where NFL scouts thought he might have a future. After spending less than a month at the position and only one week of practice, Miller caught five passes for 116 yards in the Cactus Bowl.

Miller was not invited to the scouting combine so NFL coaches and scouts flocked to his campus workout this month. He didn't disappoint. Miller put on 17 pounds from his college playing weight, bulking up to 233 for the change of position, and ran a 4.53 40-yard dash. He also flashed his athleticism with a vertical jump of 37 1/2 inches. None of the 19 tight ends invited to the combine could match his 40 or vertical.

Scouts compare him to another Nebraska product with a similar build and athleticism -- Jay Novacek, who played his high school ball in Gothenburg. Miller is from Wahoo.

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at 6-4, with a tremendous vertical leap, and running in the mid-4.5s, what an imposing downfield threat Miller would provide in the passing game. not surprisingly however, no mention has been made whatsoever of this tremendous athlete playing wide receiver.

the Caste System continues...Edited by: Jimmy Chitwood

I guess this years freak white athlete is Barwin. I am quite surprised few whites put up very elite numbers this year. Cushing was expected to run much faster but he will still be a very high pick. I guess there were no Tim Shaw's this year.

according to yahoo Andrew Means ran a 4.36 40 and looked really well.

green fire317 said:

according to yahoo Andrew Means ran a 4.36 40 and looked really well.

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Yes but I highly doubt that Andrew Means is 100% white. From looking at his picture he looks at least a quarter black. At this point I don't consider him a white athlete.